15-01-2004 02:06									#1
	We Must Take Unilateral Action Remove this text

Or So Dean said about Serbia



Politics is so very funny.


http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS...snia/index.html

quote: But in 1995, Dean urged President Clinton to use American warplanes to support the embattled Bosnian Muslim government during that country's three-year civil war, according to a letter published Wednesday in USA Today. Campaign spokesman Jay Carson said Wednesday that Dean opposed the Iraq war "because it was the wrong war at the wrong time, not because he believes military force should never be used." Carson told CNN that Dean believes the United States should "always strive to act multilaterally." In 1995, he told Clinton that it was "no longer possible" to act in conjunction with the NATO allies or the United Nations, and "I have reluctantly concluded that we must take unilateral action." The civil war among Bosnia's Muslim, Croat and Serb populations was Europe's bloodiest conflict since the end of World War II, and Dean said the United States risked its moral credibility if it did not take action there. Eventually, NATO did launch airstrikes against Serb forces besieging the capital, Sarajevo, and a U.S.-brokered peace treaty was signed later that year.

	15-01-2004 02:18									#2
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Poor ideological Dean. Why would the US ever step out of its way to help a Muslim country?

	15-01-2004 02:29									#3
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He called Clark a republican Guess the chances of a Dean Clark or a Clark Dean ticket is getting dim

	15-01-2004 02:31									#4
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To be sure, Dean's position is that unitlateral action is necessary only if the war is otherwise justified and the UN or Nato refuses to act.

	15-01-2004 02:33									#5
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Dean is a *$^*%& idiot. When I say that I'm thinking mainly about his economic "ideas".

	15-01-2004 02:33									#6
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IIRC Bush approved of the actions against Serbia as well against the prevailing opinion of most conservatives.

	15-01-2004 02:37									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Sprayber IIRC Bush approved of the actions against Serbia as well against the prevailing opinion of most conservatives.

Possibly. However, Bush campaigned on the philosophy that interventions were not a good idea -- referencing Kosovo, IIRC.

It looks like Dean's and Bush's positions have flipped.

	15-01-2004 02:41									#8
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quote: Originally posted by Ned Possibly. However, Bush campaigned on the philosophy that interventions were not a good idea -- referencing Kosovo, IIRC. It looks like Dean's and Bush's positions have flipped.

I know what he campaigned on but CNN showed an interview where he said he supported what was done there.

	15-01-2004 02:44									#9
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Like MTG said in another thread, no one campaigns supporting going to war or taking action. It's easy to critize something your opponant or predessor has done but when your in charge things begins to look different.

	15-01-2004 02:45									#10
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We must take unilateral action to prevent shortages of carbonated beverages in our nation's supermarkets.

	15-01-2004 02:48									#11
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quote: Originally posted by monkspider We must take unilateral action to prevent shortages of carbonated beverages in our nation's supermarkets.

Drink iced tea.

	15-01-2004 02:50									#12
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quote: Originally posted by Sprayber Drink iced tea.

Good advice.

	15-01-2004 03:01									#13
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You know things are bad for Dean when a poll done by the chicago tribune shows that he would lose Illinois to Bush if the election was tomorrow. Illinois going republican in a presidential election is not normal these days.

	15-01-2004 03:22									#14
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Dean has been getting immensely negative press for about a month- I don;t see any other cadidate having every single thing they said scrutanized as completely-none of the other dems, certainly not Bush. NO wonder his numbers are down.

As for the comment-

Notice how he state we should strive to be unilateral- strive does not mean all the time, it means we should make it the regular tool- in 1995 he felt that was no longer an option (remembering the war begun in '91, and was a hot topic all of 93 and 94) after years of deliberating action. Compare that with Iraq and Bush's drive for multilateralism (all 4 months of it...).

Of course, that annalysis does not fit into a coy soundbite, so it will fall by the wayside.

	15-01-2004 03:33									#15
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GePap, I think Dean meant unilateral in that they US should act alone if justice required taking action. I don't think Bush has ever gone that far. I am sure that he would have backed off if he lost Britains supports. I read Dean's position is that we needed to act even if we were alone.

	15-01-2004 03:44									#16
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quote: Originally posted by Ned GePap, I think Dean meant unilateral in that they US should act alone if justice required taking action. I don't think Bush has ever gone that far. I am sure that he would have backed off if he lost Britains supports. I read Dean's position is that we needed to act even if we were alone.

NO, Bush was very clear that the US was willing to go at it alone, period. Brits or no Brits. Whether he would have acted politically in such a manner? quesitonable.

Again, Dean has said the US should strive for multilateral action- he has never said that precluded or excluded the posibility of unilateral action if all other means were exhausted. Bush in no way exhausted all means, specially if you take into account the disingenoues arguements he presented the international community. The press present this statement as some proof Dean is flip-floping. Read it carefully and you see it is not. But of course, reading carefully is a lost art. I don;t always read carefully, but at least I try. Sadly, a lot of the press doesn;t even try anymore.

	15-01-2004 04:04									#17
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What is Dean's position, then, on Iraq?

1) That unilateral action was not justified; or
2) that multilateral action was still possilble; or
3) No action was required, and that Saddam should have stayed in power?

	15-01-2004 04:15									#18
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Dean's position is clear

When intervention is justified

1) pursue action through the UN or NATO; and
2) if that fails after resonable attempts, pursue a US lead intervention (with a coalition if one can be formed.)

So, what is the basis for Dean's criticism of Iraq?

	15-01-2004 04:33									#19
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Dean definetly has a bad case of foot-in-mouth-itus, doesn't he?

	15-01-2004 04:38									#20
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Well duh -- but try telling Chegitz that.

	15-01-2004 04:38									#21
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Banging my head against walls isn't something I like to do, Mr. Fun.

	15-01-2004 04:43									#22
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Banging my head against walls isn't something I like to do, Mr. Fun.

If that were the case, wouldn't you have me on ignore?

	15-01-2004 04:51									#23
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If Dean's position is that the war to remove Saddam was not justified and not legal, he should call for an immediate restoration of Saddam to power and a pullout of US forces.

	15-01-2004 05:00									#24
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I keep saying...if Dean gets the nomination, America is screwed no matter which way it turns.

Sorry

	15-01-2004 05:10									#25
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It would be swell if we could all get behind Kuchinich, but hey, you win some, you lose some.

	15-01-2004 05:13									#26
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Yeah, then we could really have a wacko in the White House, ms .

	15-01-2004 05:15									#27
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Yeah, then we could really have a wacko in the White House, ms .

But the reptilebeings from Planet Zarkon said that their going to vote for him.....

	15-01-2004 05:16									#28
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Yeah, then we could really have a wacko in the White House, ms .

Wackos are our only hope.

	15-01-2004 05:18									#29
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Unfortunetly Perot isn't running.

	15-01-2004 05:23									#30
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Gephardt gave a speach today in Iowa noting all the inconsistencies between Dean's former positions and his current positions and accused him of at least being insincere.

It was the best speech I have ever heard Gephardt make. He does have some passion down there and is not completely boring.