16-01-2004 22:19									#1
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Hey I heard that you can use a leader to rush wonders. Although I cant figure out what to do to make this happen I cant find the option to do this.

Also I do know how to make the army but what mix of troops should I use and is there a way to unload the troops from the army and add new ones.

	16-01-2004 22:38									#2
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Only Scientific Great Leaders can rush the Great Wonders.

Military Great Leaders can rush Minor Wonders and your normal city improvements. They also build Armies.

Once you have a unit in an Army, it is stuck there (no upgrading possible). You can add units to an Army when ever you want until the Army is full.

As far as what type of mix of units to have in an Army goes, it all depends on what you want to use the Army for. I myself normally build a pure Knight Army or a pure Cavalry Army, or the best (as far as I'm concerned) is the pure Tank Army...but some players also like to add a defensive unit into the mix.

	16-01-2004 22:40									#3
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quote: Originally posted by Wittlich As far as what type of mix of units to have in an Army goes, it all depends on what you want to use the Army for. I myself normally build a pure Knight Army or a pure Cavalry Army...so some players also like to add a defensive unit into the mix.

WHOA!!! Careful there: Never mix a defensive slowmover into a fastmover Army.

Check here:

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...?threadid=46197

	16-01-2004 22:43									#4
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That's my philosophy too Theseus, but for some reason some players insist on adding a slower moving defensive unit into the mix.

	16-01-2004 23:43									#5
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techbota it should be pointed out the CivIII and PTW only have one great leader type. Then the leader can rush any building or create an army (if you have 4 cities for each army).

In C3C that was changed to have two tyes of leaders as Wittlich said. The value of an army is higher in C3C than the others as they have been improved, see the thread on armies.

	16-01-2004 23:44									#6
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Thanx for the info. How is the easiest way to get a scientific leader and do they have any other uses other than rushing wonders?

	16-01-2004 23:50									#7
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To get a scientific great leader you have to be the first to finish research on a new technology (any technology that hasn't been finished by anyone else before you get there) and then hope you get lucky. I think the percentage chance is 3% (though someone correct me if I'm wrong).

Secondary usage for the SGL is to boost science production for 20 turns. But that isn't nearly as good as rushing a great wonder (well, actually that depends on the wonder I suppose ).

	17-01-2004 03:25									#8
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i believe that SGL's are not allowed to rush wonders in some or all of the scenarios.

	17-01-2004 04:06									#9
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The rules I mentioned are for epic games only. Scenarios can be customized to who knows what.

AFAIK you are correct it is 3% for non scientific civs and IIRC it is 5 or 6% for scientific ones. IOW it is not common to get one.

	17-01-2004 04:13									#10
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I've never had one yet.

	17-01-2004 04:32									#11
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Nor I.

	17-01-2004 05:41									#12
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I had just built an army, put a unit into it, and then got counter attacked and it was killed.

	17-01-2004 06:00									#13
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Once, and once only, I got a leader from defensive combat. He was immediately captured and executed. By the French. The French!

The shame of it...

	17-01-2004 06:02									#14
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I'm playing as Byzantium on emperor and have gotten two sci's so far. Unfortunately they were both in the modern age. And I'm about an entire age ahead of the nearest competitors

	17-01-2004 06:02									#15
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I have had SGL, but I have also had games that I did not get one.

chegitz guevara if you mean literally one unit, then you are living dangerously. I will do that for an attack to get the Epic after dropping a unit to 1HP. Even that is risky.

	17-01-2004 07:23									#16
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quote: Originally posted by vmxa1 I have had SGL, but I have also had games that I did not get one. chegitz guevara if you mean literally one unit, then you are living dangerously. I will do that for an attack to get the Epic after dropping a unit to 1HP. Even that is risky.

I second vmxa1's opinion unless you were in a desperate situation in which maybe losing the army was better than risking losing...?

	17-01-2004 17:09									#17
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An army with one unit in it... that would mean the only bonus is an extra move point, unless the attack/or defense was worth 6+, or 4+ and you had the Military Academy, wouldn't it? All that extra C3C potency gone, unless you wanted to pillage a few squares to death more than you wanted an army.

	29-01-2004 23:23									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Rhothaerill Secondary usage for the SGL is to boost science production for 20 turns. But that isn't nearly as good as rushing a great wonder (well, actually that depends on the wonder I suppose ).

Hmm...can you boost science production for 19 turns and then rush a wonder? Just wondering...

	30-01-2004 00:45									#19
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quote: Originally posted by Hermann the Lombard Hmm...can you boost science production for 19 turns and then rush a wonder? Just wondering...

Nope. Once the SGL is used for one thing or the other, it's gone.

Hmm, just saw the wink smiley. Perhaps you weren't looking for an answer, but oh well.

	30-01-2004 17:19									#20
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I've had some Scientific Leaders in my games, perhaps 5 in a month of playing.

Is there a chance to get Scientific Leaders if you get a tech from a hut?

	30-01-2004 19:32									#21
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A couple people have done some pretty extensive testing (I think vmxa1 was one of them), and it appears that the answer is no, you can not get an SGL from a tech earned from a goodie hut.

	30-01-2004 19:56									#22
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Did we ever confirm that you cannot get a SGL if you have an existing MGL?

	30-01-2004 20:06									#23
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I think I've had one of each at the same time, but I may remember wrong.

	30-01-2004 20:09									#24
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quote: Originally posted by Chemical Ollie I think I've had one of each at the same time, but I may remember wrong.

Thanks for clearing that up.

	30-01-2004 20:17									#25
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It has been reported that you can have a SGL and a MGL at the same time. I have not done that personally, since my leaders don't tend to sit around long.

-Arrian

	30-01-2004 21:06									#26
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I wonder if GA and a scientific discovery age from a SGL stack properly or if that's bugged too.

	30-01-2004 22:06									#27
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quote: Originally posted by jimmytrick Did we ever confirm that you cannot get a SGL if you have an existing MGL?

Yes you can have both and can even have more than one SGL and an MGL.

I have only had MGL and SGL at the same time though.

	31-01-2004 02:50									#28
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quote: Originally posted by Rhothaerill Hmm, just saw the wink smiley. Perhaps you weren't looking for an answer, but oh well.

Actually, I was looking for an answer, but I would have bet money that I knew the answer (and I would have won).

While we're on the topic...I know that promotion is less likely when fighting barbs. I would think the same is true of generating an MGL. In my very limited experience I have *never* seen a GL from combat with barbs. It also sounds like defensive combat is a poor source of GLs.

	31-01-2004 02:55									#29
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You cannot create MGL form barbs. You can get promotions to Vet and elite, but that is it.

	05-02-2004 23:12									#30
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quote: Originally posted by vmxa1 You cannot create MGL form barbs. You can get promotions to Vet and elite, but that is it.

Thanks. Finally got two MGL by using a militaristic civ, but it sure doesn't look like I'm getting 1 per 8 elite victories, as I once read. Maybe that got reduced along the way.