31-01-2004 03:03									#1
	Mobilization help! Full PM-box? Change here!

Mobilization: How does it work? What does it do? Is it worthwhile?

I'm sure there are threads on this already, but I can't get the search to return any threads with the word mobilization in either the thread title or in posts (despite there being a thread that mentions mobilization right now in the conquests forum).

Does mobilization make unit production cheaper? Does it allow more drafting of citizens? What are the downsides to mobilization? How long does mobilization last? (do I have to 'un-mobilize' when I'm through with the current crisis?) Is mobilization only available in certain governments? I know it's there in Democracy, and I'm fairly sure it isn't available in Despotism, for example.

Thanks in advance for any and all help with this. I've been staring at that mobilization button for some time now but have never understood what the cost/benifit is to using it, so I've never clicked it.

	31-01-2004 03:33									#2
	Re: Mobilization help! Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: Originally posted by cracky Mobilization: How does it work? What does it do? Is it worthwhile? Does mobilization make unit production cheaper? Does it allow more drafting of citizens? What are the downsides to mobilization? How long does mobilization last? (do I have to 'un-mobilize' when I'm through with the current crisis?) Is mobilization only available in certain governments?

Available for all governments after discovery of Nationalism.

To start mobilization, switch to it on the F1 screen. (Where it shows mobilization: normalcy/war time).

Effects: all city tiles that produce at least one shield will produce an extra one (just like in Golden Age) but only if you are building military units.

During mobilization you can only build units, certain buildings, and certain (military) Wonders. Allowed buildings are barracks, walls, harbors, airports and maybe few others (anything military-related). You can also buils workers, settlers (iirc), and transports. You only get a shield bonus when building units with attack value >= 1. Ie although you can build a harbor you will not receive any bonus shields.

You cannot build anything else during mobilization (although your cities could finish their current projects whatever they are). No temples, libraries, etc. Culture production is halved during mobilisation.

Mobilization automatically ends when at least one of your current wars is resolved. If you start mobilization during peacetime, you need to declare at least one war and resolve it (either through peace treaty or civ destruction). If you are at several wars simultaneously, concluding any peace treaty will immediately end mobilization (altough you can immediately hit mobilization button again).

No effects on draft rate, war weariness, etc.

Pros: allows to crank out cavalry really fast (as if you are in a Golden Age).

Cons: you cannot rush any culture/happiness buildings in conquered cities so culture flips/civil disorder are a bit more problematic.

Most useful (imo) for quick wars of agression. Start mobilization in advance to crank out military, rip apart your victim, and you are out of it. Not as useful for long drawn-out conflicts as build restrictions may become problematic.

	31-01-2004 03:39									#3
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cracky, I don't know the full story, but I can let you in on some of the details.

I think it becomes available w/ Nationalizm.

Mobilization can only be 'triggered' while you're at war w/ someone. I think it provides 1 extra shield per square that's already producing at least 1--kinda like a Golden Age.

However, it differs from a Golden Age in some VERY important ways. You can ONLY build military units/improvements while Mobilized. Any cities currently building anything non-military when you Mobilize will finish that project (w/o the Mobilization help) and can then-on ONLY produce military-related builds i.e. Units, Barracks, SAM Batteries, and I think Harbors and Airports. You can't start any Great Wonders while Mobilized--I think even military ones. (not 100% sure about that last point, but about 98% sure)

Mobilization lasts for 20 turns. No, you can't turn it off. It has to expire naturally. If you're hurtin' for military production it can provide quite a boost, but if you don't really need it, I would advise against it.
Edit: See ErikM's post above for duration info /edit

I don't know about the effects of Corruption on the production boost.

That's about all I know of Mobilization. Perhaps there are some Mobilization Gurus out there that can provide some more details.

Hope this helps,

Steven

Edit: cross post w/ ErikM /edit

Last edited by steven8r on 31-01-2004 at 22:53

	31-01-2004 06:07									#4
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Thank you very much, the both of you. That's exactly what I was looking for.


Maybe I'm blind, but I couldn't find this info in my PTW (400 page) instruction manual.

	31-01-2004 06:21									#5
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Mobilization does not last for 20 turns. It lasts until you get a Peace Treaty with someone (any ONE of the civs you were at war with). You then drop out of mobilization and can renew it if you wish.

I would use mobilization only if I NEED it, and then only defensively (like, when is THAT going to happen)!
In an offensive war, I wouldn't be able to build a temple/library in a captured city and would have to raze adjacent city/cities or be scared to death of a culture flip. I suppose it might be okay if in Fascism, since culture borders wouldn't be expanding for awhile anyhow.

	31-01-2004 08:14									#6
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It is a special circumstances type option. I can see a few times where it would make sense, I just have not been in one yet.

	31-01-2004 09:32									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Jaybe Mobilization does not last for 20 turns. It lasts until you get a Peace Treaty with someone (any ONE of the civs you were at war with). You then drop out of mobilization and can renew it if you wish.

Right. Let me see if I get this. If I'm at war with say, Egypt and Russia. I make peace with Russia, my mobilization ends. I can start it again immediately for the Egypt war. Do I end up losing any shields from this? I don't think so, because all this happens in the middle of my turn, where shields aren't being 'used' anyway.

quote: I would use mobilization only if I NEED it, and then only defensively (like, when is THAT going to happen)!

You know, I don't think I'd know what to do in a defenseive war. The situation never seems to come up.

quote: In an offensive war, I wouldn't be able to build a temple/library in a captured city and would have to raze adjacent city/cities or be scared to death of a culture flip. I suppose it might be okay if in Fascism, since culture borders wouldn't be expanding for awhile anyhow.

This would definitely be a problem. Culture flips are the bane of my existence. However, if I can start a phony war with a minor civ on another continent just for a pure military buildup, and then end mobilization to get ready for a local war, it might make sense. But I definitely see your point.

	31-01-2004 10:11									#8
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Are there any effects on war weariness?

	31-01-2004 10:23									#9
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"You know, I don't think I'd know what to do in a defenseive war. The situation never seems to come up. "

I have had a few places that it could have come in handy, but I did not think of it in time.

AU208 could be a place to use it. No peace is allowed and war has to be declared at contact. Oh no saltpetter on you land.
Romans very near and are built on iron, Iroq are built on horses so both had their UU right away. You have neither any where close to you.

	31-01-2004 23:05									#10
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quote: You know, I don't think I'd know what to do in a defensive war. The situation never seems to come up.

One game many moons ago I had a bad start as Greece and decided to play on ... until the very end (thus began my hatred for Hannibal the cannibal). Mobilization, artillery and guerillas vs. unsupported Carthag tanks, the whole bit.

	01-02-2004 02:48									#11
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I used it once a long time ago for defensive purposes. I hadn't built much in the way of military units and then noticed the AI moving it's workers away from the borders and placing military units there along with a military assement of weak and so trigured mobilization to pump out some militay units and also did some drafting of Rifemen.

Yes, the AI did attack me, but thanks to a combination of mobilization, drafting, and some yo-yo the AI techniques, I didn't lose a single city and was quickly able to make a few lighting raids with Calvary to raize a boarder city on the other side of the map for the empire, and evenually wipe out that AI.

Since then, I've built somewhat more Knights.

quote: Originally posted by vmxa1 It is a special circumstances type option. I can see a few times where it would make sense, I just have not been in one yet.

	01-02-2004 06:03									#12
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quote: Originally posted by vmxa1 It is a special circumstances type option. I can see a few times where it would make sense, I just have not been in one yet.

Your Sid level game perhaps?

	01-02-2004 12:10									#13
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That could be one for sure, if I get to that point and think of it.
My problem is the few chances I have had, it just did not ome to mind. Maybe now I will be looking for it.

	02-02-2004 04:19									#14
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When you demobilize, can you convert accumulated shields for unit production to Wonder production?

	02-02-2004 05:24									#15
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Good question. I don't see why not. As long as there are no "tainted" shields, it should work.

	04-02-2004 19:37									#16
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Does the AI mobilize?

Does moblization end when your enemy is destroyed?

	04-02-2004 22:19									#17
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It will end when the war ends. I seem to remember seeign a civ in mobilizrion in the past, but I could be mistaken.

	04-02-2004 22:51									#18
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In C3C, the AI definitely will use mobilization, especially if they are fighting for their life! To see for yourself, investigate some cities of a civ that is in that situation with other AI civs (after they get nationalism). Check for those extra shields.

	05-02-2004 02:03									#19
	Re: Re: Mobilization help! Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by ErikM You cannot build anything else during mobilization (although your cities could finish their current projects whatever they are). No temples, libraries, etc. Culture production is halved during mobilisation.

In C3C this has changed from the prior PTW and Vanilla rules. The cities will not allow you to finish non-military projects, and once mobilized, will pull them from the queue switch them to a military unit/building the moment you end your turn. Even wonders.

	05-02-2004 02:18									#20
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quote: Originally posted by TheArsenal In C3C this has changed from the prior PTW and Vanilla rules. The cities will not allow you to finish non-military projects, and once mobilized, will pull them from the queue switch them to a military unit/building the moment you end your turn. Even wonders.

Drastically reduces its usefulness for me.

Pissed me off when I figured it out, too. One of the many undocumented C3C changes....

[ok]

	05-02-2004 02:30									#21
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Egads! Mobilization seems useless now. I never used it much anyways but now it seems like there would never be a good time for it. I mean, you always have at least one city close to finishing a University or Bank or something when you want to go to war.

Changing production in my city without telling me would really tick me off.

	05-02-2004 03:46									#22
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quote: Originally posted by gunkulator Egads! Mobilization seems useless now. I never used it much anyways but now it seems like there would never be a good time for it. I mean, you always have at least one city close to finishing a University or Bank or something when you want to go to war. Changing production in my city without telling me would really tick me off.

You can always rush-buy that single city's build and then start a war.

I like this change, actually, as it forces the player to actually choose between enhanced military production and infrastructure development.

	05-02-2004 06:25									#23
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quote: Culture production is halved during mobilisation.

Are you sure?

quote: Mobilization automatically ends when at least one of your current wars is resolved.

No, you are allowed to end mobilization when a current war is resolved. I'm 99% certain it isn't autmoatic.

	05-02-2004 06:27									#24
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quote: Mobilization can only be 'triggered' while you're at war w/ someone. I think it provides 1 extra shield per square that's already producing at least 1--kinda like a Golden Age.

Mobilization can be triggered anytime.

	05-02-2004 10:00									#25
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Well you do need to have knowlefge of Nationalism.

	05-02-2004 19:28									#26
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quote: Originally posted by TheArsenal In C3C this has changed from the prior PTW and Vanilla rules. The cities will not allow you to finish non-military projects, and once mobilized, will pull them from the queue switch them to a military unit/building the moment you end your turn. Even wonders.

I'm not finding this to be true in my current c3c 1.12 game.

I am mobilized and I am being allowed to finish non-military projects that were being worked on when mobilization began.

	05-02-2004 20:30									#27
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I haven’t tried mobilization since the Beta Patches. Maybe this was changed. I would not be sad about it.

	05-02-2004 20:39									#28
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quote: Originally posted by skywalker No, you are allowed to end mobilization when a current war is resolved. I'm 99% certain it isn't autmoatic.

I've tried Mobilization in few games this week and it AWAYS automatically ended anytime I came to peace or eliminated an opponent I was at war with.

I have a new question:

Can Mobilization and a Golden Age be compounded?

Would I get an additional two shields from shield producing tiles if I was in a Golden Age and activated Mobilization?

EDIT: Tried it out and answered my own question about whether they stacked or not.

	06-02-2004 02:22									#29
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quote: Originally posted by GhengisFarb EDIT: Tried it out and answered my own question about whether they stacked or not.

And? And????

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	06-02-2004 05:24									#30
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quote: Originally posted by GhengisFarb I've tried Mobilization in few games this week and it AWAYS automatically ended anytime I came to peace or eliminated an opponent I was at war with. I have a new question: Can Mobilization and a Golden Age be compounded? Would I get an additional two shields from shield producing tiles if I was in a Golden Age and activated Mobilization? EDIT: Tried it out and answered my own question about whether they stacked or not.

I found out about this in the Napolean scenario as Russia (the answer is yes )