 |
Your views on Marriage (foreigners select elsewhere answers only please)
This poll is closed. |
| I live in USA: Heterosexual Marriage Only |
   |
13 |
7.22% |
| I live in USA: Homosexual Civil Unions Only |
   |
9 |
5.00% |
| I live in USA: Full Homosexual Marriage Rights |
   |
45 |
25.00% |
| I live in USA: #3 + Further Extend Rights to Polygamy |
   |
17 |
9.44% |
| I live in USA: #1 only and extending rights to Polygamy |
   |
0 |
0% |
| I live in USA: Extend Marriage to Bannanas |
   |
4 |
2.22% |
| Elsewhere: Heterosexual Marriage Only |
|
16 |
8.89% |
| Elsewhere: Homosexual Civil Unions Only |
|
11 |
6.11% |
| Elsewhere: Full Homosexual Marriage Rights |
|
46 |
25.56% |
| Elsewhere: #9 + Further Extend Rights to Polygamy |
|
13 |
7.22% |
| Elsewhere: #7 only and extending rights to Polygamy |
|
1 |
0.56% |
| Elsewhere: Extend Marriage to Bannanas |
|
5 |
2.78% |
| Total: |
180 voters |
100% |
|
| |
|
|
Proteus_MST
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Yes. Marriage originates in the enslavement of women in order to ensure that men can ensure their offsrping really are theirs. At some point, as with mst things, religion clouded up the real, practical origins of the institution, and made it dogma.
Both marriage and organized religion originated about the same time, the neolithic revolution. |
Hm,
I always thought about it as being some kind of Ritual for the couple to receive Blessings from God (or the God responsible for Fertility) to give them lots of healthy offspring.
But I agree, from the standpoint of ethology it makes more sense to assume that marriage evolved as a means to ensure that all offspring are from the same male.
After all it is one of the most important factors in the behavior of most male animals to ensure, that as much offspring as possible carry their genes.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
yavoon
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by Big Crunch
I'm not denying any rights. |
yes yes I didn't mean a right like the right to vote. question is still valid tho. the convenience of the legal consequence isnt a very convincing argument in this arena.
it would have helped obviously if u would not have just one lined me and answered the real part of my post too tho. good faith arguing and all.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Firelad
|
|
Haifa, Israel.
May 2002
time: 07:34
|
|
There are problems with polygamy. Legal and otherwise. I like the idea of civil union for 2, marriage (considered relative) for as many as you like. Besides, solution = open marriage.
Of course, pooftie rights are taken for granted in this post.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
chegitz guevara
|
 |
Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:34
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by St Leo
quote:
Originally posted by chegitz guevara Yes. Marriage originates in the enslavement of women in order to ensure that men can ensure their offsrping really are theirs. At some point, as with mst things, religion clouded up the real, practical origins of the institution, and made it dogma.
Both marriage and organized religion originated about the same time, the neolithic revolution. |
I am not sure if your premise holds water when looked at from a cross-cultural or a cross-species perspective, but one would think that you are overestimating the knowledge available in the Neolithic. Such an enslavement would be rooted in short-term sex, not long-term reproduction. |
From a cross-species perspective it seem to bolster my case. Most mammals limit their breeding to an alpha male, female, or both. There are exceptions with solitary mamals, like bears and such as well as animals like dolphins and bonbos who will boink anything that moves practically.
Cross-culturally it's harder for me to say, as I haven't studied all of them. However, as far as arising in the neolithic, that's when anthropologists are pretty sure it arose. That's the point at which animal husbandry allows men to realize that men have something to do with reproduction (as opposed to sex just being fun). It is also when wealth begins to accumulate and fathers want to be able to pass the wealth on to their children. In order to do so, they needed to know who their children were, hence the enslavement of women.
At least that's the current theory. Could be wrong.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
chegitz guevara
|
|
Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:34
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Right. So 80% of the folks of America have a psychological disorder.
 |
80% is the percentage of Christians. You people aren't the only religious people in America, you know. 95% of Americans are religious. Anyway, 100% of Americans have a psychological disorder or some kind.It's just that 95% of them believe in invisible friends in addition to any other problems they might have.
You believe in something which can't be seen, touched, felt, measured, which exists outside time and space, and yet someone how influences reality, all cause someone told you it exists. Yeah, I call that a neurosis.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Caligastia
|
|
Gay marriage is something I'm undecided on.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
chegitz guevara
|
|
Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:34
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by MrFun
Bennie refuses to respect gays, and you refuse to respect non-bigoted religious people -- it's hard for me to pick which one is more evil. |
You don't chose to be gay, but you do chose to believe in grown-up Santa Claus. I see no reason to respect someone who believes something so silly as an invisible spirit which loves you, made you, but can't be detected and will torture you for all eternity if you don't love him back.
On top of that, you only believe it because some shepard 5,000 years ago said its true. Well heck, shepards 5,000 years ago believed a lot of crazy things. Why pick one shepard over another? Because he wrote it down? Because a group of religious fanatics seized control of the most powerful empire in the West and forced everyone to believe on pain of torture and death?
Yeah, I'm gonna respect that. You and Ben are both crazy.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
chegitz guevara
|
|
Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:34
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Not that long ago, Che. If you are referring to Christ, he's a carpenter, not a shepherd. |
It starts with Abraham
quote:
No, because of the resurrection. |
Which you only believe in because someone told you it happened.
quote:
After kicking the *** out of believers for 3 centuries? |
Irrelevent. At the time the Christians seized control of the Empire, it was still a minority religion. It only became the majority because it outlawed all other religions. If they hadn't done that, there's a good possiblity we'd be Odinists or Wiccans or some other pagan religion.
Last edited by chegitz guevara on 28-02-2004 at 03:32
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Caligastia
|
|
It's not a matter of believing in God, it's a matter of knowing him.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Elok
|
 |
Land of Ramen Dragons
Mar 2003
time: 00:34
|
|
How would an omnipresent being be anything but invisible? If He were visible, you couldn't tell, because you'd never have been able to see any space that wasn't occupied by God. God could "look" like something we regard as just an aspect of light itself. And interestingly enough, I don't think the Bible ever says God is the one doing the torturing. He is said to send people to a place of torment, but that torment could easily be self-inflicted.
Think about it. Suppose you had a deadbeat son. He lounges around the house all day pulling pranks on his brothers, he refuses to work or help around the house, he swears at visitors, and no punishment or reasoning can get him to change. What do you do? Forcibly prevent him from being a heel? You can't do that forever, and a life of forced good behavior is not a kindness. Neither is it fair to let him keep making everyone else in the house miserable. The best option is to boot his butt out of the house until such time as he learns to behave himself and decides he wants to. Then he can come back. He'll probably screw his life up plenty and make himself thoroughly miserable in the interim, but there's nothing else you can do without taking away his freedom or feeding his disease. And that, I think, is Hell.
It might also be why the kid isn't allowed to see his father, to extend the metaphor. We have a bad tendency to see God as a big brother spoiling our fun, and one of the messages of Christianity is that a lot of our "fun" was never that fun to begin with. An obvious God can be resented and fought. This way, even a nonbeliever can decide to get his life in order on his own, then surrender his pride after he's learned how useless it really is.
|
|
| |
All times are GMT. The time now is 05:34.
Apolyton Time is 00:34. |
top of page
|
| archivepost |
|
Forum Rules:
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
|
HTML code is ON
vB code is ON
Smilies are ON
[IMG] code is ON
|
|
|
|
|
|
27-02-2004 04:47
|
|