04-05-2001 08:23									#1
	San Andreas Dip - Fall 1905 Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Ok, here we go!! Austria bites the dust, while England and Turkey continue to get builds. Here we go.

Austria (Midshipman) (EOG)
No Units

England (Ruffhaus) (1 build)
F Nth S A Den H
A Den H
F Ska S F Nwy H
F Nwy(sc) H
F Kie(sc) H
F Mun H
A Hol S F Mun H

France (Napoleon) (no change)
A Pie-Tyr
A Tus S A Pie-Tyr
A NAf-Pie
F Tyn C A NAf-Pie
F Lyo S F Tyn
A Bur S (English) F Mun

Italy (Defiant) (no change)
F Adr S A Rom-Ven
A Rom-Ven (bounce)

Russia (Victor) (no change)
F Fin(nc)-Nwy(nc) (fail)
A StP-Fin (fail)
A Swe S F Fin(nc)-Nwy
A Ber-Den (fail)
A Boh S A Sil-Ber
A Sil-Ber (fail)
A War-Liv
A Vie-Mun (fail)
A Bud H
A Tyr-Ven (bounce; dislodged; destroyed)
F Tri(wc) S A Tyr-Ven

Turkey (WarVoid) (1 build)
F Tun(ec) H
F EMe S F Tun H
F Nap(ec)-Rom(ec) (fail)
A Apu S F Nap-Rom (invalid)
F Ser(nc)-Bla
A Alb H
http://www.geocities.com/lordstone1...dreas/f1905.gif

AUSTRIA - submit your EOG
ENGLAND, TURKEY - submit your builds
ENGLAND, FRANCE, ITALY, RUSSIA, TURKEY - submit "yes" or "no" on a proposed 4-way draw including England, France, Russia, and Turkey.

Deadline: Saturday March 5, 2001
[This message has been edited by LordStone1 (edited May 03, 2001).]

	04-05-2001 08:30									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Notes:

1. When processing Austria's order to separate Nwg and Nth, connect Edi and Nwy back in the Winter 1904 Seismic turn, I neglected to add coasts to Norway. Ruffhaus alerted me to this, and I decided that since England had already ordered F Nwy-Den, that fleet should be placed in the south coast (even if he disagreed). We discussed this and decided it was the best way. So, F Nwy is on the south coast.

2. Some controversy have arisen to the issue that Victor was allowed to choose which coast to place his F Finland after England's order to separate StP and Nwy and connect Bar and Fin. The rules explicitly state:

quote: The application of a Seismic order can cause a coastal province to be divided into two or more coasts when it previously had one or none, or to divide a previous coast into more than one. In this case, players must give provisional orders as to where a fleet in such a province should be placed. In the absence of such orders the GM will determine this randomly, or according to a convention agreed at the start of the game.

However, the real-life application of this created the unlikely scenario that Victor was allowed to transplant his fleet that was previously on the Finnish coast of the Gulf of Bothina across land to the Barents Sea. I had some qualms about that, but rules are rules.

I'm not going to change anything, and if a situation happened later in this game similar to Finland, I would maintain the rule. However, perhaps we should reach some sort of convention in the next Seismic game to clarify that rule to prevent fleets from flying across land. Yes, there is another rule below

quote: If, following Seismic orders, the coast on which a fleet is located disappears, and that province possessed other coast(s), the fleet is automatically relocated - conditional orders being accepted if there were three or more coasts. Should a fleet be left in a province without coasts, it is trapped and may only stand until a coast is opened for it. It may be supported in standing.

That rule also allows fleets to fly across land, so perhaps we should clarify both rules. What do you think?

	04-05-2001 08:50									#3
	Remove this text

LS, thanks for bringing up the Finland issue. Even though I disagree with the application, I can see where the rules are faulty in addressing this because they don't specifically speak to the point. I think the rule as written applies to conditions like what happened with Norway. So while I disagree with your decision, I respect it at the same time. Being a GM forces tough decision, and at least yours was based on more than an arbitrary reason (no dig at anyone else), and that's all we can ask for. And with the draw on the table, it seems like a moot point.

In FUTURE games I would hold that such a move across land not be allowed. Maybe we can contact the variant designer for some clarification/feedback?

	04-05-2001 10:34									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

And the winner so far seems to be... Switzerland. Man, it is spreading like cancer!

In the meantime, Norway has finally entered puberty, and is now waiting for its balls to drop. If I were a Dane I would be very, very scared right now...

	04-05-2001 17:15									#5
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

This has been done before, with F Tri. While I agree that this is a silly rule, rules are rules, and midgame rule changes are bad, but hey, it might not matter if we all vote for that draw.