08-03-2004 17:55									#1
	Lux, Tax, Science For Huge Empires Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

First, the settings I normally use:
Deity, 7 civs, raging hordes, map 125x80,
3 billion years, hot and wet.
Since I like huge empires (more than 100 cities), I always come to the point where I have to justify the tax, lux and science rating.
I always builld Mike's, Bach's, and CfC (important!).
My favouriitesettings for lux, tax and science are:
- 40% lux,
- 60% science
- 0% tax
The income I need is only by trade.

If the amount of cities reaches about 160, I take the following settings:
-60% lux,
- 40% science
- 0% tax

Having more than 200 cities:

- 80% lux,
- 20% science,
- 0% tax.

Every turn I found some cities using 3 engineers and buy a market place at once - so the city will celebrate the next turn. And I keep it celebrating, buying banks, superhighways and the other improvements the city needs to grow. I often disband some food caravans in order to have some shields in the production box.

If you own such a number of cities, you will take one tech or more per turn, even with a science rate of 20%.
But for fe the celbration factor is more important than taxes. You'll make between 30.000 and 70.000 gold a turn only by trade (superhighways and airports are a must have, so mass transits and solar plants).

	09-03-2004 09:26									#2
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Do you build SETI?? If you add Libraries and then Universities, you can get more base science. That way, all your deliveries will net multiple techs per turn easier and earlier. Also, make sure to have your SSC further down the list and give the remaining cities at the top of the list Lib and Uni for an additional tech after the SSC kicks in.

This is for 100 or fewer cities. I refuse to play with too many cities any more as it takes way too long. Each turn is an ordeal.

Maybe I misremember the effects of huge number of cities, but, is it necessary to keep bumping the Lux rate?? I can remember needing 70% for getting celebrations going after a revolution, but, never more than 40% afterward. Often, 20-30% is enough to keep celebrations going, IIRC.

Monk

	09-03-2004 21:02									#3
	Inflate your Upload Space

While I played very few games with over 200 cities, I also don't remember needing to crank the lux that High.

	10-03-2004 18:07									#4
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It's hard to keep the cities celebrating when they are at size 12 or 14, even with market places and banks if you owe more than 200 cities.
I always try to build SETI, having libraries and universities and superhighways, too.
Why should I take taxes? No need for it. I want to have all the 200+ cities celebrating .
As you know, each future tech gives you bonus points - but the massive population growth gives you more.

	10-03-2004 20:11									#5
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You need temples, courthouse, colosseum. Assuming that you have Adam Smith, so the first two are maintance free. Also, harbors where appropriate. You shouldn't need more than 40% Lux.

Monk (wish I could spell!!)

Last edited by Bloody Monk on 10-03-2004 at 21:54

	10-03-2004 20:28									#6
	Tired of ads?

Indeed I doubt that raising lux from 60% to 80% can have any effect since there is a maximum impact of lux on happiness

Stu

	10-03-2004 20:40									#7
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I have experienced the same lack of difference.

	10-03-2004 23:40									#8
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Let's regard a city without any city improvements. Even with 40% lux it will revolt with the 4th or 5th citizen - although you have Mike's, Bach's, and CfC. And I must keep the cities celebrating - think of the fact that I need 3 engineers for a new founded city and a bunch of them for terraforming, irrigating and mining. As I said, I make 30.000 to 70.000 Gold a turn without taxes and some techs per turn with 20% science.

	11-03-2004 03:03									#9
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I just finished a game playing with the "fun" aspect you're discussing -- I think lux was at 30% for much of the end, finally had to crank it up to 40% because it made a difference in a couple of the largest cities.

Was getting two techs per turn with 20-30% science, 60% science was three techs per turn (deliveries caused the first tech of course.) Got to future tech 127 & shut down the science -- so with luxuries at 40% & tax at 60%, I was enjoying 20+K per turn income with no deliveries. Had a couple more than 200 cities and up to the final few turns had 200-300 engineers running around.

I had a hard time spending all the money -- was endlessly finishing a turn with a 40K+ bank balance, starting the new turn with 30K, spending down to about 25K, climbing back to 33-35K before moving the first unit. After 5-6K (I think that tech #123 was 5580 beakers or so), I stopped the deliveries for the turn, so I had a stockpile of trucks at the end.

Also had maybe a dozen undelivered uranium trucks...

Question -- in that state, would it make sense to automate the entire crew? (I didn't & that was what used the most time; second most was the maitenance review/rush buy (while the city window lies open))

	11-03-2004 03:10									#10
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I think that one of the lessons learned for me was after tech 127 the need for science is gone; as you pointed out, with lots of deliveries, the need for tax vanishes as well. The other comments point out that the lux effect probably maxes out (with appropriate infrastructure) at about 40%.

The gurus here will jump start celebrations from a non representative government with a higher rate, and once the celebrations kick in (and the extra arrows arrive) downshift to a more reasonable level -- again, say 30-40%.

I guess that the conclusion is that the very end game could have the slider set to 40% lux and 60% waste (in some form)

	11-03-2004 16:54									#11
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I agree with Monk. I haven't played with tonnes of cities for ages (girlfriend-induced time constraints ), but never had any difficulties even celebrating the 150th + cities, as long as they have all the "happy" improvements: temple, courthouse, colosseum, Mike's Chapel, JSB, CfC, marketplace, bank, stock exchange, superhighways. Keeping the freights flowing, and starting each city with 3 engineers, then you can buy one improvement each turn and watch it grow (some may also require harbour and supermarket) to the limit. The fact that your specialists automatically become Elvii means that you can keep the city celebrating without having to chuck in extra luxuries even when it gets to mega size. Remember that these specialists only affect the city up to the 30th (? I can't remember which specialist doesn't have any effect ), but that won't matter because you'll have exhausted the food supply before they are needed.

	11-03-2004 22:04									#12
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Old n Slow

Now that you have done a max score game, will you EVER want to do another??

Monk