30-03-2004 07:37									#1
	Ultra Large Maps on CTC? Put an end to popups!

How do you create and use the ultragigantic map with CTC? The "regular gigantic" just seem to small to fool with after being used to the very large ones.

	30-03-2004 18:57									#2
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I suggest you check out the GoodMod ultragigantic maps, and see what changes were made (for example, see the files with prefix GM1_APOLUL_). Then you can create your own ultragigantic version of CTC in a similar way.

	31-03-2004 01:02									#3
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there’s some variables in const.txt look for map height there

	31-03-2004 01:53									#4
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

No, the map sizes are specified in map.txt, but there are other things you should change too (government city caps, etc.).

	31-03-2004 03:21									#5
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Martin's already set it up for CTC:

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...485#post2223485

	31-03-2004 03:24									#6
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There are map size variables in const.txt and in map.txt
which does the game use does it use both
This is also the case with many other variables. Several examples are commented in the APOL_const.txt file from the Apolyton Pack.

	31-03-2004 03:37									#7
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const.txt is used i researched the map size limit and it is these I changed.

I attached a snippet

# These map size settings must all be defined,
# and in this order
#
MAP_SIZE_SMALL 26 52 2
MAP_SIZE_MEDIUM 48 96 2
MAP_SIZE_LARGE 64 128 2
MAP_SIZE_GIGANTIC 70 140 2


Note: don’t go to big there’s a limit. After the limit the ai totally messes up map generation. (home made maps are no effected)

	31-03-2004 04:05									#8
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quote: Originally posted by The Big Mc const.txt is used i researched the map size limit and it is these I changed. I attached a snippet # These map size settings must all be defined, # and in this order # MAP_SIZE_SMALL 26 52 2 MAP_SIZE_MEDIUM 48 96 2 MAP_SIZE_LARGE 64 128 2 MAP_SIZE_GIGANTIC 70 140 2 Note: don’t go to big there’s a limit. After the limit the ai totally messes up map generation. (home made maps are no effected)

Q1. What does the '2' do? I assume the first two numbers are the numbers of rows and columns (or columns and rows), but what is the third number the '2' in each case?

Q2. Does map generation get progressively worse as you increase the map size or is there a sudden change at some point?

	31-03-2004 10:50									#9
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Q1: don't know on this one never tried to change it

Q2: there’s a sudden change you get past a limit and you get a checkerboard effect between land and sea tiles in certain locations.

	31-03-2004 11:31									#10
	Put an end to popups!

In playing some MP games ive noticed if you add more land and continents you get less of the tiny islands all over. x2 giga map is more or less guarantees shitty islands somewhere or little lakes all over if you add lots of land, x1.5 giga map is usually quite good.

	31-03-2004 13:00									#11
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Maquiladora clean it up this is a "family forum".

but you are describing the same bug

	31-03-2004 13:56									#12
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Sorry - looks like I was handing out bogus info again... The 2 refers to the space layer - it's a leftover from CTP1. I thought that whole section was a leftover from CTP1, but perhaps not.

	31-03-2004 14:07									#13
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const.txt is also full of some other good things to mod like pollution from nukes and the amount of slaves you can have in a city before rioting takes place

	31-03-2004 18:21									#14
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quote: Originally posted by The Big Mc Maquiladora clean it up this is a "family forum". but you are describing the same bug

I dont see any ****ing families

Agree also that there should be variable government city caps for different size maps, one for each size. It would need to be reflected in the empire manager so we know though.

	31-03-2004 20:49									#15
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quote: Originally posted by Maquiladora I dont see any ****ing families Agree also that there should be variable government city caps for different size maps, one for each size. It would need to be reflected in the empire manager so we know though.

I have always wondered why this was not how it is done.

	31-03-2004 22:13									#16
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quote: Originally posted by The Big Mc Note: don�t go to big there�s a limit. After the limit the ai totally messes up map generation. (home made maps are no effected)

The AI? Actual not it is the game itsself. And that can be controlled trough map.txt, but don't ask me how. I just took my map.txt from Apolyton Pack.

-Martin

	05-04-2004 01:51									#17
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Well i found the best setup for 2x gigantic maps (140*280)

WetDry=5
WarmCold=5
OceanLand=3
IslandContinent=10
HomoDiverse=1
GoodCount=10

This will ALWAYS give a nice amount of continents/large islands and a nice stretch of oceans, and best of all no checkerboard of tiny one tile islands. Deviate even slightly from these settings and youll get the checkerboard, well, you can change Goods count of course.

I didnt use the apolyton mod though, just default map.txt.

	07-04-2004 00:34									#18
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Goofing around last night I changed Huge to 70x280 and generated a new game using the settings of my current (playtest) game. The map was almost normal, but where one continent should have been was a group of 20 to 30 small islands. How strange.

	07-04-2004 00:42									#19
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Thats the "bug"

	07-04-2004 03:24									#20
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I think this should be common knowledge so call me Captain Obvious if you want, but since noone mentioned it so far...

The checkerboard pattern is caused be the the 'other' settings in map.txt are not suitable for large maps. If you increase settings like MAP_NUM_CONTINENTS, MAP_MIN_WIDTH, MAP_MAX_HEIGHT, etc you will get much nicer maps without the checkerboard pattern. Which values are ideal depends on the mapsize of course, and on personal preference, so you'll have to experiment a bit with the exact settings.

For the source code project I think a thorough revisal of the map generation algorithm is in order anyhow, so the current system will replaced by something more intuitive (and less size-dependent) sooner or later.

	07-04-2004 06:06									#21
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I concure with Locutus. When I was initially setting up the Apolyton Ultra-Gigantic maps I found to get the good maps without these mini islands everywhere, you have to play with the settings in map.txt. I can't remember which one's off hand, but look at the gigantic settings in APOLUL_map.txt. The difference between the normal and UL map.txt should lead you in the right direction.

BTW, the "bug" everyone mentions with the UL maps which made me stop using them in Apolyton Pack, comes to a few things:
- After about 1500AD it was taking up to 30mins per turn for the AIs on slower spec computers.
- You can't scroll the city window in diplomacy, so you couldn't trade newer cities.
- Trade routes from one end of the map to the other caused ALL sorts of problems. For some reason, the trade gained from the largest trade routes was massively out of proportion to the rest of them. I was setting up a trade route between two of my cities in the middle of the game from the top-left to bottom-right of the map, and netting 6400 gold per turn from it.
- Pirating on those massive trade routes was causing crashes.

There were a few other smaller issues that I can't remember, so I just stopped using the UG maps.

Dale

	07-04-2004 13:13									#22
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Yes... i just realised the testing i was using a very old installation that contains many changes, including higher MAX_NUM_CONTINENTS in map.txt for giga maps.