04-04-2004 22:18									#31
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quote: Originally posted by Commy Think of it as the matrix. In a cybernetic society, people don't get to happy about machines running their lives. The -3 police is almost as bad as a free market, for the same reason. If your police leave, then the people rebel.

FM is not bad!

	05-04-2004 12:16									#32
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quote: Originally posted by obstructor -3 Police comes form unsatisfied workers who lost their jobs, since finally no one needs laborers, so they get rebellious. In reality they would be reeducated, or they would emigrate somewhere elsewhere, so the penalty should dissapear after 20 or so years. Anyway, this penalty was invented for balancing (even as it is useless), and as many other modifiers for social models doesn`t make sense.

This all seems a bit ad hoc to me...

I think that the Cybernetic Future Society choice only reflects the "futuristic" part of the society, the politics, economics, and values choices still matter. I can imagine a [/i]Cybernetic[/i] society that permits free ecnomic choices and election of government (Democratic/Free Market/Wealth/Cybernetic) that would be a lot like the CTP(2?) Virtual Democracy government. I can also imagine a Cybernetic society like the Ecotech Alliance from L. E. Modesitt Jr's The Parafaith War (Police State/Green/Power/Cybernetic). If you wanted to represent a society where the thoughts of the populace are controlled, surely you would adopt the Thought-Control Future Society choice, not Cybernetic.

	05-04-2004 23:13									#33
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I would adopt cybernetic, since it is the only correct choice.

	06-04-2004 02:20									#34
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Yo, obstructor, I LOVE FREE MARKET. I never said it was bad. It's GREAT. But you have to admit, that -5 police can get annoying.

Best social engineering (feel free to disagree):

Democracy, Free Market, Wealth, Eudaimonia

For a grand total:

+4 Growth-Big boost to production and pretty much everything

+5 Economy-The best you can get, cash and research up to a maximum. THis makes your economy so good, you can literally buy your way victory in a war, as well as victory its self.

+3 Industry-Combined with the growth, you can literally kill anyone in production

+2 Efficiency-Helps Beauracracy, as well as the economical output. Really useful on higher levels.

-5 Police-Probably why some people hate free markets. Really sucks for the military. My advice to you: Play defensive except for probe teams. As I said earlier, you can buy your way through war, and you can with mind control. Bring out the cash!

-3 Planet-The +5 economy really picks up the tab on this one. Just put clean reactor and hypnotic trance on most units.

-2 Morale-Bad against Psi, but again, use Hypnotic Trance

-2 Support-Use clean reactor, problem solved.

	06-04-2004 23:50									#35
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How can I disagree with that . Dang. But not all factions can pull out this.

	07-04-2004 00:11									#36
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I strongly disagree! It is one of these two...
Demo/Green/Knowledge/Cybernetic

Of course, for this to go right, you must be Counciousness, like any smart person, or Network Backbone (or both), and Cloning Vats. CV applies to next too..

Demo/Green/Power/Eudo

Think this is it.. might have been weath... either way, took me down to two or three advances a year, faster than running knowledge, and more money...

	07-04-2004 09:54									#37
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quote: Originally posted by obstructor I would adopt cybernetic, since it is the only correct choice.

*sigh*

	07-04-2004 12:02									#38
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Cybernetic for me.

	07-04-2004 14:01									#39
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quote: Originally posted by Patashu Cybernetic for me.

How come?

	07-04-2004 14:26									#40
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'Cause I like it better then the other ones. And if you built robots that could design other robots then in a few generations you'd get near-perfect ones. I think.

	07-04-2004 14:32									#41
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quote: Originally posted by Patashu 'Cause I like it better then the other ones. And if you built robots that could design other robots then in a few generations you'd get near-perfect ones. I think.

I like its effects (I generally end up with the Human Hive running Police State/Green/Knowledge/Cybernetic... don't ask why ) but the -3 POLICE rating seems to imply that perfection (or near-perfection) is out of the question.

	07-04-2004 14:40									#42
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If you get the network backbone(I think that's what is, haven't played SMAX in ages) then the negative police modifier disappears, so perfection or near-perfection is still in the question.

	07-04-2004 14:44									#43
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Run Thought Control, now!!!!

	07-04-2004 14:55									#44
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quote: Originally posted by Frankychan Run Thought Control, now!!!!

Just make sure you hook the Recycling Tanks up to The Clone Factory first.

	07-04-2004 14:56									#45
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quote: Originally posted by Patashu If you get the network backbone(I think that's what is, haven't played SMAX in ages) then the negative police modifier disappears, so perfection or near-perfection is still in the question.

I guess a the Human Hive running Police State / Planned / Power / Thought Control must be perfect then (no penalties at least...).

	07-04-2004 15:01									#46
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quote: Originally posted by Trithemius I guess a the Human Hive running Police State / Planned / Power / Thought Control must be perfect then (no penalties at least...).

Yep. Perfect. *nods*

	07-04-2004 15:05									#47
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You two are scaring me. I was going to post something similar to this before I decided it was probably best that I don't.

	07-04-2004 15:23									#48
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quote: Originally posted by Frankychan You two are scaring me. I was going to post something similar to this before I decided it was probably best that I don't.

Glory to the All-conquering State!

(Hegel loves ya', baby. )

P.S. I was being slightly sarcastic about the SE choices being "perfect"...

	07-04-2004 15:27									#49
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quote: Originally posted by Trithemius P.S. I was being slightly sarcastic about the SE choices being "perfect"...

I wasn't, though.

	07-04-2004 15:29									#50
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quote: Originally posted by Patashu I wasn't, though.

Its fine if you want to conquer people a lot. It's not so fine for other things though.

	07-04-2004 23:19									#51
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quote: Originally posted by Ouro_827 Demo/Green/Power/Eudo

Better use Power than wealth? Pox at you

	12-04-2004 15:25									#52
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Wealth in that combo causes a huge Morale problem (-3, positive modifiers halved - you would need a Command Centre, Bioenhancement Centre, and the High Morale ability just to have a chance of producing green troops) - Power, OTOH, nicely cancels out both Demo's support hit and Eudo's morale hit, and the industry penalty is counteracted by the Cloning Vats or Eudo.

	12-04-2004 16:20									#53
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By the time you get to Cloning Vats or Eudo, game is already decided.