29-04-2004 00:34									#1
	Ship Chaining & F1+arrows pre-turn usage Increase Your PM Length

Trip has posted team polls about the issues of ship chaining and F1 pre-production-phase usage. Let's make up our minds on these issues, so that we can cast our team vote.

Personally:

I do not care about ship chaining as long as I am aware of that it's allowed. I am still not sure if it is an exploit or not, but it no longer feels as bad as it used to for me. I kind of like the twist it adds to the game. For this one, I would abstain and readily accept whatever the majority of others votes for.

As for F1... I pretty much do not care either, as long as everybody follows the same rules. I can certainly do a bit more micromanaging every turn... So, one more abstain for me.

	29-04-2004 01:54									#2
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Ship chaining: No strong opinion. I guess let's abstain. (Courteously )

F1: I think this should be allowed. Luxuries being interrupted every 20 turns seems a little silly to me.

	29-04-2004 02:58									#3
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Ship Chaining: OK with me; Abstain or Approve

F1: Approve based on the 1-turn w/o lux. problem.

Isn't there a cheat which allows you to use the F1 to get double the output per city? I can't remember the specifics. In any case, if this cheat exists than of course this use of F1 is not allowed.

	29-04-2004 03:00									#4
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quote: Originally posted by lmtoops Isn't there a cheat which allows you to use the F1 to get double the output per city? I can't remember the specifics. In any case, if this cheat exists than of course this use of F1 is not allowed.

Yes, it still exists, and I added a clause to the poll preventing such exploitation.

	29-04-2004 04:07									#5
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I'm against both.

I consider ship-chaining to be an obvious exploit, and it removes the strategic implications of a disembarkment.

Edit (after reading Trip's next post): I'm all for allowing F1 before the turn. It is a useful tool of micromanagement, and I use it as frequently as I can in my SP games.

Last edited by Spiffor on 29-04-2004 at 05:36

	29-04-2004 04:09									#6
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor I consider ship-chaining to be an obvious exploit, and it removes the strategic implications of a disembarkment. Doubling city-output is an obvious cheat, and should be banned instead of ignored.

Once again, the use of this is NOT to get double use out of a tile (I've already included that as banned in the rule).

	29-04-2004 06:59									#7
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Trip...did you say not? I'm not sure if I heard you.

The thing about ship chaining, it takes a bit of planning to do it rightadn it's impossible to do it all in secret. As long as we stick to our rule of destroying any transport that is within stricking distance, we do not have to worry about this.

I would vote against ship chaining, but it's accepted in other games. So for consistancy, I would abstain or approve.

	29-04-2004 10:03									#8
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

NO - for ship chaining
YES - for F1 pre-production usage

	30-04-2004 10:11									#9
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I won't argue against a NO vote for Ship Chaining. If you look at it from a purely selfish point of view (Legoland POV), chaining will not help us, but could be used against us. So from that POV, we should vote NO.

	03-05-2004 13:50									#10
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quote: Originally posted by lmtoops If you look at it from a purely selfish point of view (Legoland POV), chaining will not help us, but could be used against us.

I have to point out this is not necessarily true - with ship chaining allowed, we could use the threat of it to tie a number of enemy troops garrisoning coastal cities within the range of our seaborne attack carried through such a transport chain.

	03-05-2004 14:03									#11
	Full PM-box? Change here!

At this moment (after Zargon's vote two posts later), we have the following votes gathered:

Ship Chains:
3x Abstain (vondrack, Kloreep, ZargonX)
1x Abstain or Approve (lmtoops)
2x Disapprove (Spiffor, Tiberius)

That would make me vote Abstain in the team poll.

F1 Pre-Production Usage:
1x Abstain (vondrack)
5x Approve (Kloreep, lmtoops, Spiffor, Tiberius, ZargonX)

That is a clear Approve for the team poll.

As Trip has pointed out, the team polls close shortly, so throw in your unheard votes fast, please.

Also - what are your opinions on battle logs? I myself would abstain or approve, as I have no strong opinion on this. Generally (based upon the ISDG GCA experience), I would approve the logs to make cheating more difficult. However, in this particular game (PtWDG), I do not believe there is anyone like Lucky, so I can live with no battle logs as well...

Last edited by vondrack on 03-05-2004 at 18:50

	03-05-2004 18:46									#12
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I have no preference with battle logs (abstain). It's interesting to read what has occured and it makes cheating harder, but it's also extra work.

	03-05-2004 18:48									#13
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Sorry for not voting yet:

I abstain on Ship Chaining
I approve proper use of F1
And I support Battle Logs in most cases. I do not support them if there are no survivors of the battle, though. Who's going to tell?

	03-05-2004 22:24									#14
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Abstain on the battle logs. It seems odd to add them in now after there have already been so many wars fought without them, but whatever.

	03-05-2004 23:24									#15
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Count me as an "abstain" on the battle logs.

	04-05-2004 11:01									#16
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Approve battle logs. It will be strongly needed in the World War. I'm not really thinking about cheating, but about strategy planning instead.

	04-05-2004 11:12									#17
	Increase Your PM Length

Damn abstainers.