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chegitz guevara
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Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Agathon
Not in Britain. Punk for me doesn't start until the Sex Pistols. |
English punk is not the be-all and end-all of punk. Anyway, even if you only like fast and dirty, you should still consider the Dolls, the Stooges, the Velvets, MC5, The Heartbreakers, the Ramones, and the Voidoids all punk. Technically the first four are all proto-punk, but they still have that raunchy, fast sound that the Pistols copied. Richard Hell (of the Neon Boys/Television, the Hearbreakers, & the Voidoids) invented the punk look (not Malcolm McLauren).
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Agathon
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Leafs 4TW!! - CPA
Dec 2002
time: 00:36
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quote:
Originally posted by chegitz guevara
English punk is not the be-all and end-all of punk. Anyway, even if you only like fast and dirty, you should still consider the Dolls, the Stooges, the Velvets, MC5, The Heartbreakers, the Ramones, and the Voidoids all punk. Technically the first four are all proto-punk, but they still have that raunchy, fast sound that the Pistols copied. Richard Hell (of the Neon Boys/Television, the Hearbreakers, & the Voidoids) invented the punk look (not Malcolm McLauren). |
I don't see how any of these could be called punk in the sense which it is used in most English speaking countries.
"Punk" is not a concept that is susceptible to Socratic definition; it isn't really a family resemblance concept either. It's an historical concept and it doesn't just refer to music but to a style and an attitude that received it's most intense expression in Britain in the mid to late seventies.
No one denies that the Sex Pistols were influenced by groups like the Stooges and the New York Dolls. No one denies that McLaren was not influenced by others either. But that does not make these others punk. The Sex Pistols did not slavishly copy others, but took from them and injected the whole thing with a defiantly anti-establishment attitude which arose from their dissatisfaction with Britain in the mid 70s. That kind of lowering your pants to social institutions just doesn't exist in the bands that came before, largely because they were from the US which didn't have the rigid class system and obsession with politeness that existed in the UK. Punk in the UK was not just a musical event - it was a part of a cultural move in Britain away from traditional class deference which is still going on.
It's that spitting in the face of respectability that was the core of the punk movement at its inception, and while different people took different things from it, and did it in different ways, that remains at the core of the concept.
I miss it. I remember going through Picadilly Circus in 1983 and the whole square was covered in people bedecked with pink mohawks and safety pins.
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-Jrabbit
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of the Electronic Egyptians
Feb 2002
time: 23:36
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OK, so conservativepunk.com says:
quote:
A Statement of our Mission
At Conservative punk, our mission is threefold:
1. To inform today's youth that identify themselves with the punk scene with the facts, rather than rumor and conspiracy theory.
2. To encourage today's youth to register to vote and become engaged in politics.
3. To encourage youth voters to draw there own conclusions rather than indoctrinate them into a certain way of thinking. |
Comments...
1. They have a Mission Statement, ergo an agenda.
2. OK, so they keep referring to "today's youth" in 3rd person -- which pretty much guarantees that they're not part of that group.
3. Still, their words sound pretty fair and even-handed -- until they make the mistake of explaining:
quote:
Punk music has been, and still is, one of the most heavy-handed genres of music there is. Unfortunately the topics of such heavy-handed songs are almost always seeped in left wing propaganda, bumper sticker rallying calls and oversimplifications of otherwise complex topics. Unfortunately the websites established by such bands to further their political views don't offer much more by way of information and truth than the music does. We at conservative punk mean to be the foil to this trend. We plan on filling in the gaps. We will offer our own views while still urging young punks to search for their own conclusions. Hopefully in doing so we will energize and excite young people enough to become engaged in politics and exercise their power at the ballot box. |
This is all about political agendas. The current punk scene is the intended audience. To their credit, among their homepage links is the FEC Mail Voter Registration page.
http://www.fec.gov/votregis/vr.htm
I won't go into the GOPunk.com site except to say that they are espousing "traditional Republican values" yet aligning themselves with today's Republican party. Kinda sadly self-delusional. It's mostly a forum site, not too much original content (but the FAQs are amusing.)
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12-05-2004 00:52
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