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ChairmanSlick
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Feeling a little philosophical and i thought i might pose a question to you guys.
What do you REALLY think about SMAC when looking in the broader scheme of things?
Do you think a lot of people play it to 'escape'?
Do you think that computer games in general have this tendency and therefore lack any real... whats the word... maybe- substance?
Do you think that its that people who play the game simply haven't got anything else to do?
Do you think that SMAC is 'cutting edge' game that pushes the limits of human intellect and matches wits of those who truly like to explore their own intellect against others?? (REALLY --- Do YOU really think this??)
Do you think that computer games in general have this capacity and that smac is just something that interests you??
I ponder these question and will refrain from answering them... just curious what you guys really thought.
Thanks - Slick
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Enigma_Nova
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It is clear that we have our own agenda, something which is unique to us and cannot be duplicated by anyone else.
Also, the way we view our agenda, and the way we view ourselves, are unique.
Not only is the way we are unique, and how we interact with those around us,
but also the way we know ourselves and the way we understand our interactions.
To know or to understand, it is a good idea to ask questions.
The questions we ask, and the way we think about the questions we ask, are as unique as the answers we seek and the person asking the question.
Just like not all human beings are evaluated in a single piece, it is impossible to understand all human beings by asking the same questions.
Each of us, our motives, interactions, self-awareness, understanding, interaction and knowledge is unique - and as such a strategy must be made for all of them.
Not to suggest that asking questions is futile - in learning, we formulate better questions, and the way to learn is to ask questions!
People are complex beings that interact with the observer, and so percpetion plays a major part in knowing and understanding them.
This ensures there is no one unique definition of a person, as we all view them in different ways.
Also, there is no unique way to grasp a question and answer it.
By arguments above, there is no 'best way' to come about this knowledge - there is no unique way to find out about any one person, nor a unique means of learning from any specific method.
- Enigma_Nova, "Finite Mystery"
quote:
Originally posted by ChairmanSlick
Feeling a little philosophical and i thought i might pose a question to you guys. |
You're posing a whole lot of questions there, Slick.
Good to know that self-questioning is a common trait.
If I could bring it out in others...
quote:
What do you REALLY think about SMAC when looking in the broader scheme of things? |
You learn more from the players than the game,
but learn the most from yourself.
It is a mental exercise, and philosophy aside an exercised mind works better than a stagnated mind.
It's brain chemicals, in that it shapes your brain for analytic and creative thinking.
For me, I get the compeditive spirit that my brain has adapted to like a drug. I get the enjoyment of accomplishment that my brain needs to prevent cells dying under stress.
Most of all, I get the illusion of knowledge - but that topic is better left until someone asks directly.
quote:
Do you think a lot of people play it to 'escape'? |
I don't like the idea of an escape.
It just changes what you perceive.
All of us 'escape' the pollution we smell, the people we don't meet, the threat of the traffic around us. We ignore 99% of the information fed to us by our senses, so SMAC is hardly an escape.
Changing which neurons fire and what chemical reactions occur, we choose to think about and experience certain things.
That is 'escape'. Choosing one set of chemical reactions over another.
In the scheme of things, the set of chemical reactions you get from 'daily life' may be damaging to your ability to procreate, while the set of chemicals you get by watching a monitor is not so damaging.
That's all this is - different chemicals so that our enitre chemical reaction (ourselves) out-reacts the other entire chemical reactions.
In my mind, there is no 'real life' as we see it.
It's just perception, and the illusion of knowledge.
Therefore, there can be no escape.
quote:
Do you think that computer games in general have this tendency and therefore lack any real... whats the word... maybe- substance? |
I'm not one to speak since I don't think Life has substance.
quote:
Do you think that its that people who play the game simply haven't got anything else to do? |
Action is a strange thing. Of the billions of possible random twitches, we somehow end up walking.
Deciding to perform one action over another is one of the most complex processes known to man, but yet the most commonly executed.
Even I don't know how we perform one action instead of another.
Given my finite knowledge, I'd say that we perform the action of SMAC since we decide it's the best action at the time.
We may do that because we enjoy it, because we have nothing better to do, for the training, or for any other reason (doesn't even have to be logical).
quote:
Do you think that SMAC is 'cutting edge' game that pushes the limits of human intellect and matches wits of those who truly like to explore their own intellect against others?? (REALLY --- Do YOU really think this??) |
Nothing short of telepathy can do that.
SMAC is just a cheap knock-off of two minds linked outmanoevering one-another.
It is not the ultimate challenge, but it is a challenge, and while it is only 1% as efficient as telepathy,
you have to settle with what you can work with.
quote:
Do you think that computer games in general have this capacity and that smac is just something that interests you?? |
Computer games are a billion things to a million people.
My interests are uncertain.
quote:
I ponder these question and will refrain from answering them... just curious what you guys really thought. |
I hope my answers have simply raised more questions.
-Enigma
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Commy
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St. Louis, MO, USA
Mar 2004
time: 05:36
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I mostly play SMAC because it's fun, and it's one thing I feel confident about. I know that I can do pretty well at it. No human would want to do something they are bad at, only something that they are good at doing, so that they feel better about themselves. I am no pro at SMAC, but I certainly am not horrible, so I feel that it is one of the things I am good at, so therefore I play it.
As far as an "escape", I wouldn't go that far. But it does take you away from any problems in the real world, just like any other video game does, because SMAC feels like another world.
Personally, I think it would be pretty nice to live on some other planet and off of this one...
Interesting thread though...
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Enigma_Nova
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quote:
Originally posted by Commy
No human would want to do something they are bad at, |
Virgin for life, eh Commy?
It's called 'training'. I do some stuff I'm not good at, so that I can become good at them.
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Zeiter
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Yeah, I think I play it to escape to some extent. It's fun to imagine that you are the leader of the world's most powerful empire every once in a while.
I think most computer games do little to teach us about the world around us, and are thus "unsubstantial", but I think this is where SMAC radically succeeds. I guarantee you a good SMAC player would make a good manager of a company, or even a good president of a nation. SMAC teaches you so many things about society. It quickly becomes apparent to a SMAC player how much technology influences an empire's strength. Every SMAC player knows that having a good economic and industrial infrastructure is essential to winning a long-term war. Every SMAC player knows first hand the difficulty of keeping the masses happy while trying to run a nation (keeping those pesky drones suppressed). Every SMAC player knows how powerful and essential intelligence information on an enemy (or even an ally) is. A SMAC player learns more about the workings and factors of society by playing SMAC than he/she does in elementary or middle school, I would wager. Of course, the same can be said about the sim city or Civ games. But I'm not done ranting and raving about SMAC yet...
Imbedded within those tech blurbs, those Secret Project movies, and those interludes is a striking message about human existence. I can't think of any other game with the real philosophical gravitas of SMAC. It's message about the human tendency to destroy itself and its environment is particularly striking.
Of course the game play is top-notch, with endless replay value (as long as you don't get bored with the AI competition). SMAC is EXTREMEMLY COMPLEX! In fact, friends that I have shown the game to always have the same comment, "This game is way too complicated." I guess that's why SMAC never caught on with the mainstream. It's a real pity, because that same complexity is what makes it so engrossing for those of us that do like it.
Believe me, I have plenty of other things that I could be doing with my time. I do believe that playing SMAC makes you smarter, stretching your mind to keep track of hundreds or thousands of things at once ("What is Sparta Command producing? What is Yang planning with those missle rovers? Oops, I better keep track of those drones in Training Camp!) etc. And then you are required to look many turns ahead and formulate complex plans. It is like playing chess, except even much more complex and involving. And that is just against the AI. When you get a human opponent, you also have to try to guage what your opponent is thinking and feeling, whether your opponent feels like invading you or trading with you, etc. SMAC has the potential to stretch the capacities of the human intellect, and I don't know of any other computer games (or anything else at all) that can measure up to SMAC in this respect.
SMAC is truly a gem. Now, let's have SMAC 2 already! 
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CEO Aaron
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Everything has its price. Even you.
Aug 2002
time: 05:36
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quote:
Originally posted by ChairmanSlick
What do you REALLY think about SMAC when looking in the broader scheme of things? |
I DON'T think about SMAX in the broader scheme of things. It's a game I play to relax and amuse myself. It serves no greater purpose in the greater scheme of things, or even in my life.
quote:
Do you think a lot of people play it to 'escape'? |
If they do, they're not escaping very far. I mean, on a scale of cult worship to drug use as means for avoiding problems in your life, SMAX doesn't even rate on the scale.
quote:
Do you think that computer games in general have this tendency and therefore lack any real... whats the word... maybe- substance? |
Nope. No substance.
quote:
Do you think that its that people who play the game simply haven't got anything else to do? |
I have plenty of other things to do. I just play SMAX instead of doing them occasionally. Hell, I spend more time writing posts on this board that I actually spend playing the game.
quote:
Do you think that SMAC is 'cutting edge' game that pushes the limits of human intellect and matches wits of those who truly like to explore their own intellect against others?? (REALLY --- Do YOU really think this??) |
No. I DO think that learning complex games with intricate rules and variable strategies does sharpen your mind and memory, but it's not like we're a load of prodigies playing simulations that will secretly save humanity.
quote:
Do you think that computer games in general have this capacity and that smac is just something that interests you?? |
No. Quake or Doom don't really expand your mind either. They might hone your hand-eye coordination a bit, but so would learning to throw darts, play pool, or shoot basketball. It's recreation, pure and simple.
quote:
I ponder these question and will refrain from answering them... just curious what you guys really thought.
Thanks - Slick |
Maybe I'm reading too much into this post, but you come across to me as being a bit unhappy with life and SMAX, or at least the point at which they intersect. It's important to remember that like any form of recreation, computer games have a place in your life, but they can't take place of other things. I'm certainly not going to try to tell you what is important in life, but I'm pretty sure that SMAX isn't one of those things. Don't let your fun get in the way of what's important, cheap thrills only get you so far in life.
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Santiago_Claus
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I guess I lead a sort of "double life" like I've heard some alcoholics do. Owing to the vagaries of my daily schedule I have the luxury of some time alone every day for gaming.
None of my friends are gamers and my girlfriend has on numerous occasions referred to them as "a total waste of time", so perhaps it is cowardly but I see it as to my advantage for no one IRL to know I'm into video games. Like I said, I have the luxury of keeping my "habit" hidden ... so I do!
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ChairmanSlick
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As far as to say that i'm unhappy in my life is untrue. I am merely questioning the validity of gaming. I mean, it takes up such a large part of my life recently. If i were to put this time into doing extra shifts at work, or studying more, the rewards would be substantial.
I too hide the extent of my gaming from my friends/ gfriend santiago. However, I think the reason for this is that computer games have not been widely accepted by society yet. I do not believe computer games are the cutting edge manifestation of future intelligence, which some days i think they are =) But i do think they are the best we have. (or that i have experienced.)
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Santiago_Claus
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[Bellies up to the space bar]
At least we ain't drinkin' ...
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anarchie
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Opium is also the opium of one's mind.
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Santiago_Claus
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Oooh, here's one:
"Opium is the religion of the masses."
I think this thread proves we're on crack.
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Commy
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St. Louis, MO, USA
Mar 2004
time: 05:36
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The nice thing about SMAC, compared to other strategy games, is that it is in the future, and not only is it in the future, it is on another planet, so it is much easier to create concepts within the game SMAC because they cannot be compared to anything around us, and are harder to say "that's impossible", because there is nothing real to compare it too.
Basically, take civ 3 for an example. It is based from the past to the present, so 10 years from now, no one will like (except for maybe a few at this site) it, because it is out of date, where as SMAC is in the future, so even 50 years from now, people will still like it because it is still way into the future in another world.
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Livid_Imp
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quote:
Originally posted by HongHu
Gaming is the opium of one's mind. |
**Livid Imp slaps up a vein**
Video games are entertainment medium no different than movies, music, TV, message boards and even books. A "medium" makes guaranties of quality. Those people that say video games are a waste of time are the same people think Britteny Spears is good music and "Fast n Furious" was high cinema.
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Snowflake
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falling, once again
Apr 2003
time: 23:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Livid_Imp
Video games are entertainment medium no different than movies, music, TV, message boards and even books. |
Games are certainly entertainment medium as movies and books. One thing that makes it a little different is that it can be highly addictive. Of course I often can't put down a good book until I finish the last page, and I wouldn't mind watching a good movie again and again. But I bet you won't read the same book or watch the same movie everyday for years.
SMAC is a good game because if offers so many rich aspects that attract different people. One may like it because it is about a different planet, one may like it because it happens in the future, one may like its capability for human interactions, one may like it because one can be in control of building an empire, or destroying the world... That said, there still are other good games out there, that offer yet different aspects that attract yet different people. civ3 may be about the past, but history will never get outdated. There are people who are fantacized by the future, still there are people who like to look at the history, and ponder what the world would be like, if only certain things happened ...
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Santiago_Claus
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"Revolution is the opiate of the intellectual."
That's hilarious! Who said it?
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gwillybj
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Eurytion Mining Colony: 165°C dayside, 165°F nightside
Mar 2001
time: 00:36
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What do you REALLY think about SMAC when looking in the broader scheme of things?
"Alpha Centauri + Life" is an unsolvable equation. SMAC is life.
Do you think a lot of people play it to 'escape'?
Do you think that computer games in general have this tendency and therefore lack any real... whats the word... maybe- substance?
imho, the vast majority of computer games are insubstantial. SMAC is in a very small minority.
Do you think that its that people who play the game simply haven't got anything else to do?
Nothing better, for sure.
Do you think that SMAC is 'cutting edge' game that pushes the limits of human intellect and matches wits of those who truly like to explore their own intellect against others?? (REALLY --- Do YOU really think this??)
Helluva lot more cutting-edge, limitless, intellectual, and witty than chess.
Do you think that computer games in general have this capacity and that smac is just something that interests you??
Nope. SMAC is da bomb.
Thanks
You're welcome 
I originally bought SMAC because it had everything I wanted:
* Turn-Based (I came to computer games from the war boardgames - Avalon Hill, etc.)
* Science Fiction (with a touch of Fantasy, and some humor)
* user-customizable (I had no idea how far this actually went!)
After cracking open the shell and chewing on the soft gooey center, I was firmly hooked. As of late, my neural functions are breaking down (the doctors haven't figured out why), so I have the added benefit of SMAC helping keep my mind sharp - that is, when I'm not unconscious or playing Gin with my mother-in-law, which is almost as engaging as SMAC.
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Enigma_Nova
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O_O
There he goes again! Somebody stop this madman!
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06-06-2004 18:08
![Visit Impaler[WrG]'s homepage!](/forums/images/homepage.gif)
Another insightful post by gwillybj.
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