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Eon Blue
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I just came up with some ideas for the next Civ4 game, i'm not sure if some of these have been mentioned so please forgive me if i repeat some or if other games already have this stuff.
- Right now, each city and each unit is the size of one tile but how about instead make the tile sizes smaller so there would be nine (new tile, so when i say tile, mean this and will make special concideration when refering to --->) within each current tile.
- each unit would be one new tile in size.
- the cities would vary in size depending on the size of the city, so from one new tile to compassing the entire old tile. Thus the growth of the city have mroe effect.
- the growth of the area of influence could probably follow the same rules as now
- armies would then take the number of new tiles according to the number of units within it and move together in whatever formation specified by the user. Not unlike the grouping effect in RTS games.
- unit leaders should be an additional aspect. UL's have 3 ranks so lowest imparts no bonuses and highest have greatest bonuses.
- each unit has a leader of the unit(imparts no special bonus), but depending on the number of victories in a row, these commanding officers can have the chance of becoming generals(nothing new yet, cept for the new requirement which makes it less random). The leader with the most victories in a row or reached a certain number of victories would be raised to supreme commander, which will give the unit it commands special bonuses, etc.
- When leaders gain a level, input a rpg aspect so you can choose what bonuses it inparts. like the unit it commands: feel reduced effects from fatigue, their attack is increased, increased defence, etc.
- If a unit is defeated in battle, depending on the result of the fight and the units involved, the leader can have a chance to retreat. So a total rout, really low chance but close battle, higher chance to retreat.
- So when you build an army, you are first assigning someone to lead(creating the unit leader) and giving him soldiers to lead.
- When a stacked group of units is attacked, the order of fighting should be from melee to ranged, or depending on who arrives first, depending on if they are prepared or not. The attacker would have the option of stopping attack or comencing upon each sucessful fight. So if you kill the melee units but are too weak to go after the ranged, you can move back. The defender's remaining unit can then have the same option to retreat or stay put.
- the Civ 2 impassible regions should return but to more of an effect like units moving over mountains etc.
- the game should be stretched out a bit more especially in the early years, possibily thorough implementation of seasons
- seasons can then affect movement of troops and maybe resources so cities will need to store for the winter
- the units should have new factors included into them, consisting of unit size, level of dicipline/training, fatigue, and tech level (its already in i know). This will make attacking and war more strategic rather then just one rush ther other and a dice roll.
- the fatigue would have effect when the unit is away from its borders, fighting too many battles at once and when it is moving particularly fast which leads me to...
- speed of unit movement, so apart from the regular speed of movement, you have the choice of making them go an extra tile or two but have to face the fact that they will be really reduced in effectiveness. The amount of tiles a unit can move will then also have to be re-calculated.
- example, so an infantry will move 2-3 tiles per turn on regular movement but double time can go to a max of 2-3 more tiles, and horsemen/mobile units can go 4-9 tiles but double that when double time. All hypothetical but what in this post isn't?
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Antrine
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Hi Eon Blue, I hope you do not get trashed here. For your enthusiasm is commendable for I am sure that just coming up with these ideas is well thought out and obviously detailed. However, with a light perusal of your post I wonder if you have any experience with modding?
Namely, using the Conquests CSC editor, for much of what you are advocating can be modded there. If you are, then maybe you are arguing for changes to the Vanilla presentation of CIV 4?
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Eon Blue
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I'm quite the newbie to this forum and come for some addons but not enough to keep up with the latest stuff. Thanks for not flaming me and i have no experience in modding 'cept for when i did minor fixes to the city image pic mod, but nothing significant to mention.
I'm not particularly sure what you mean by vanilla presentation but i guess i'm hoping these can be put into the finished product of civ 4, not a mod change..
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Eon Blue
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Yea, i also hope civ 4 turns out well...For some reason i liked civ2/3 more then AC/GalCiv more. It might be that i liked the bright colours more then the dark gloomyness but newho...i have another idea which is for leader type units from other aspects of civilization such as science, art, religion. I won't go into specifics as i'm too lazy to and it seems rather complicated and filled with questions but you know....
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Eon Blue
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gah, another idea that's alredy in the game....i really got to catch up
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Antrine
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Don't worry it happens to the rest of us from time to time.
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Eon Blue
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just curious, IS there a mod out there that does what i suggested?
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Plotinus
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I like the idea of smaller tiles with cities spreading over them, and also that of moves being divided up, although I'm not sure how that could be done smoothly. However, this thread ought to be in the Civ4 suggestions forum, which can be reached via the link on the extreme top right of the screen. Not the easiest place to see it when you're new, admittedly.
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Eon Blue
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yea, with the smaller tiles and the city spread over a number of tiles, the defender can move units around, but there would prolly be only a certain number of access points (ie doors etc). i'm sure if there is a garrison button, the unit can be spread out over the entire city.
and with the current system, units like archers have not much difference then melee units. Here, since each tile represents a smaller area of land, archers can attack without movement, kinda like siege but with only one tile of range.
And with the sub-turns, I was definitely thinking about putting a winter/summer division in for the temperate zones but even without it, it'll make war more tatical.
I really think they should put a fatigue into the game. For the points i stated 
oh heh heh, i didn't see the 'Civ Past/Future' section, i guess the mod can redirect this topic, if they deem it necessary. 
Last edited by Eon Blue on 10-06-2004 at 19:50
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Eon Blue
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on a similar note, the team attacking a city may be able to automatically setup for siege or encampment, when they hold outside the nme city, so that when they are attacked by archers shooting out, they will recieve little or no damage, and you can only break a siege by either rushing out or pummeling them with your own siege weapons.
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Elias
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I dont really like the sub tile system I would Prefer that they just made adjustments to the current system but keep the idea of cities useing up a couple of tiles, I always like to give real wolrd examples of civ 3 stuff so rember East and west Berlin. The leader Idea adds a little more of a personal effect and could help add more addvantages to experienced units. The New modifiers are greatly needed in civ 3 I espically like the ranged and meele unit idea that might just solve the stupid tank spearmen problem. As for the fatige I would only aggrre with it if they changed to you combat system because in civ 3 if you are attacking with a large amount of underpowerd units eventually you will win by chance and I dont have a problem with that but in the other combat system it would give a number advantage.
P.S there is a new future of civ games fourm's that the I deas should actually be in but oh well
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bob rulz
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Hey look it's another guy from Utah (Elias).
Anyway, to be on topic, I like the idea of cities spreading over multiple tiles. It would give it much more flexibility in production and maintenance and things of the sort. That sounds like a great idea. I've thought of this myself but it would take some thinking for it to be fully implemented.
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Ijuin
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Tokyo, Japan
May 2002
time: 14:36
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Hmmm, I can think of a relatively simple way to implement this kind of commander-upgrade.
Units will get morale upgrades as per normal, but when the morale gets upgraded, you can also choose a unit special ability to add (the available abilities depends on the unit type). You could choose such things as all terrain as roads, invisibility, assassinate attack (from C3C--you get to choose which unit in the enemy stack to attack), etc. Thus, veteran units get one special ability, elite unites get two, and General units (those who have produced a military GL) get to have three. Thus, your units will increase in power as they upgrade, sort of like the Daimyo upgrading in the Shogun scenario in C3C.
Possible Upgrades:
Infantry units (land units with movement 1):
All Terrain as Roads
Extra Hit Point (can only choose once per unit)
Invisible + Detect Invisible
Radar (see 2 spaces regardless of terrain)
ZOC (if not possessing already)
Pillage without movement cost
Cavalry units (land units with movement greater than 1):
All upgrades available to Infantry plus:
Extra movement point (once per unit)
Blitz
Artillery units:
Extra movement point (once per unit)
Extra ROF point (once per unit--also available to any bombard-capable unit)
Bombard range +1
Portable (can move on terrain forbidden to wheeled vehicles)
Ships:
Extra movement point (once per unit)
Extra hit point (once per unit)
Extra cargo hold (can carry one extra unit/can carry one unit if a warship)
Field Repair (can repair one HP per turn skipped while at sea outside of enemy territory)
Aircraft:
Extra hit point (once per unit)
Extra ROF point (once per unit)
Operational range +2 (once per unit)
High Altitude Recon (recon missions uncover a radius of 4 tiles rather than the usual radius of 2 tiles, giving a 9X9 uncovered area instead of 5X5)
LIDAR (available if you have the tech for building stealth planes--allows your plane to negate enemy stealth aircraft advantage and intercept with the same success chance as if the enemy craft were non-stealth)
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10-06-2004 07:25
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