15-06-2004 07:59									#1
	Give peace to GCA? Put an end to popups!

GCA requested a replay so that war never is declared between us. I don't think there's anyone supporting that, but what's our stance? Do we send them peace this turn, or make them wait the full 5 turns?

	15-06-2004 08:10									#2
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I voted for 5, but it should be 5 turns AFTER they contacted us about it. But we can then, give it to them as soon as we are ready to, I.E., we have the required sheilds (5 turns + 1/2) for getting HG 1 turn sooner.

E_T

	15-06-2004 08:11									#3
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Voted for "Wait Five Turns"

	15-06-2004 08:23									#4
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It is wholly their fault for not catching it. Maybe Lucky should have been crunching THOSE numbers instead. :P

5 turns as per the rules agreed upon previously.

	15-06-2004 08:52									#5
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:sigh:

Being perfectly neutral on the matter, this is fault of the PBEM system where peace was not automatically renegotiated. It is not our fault, but GCA's fault for not catching the mistake.

However, asking for 5 turns of peace is going to raise another incident at the UN because he'll scream bloody murder. Plus, I recall when we found out about this we had agreed during chat to send them peace once they found out about it.

I honestly don't know why everyone now behaves towards GCA in the EXACT same way GCA behaved towards us. We found it deplorable how Lucky treated us yet now we stoop to his level with suggestions like this.

If this isn't a f*ucked up sense of double standards I don't know what it.

	15-06-2004 08:56									#6
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Wait 5 turns, that should AT LEAST be the start of our negotiating position.

And I would like to handle this with Lucky in a very civil, very deliberate and very infuriating way

	15-06-2004 08:58									#7
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MZ, I think it's because of things that Lucky has done since that time, that just has some people just wanting to grind him into little bloody bits. But because we can;t do that, at this point in time, this is kind of good enough for us now.

Granted, it's not what I would like to happen to me, but If I was also in the position of Lucky, I would have done things a lot differently, too.

Face it, he's just scum of the earth....

E_T

	15-06-2004 09:01									#8
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quote: Originally posted by conmcb25 Wait 5 turns, that should AT LEAST be the start of our negotiating position. And I would like to handle this with Lucky in a very civil, very deliberate and very infuriating way

Con, your timing just couldn't have been better, glad your back and hope your Family pull themselves together after your recent loss. Hope your around for a long time to come, because we'll need you soon.

E_T

	15-06-2004 09:05									#9
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quote: Originally posted by E_T Face it, he's just scum of the earth.... E_T

And looking at the way this poll is going, we seem to be no better...

	15-06-2004 09:28									#10
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peace now. its not their fault so much as a quirk in they system. theyv'e asked to go back. no to that, but yes to peace.

	15-06-2004 09:46									#11
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peace now. regardless of them catching it or not, it's a HUGE bug. The only reason we are even considering letting it go is because it suddenly benefits us.

I guarantee that if this happened and we had NEGATIVE effects from war wariness, we'd be posting at the UN in no time.

	15-06-2004 10:07									#12
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quote: Originally posted by WhiteBandit I guarantee that if this happened and we had NEGATIVE effects from war wariness, we'd be posting at the UN in no time.

That's not true. We'd have caught it before it had happened. Their plain inattention to detail allowed this to happen. The game works this way; it's not a bug. If you select the check box to renegotiate deals every 20 turns, then that's what happens.

	15-06-2004 10:15									#13
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quote: Originally posted by BigFree That's not true. We'd have caught it before it had happened. Their plain inattention to detail allowed this to happen. The game works this way; it's not a bug. If you select the check box to renegotiate deals every 20 turns, then that's what happens.

Since we know the raison d'etre for this, why are we acting like this is a declaration of war?

	15-06-2004 10:22									#14
	Put an end to popups!

Yes. Doing otherwise would really just be petty.

	15-06-2004 10:25									#15
	Put an end to popups!

It's not petty, it's holding GCA accountable for their game playing abilities. Just because they don't know that something will happen it's not a legitimate excuse that we have to help them correct.

	15-06-2004 10:27									#16
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quote: Originally posted by Master Zen Since we know the raison d'etre for this, why are we acting like this is a declaration of war?

Simply because IT was a declaration of war. Just because GCA was unaware of how the game works we are going to give them a break? Whatever.

	15-06-2004 10:35									#17
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I'm furious with GCA. But an eye for an eye just doesn't appeal to me in this case. What's the point? It's petty. We want to do to them what they did to us. I think we should move beyond what they did to us, and to what we're going to do in future when we have a big enough army.

Let's show them how things should be done instead.

	15-06-2004 10:41									#18
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quote: Originally posted by BigFree It's not petty, it's holding GCA accountable for their game playing abilities. Just because they don't know that something will happen it's not a legitimate excuse that we have to help them correct.

who are WE to hold another team responsible for their GAME PLAYING mistakes when they actually benefit us? Have you actually thought about the inherent contradiction in that?

We don't let other teams "punish" us for our mistakes in-game, who says we have the right to do the same? GCA already got punished by their own WW these two turns, and we will NOT replay them. That is their punishment. Holding on 5 turns more is ridiculous...

	15-06-2004 10:58									#19
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That's your opinion and not mine MZ. The world does not hold enough people accountable for their actions/inactions. It's time for more accountability on a world wide scale. Now, who's with me? Let's get a petition or something....

	15-06-2004 12:18									#20
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While I can understand the sentiment of those wishing the worst for GCA, I am with MZ et al. - peace now. We do not need to lower ourselves to the level of our despised enemy.

	15-06-2004 13:27									#21
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Aye.

	15-06-2004 14:15									#22
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I dont mind giving them peace now.
But I dont mind also making them squirm a bit.

ie
Luckies letter is harsh.. he needs a slap.
They are stupid for not checking and renegotiating the 20 turn peace.
We are polling to see if we should insist on a 5 turn wait before offering peace.
We will not replaying the turns.

Make the b@astard sweat before offering them peace.

	15-06-2004 18:54									#23
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quote: I honestly don't know why everyone now behaves towards GCA in the EXACT same way GCA behaved towards us. We found it deplorable how Lucky treated us yet now we stoop to his level with suggestions like this.

Peace now.

-Arrian

	15-06-2004 21:24									#24
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quote: Originally posted by vondrack While I can understand the sentiment of those wishing the worst for GCA, I am with MZ et al. - peace now. We do not need to lower ourselves to the level of our despised enemy.

	15-06-2004 21:38									#25
	Put an end to popups!

quote: We don't let other teams "punish" us for our mistakes in-game, who says we have the right to do the same? GCA already got punished by their own WW these two turns, and we will NOT replay them. That is their punishment. Holding on 5 turns more is ridiculous...

Ditto

	15-06-2004 22:52									#26
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Let's all roll over at once and show them our bellies.

	15-06-2004 23:29									#27
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quote: Originally posted by BigFree Let's all roll over at once and show them our bellies.

I could use a tummy rub....

but seriously, its a game flaw, admittedly that they could have watched for, but they probably didn't realize it existed. Why be a jackass when it isn't necessary? Why purposefully be a dickhead when it doesn't actually get you anywhere? There have been and will be times for this type of behaviour, its best to behave like that only when necessary to further our goals. This is not the time. Just keep the damn game moving smoothing for another few turns, then we can be dicks again.

	15-06-2004 23:38									#28
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Well said, Sleepy.

I detest Lucky. The last thing I want to do is act just like him (being a petty jackass).

-Arrian

	16-06-2004 02:31									#29
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When does this poll officially close?

It 2 to 1 right now to send them peace this turn.

And we are either playing the turn right now or in about 5 hours.

Can we just wrap this up and can I just send Lucky a note that we are sending Peace this turn?

I'd like to get that note out to corrospond with the turn being sent.

Consuls let me know either way. All I need to do is change a sentence or two in the letter waiting to go to Lucky right now.

	16-06-2004 02:43									#30
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Send the Note, I say. And as for when we are playing, I still have to get some orders up.

E_T