25-06-2004 09:00									#1
	Question about reputation Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Do you suffer a rep hit if you're forced to burn the city down (as in it has 1 citizen and no culture?)

	25-06-2004 10:24									#2
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+1 if you raze the city of another AI. +12 if you raze a city of that civ. Other civs don’t add any more penalties than the standard +1 if the city had contained any Great wonders. It doesn’t look like the victim adds more than the +12 permanent penalty either, but there may be a temporary penalty.


The above is straight from Bamspeedy.

	25-06-2004 10:37									#3
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So, even if you have no choice? Like, if it has 1 citizen AND no culture, you have no choice but to burn it down. Surely if the AI knows how much gpt you get it can tell if you had no choice...right?

	25-06-2004 10:37									#4
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vmxa1, doesn't this relate to attitude points rather than reputation? The rep hit depends on the circumstances in which the war originally came about. ie, if you had a gpt or luxury deal going and declared war, thus breaking the deal early, you would suffer a rep hit. If not, declaring war would clearly affect AI attitude, but not your reputation.

	25-06-2004 11:21									#5
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Why should it be valid to murder thousands of people only because there's not much culture?

	25-06-2004 11:25									#6
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Don;t you guys know anything about the game?
If you conquer a city that has 1 citizen AND no culture, it forces you to burn it down.

Prove me wrong.

Unfortunately, I will be on vacation for 2 and a half days.

Expect my feedback then.

	25-06-2004 19:55									#7
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IMHO, no ones implying you're wrong.
Being forced to destroy the city, and taking a hit to your rep, is just part of the game mechanics. I accept it as such, but it does lead to the interesting moral question of being forced to murder thousands. But I gave up questioning that a long time ago (in the game, of course!)

	25-06-2004 20:22									#8
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quote: Originally posted by bob rulz So, even if you have no choice? Like, if it has 1 citizen AND no culture, you have no choice but to burn it down. Surely if the AI knows how much gpt you get it can tell if you had no choice...right?

It was not coded to deal with that level of sophistry. I suspect that in order to prevent some exploits, they opted to make it straight forward.

You were the cause of the city being razed and hence it hurts your relationship. If you have a deal and that broke it, it hurts your rep. It does not matter if you intended it or not.

As to all the lost lives, it has only been in the last 100-150 years that anyone cared about that issue. Civs have kill whole population throughout history and in fact still do.

	25-06-2004 23:54									#9
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quote: Originally posted by bob rulz Do you suffer a rep hit if you're forced to burn the city down (as in it has 1 citizen and no culture?)

To be clear, Razing cities has NO affect on REPUTATION.
It only affects ATTITUDE, and I believe it doesn't matter whether you did it voluntarily. That's just the way the cookie crumbles.

If you want to make sure that a city with 1-radius has culture, keep on chasing the civ's capital since the palace generates culture (but don't take more than 1 of the civ's capital in the same turn).

	25-06-2004 23:57									#10
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quote: Originally posted by CyberShy Why should it be valid to murder thousands of people only because there's not much culture?

Why not?

	26-06-2004 02:28									#11
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quote: Originally posted by Kucinich Why not?

	26-06-2004 03:30									#12
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of course the AI attitude should be agianst you if you destroy a size 1 city.. and yes you did it on purpose by launching an attack on the little city in first place...

In a MP game, if you attacked me and one of my citys was razed i woulodnt stop till had razed a few of yours....

	26-06-2004 10:41									#13
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quote: Originally posted by CyberShy Why should it be valid to murder thousands of people only because there's not much culture?

Are you kidding? This happened way too many times throughout history.

	26-06-2004 13:15									#14
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Innocent lives always lost in war ///

	26-06-2004 17:20									#15
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Hate to see it in the real world. Love to do it in Civ.

	27-06-2004 08:37									#16
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I always hear about the innocent bystanders. Where are all of the guilty ones?

	01-07-2004 09:05									#17
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quote: Originally posted by Vince278 I always hear about the innocent bystanders. Where are all of the guilty ones?

	01-07-2004 11:43									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Vince278 Are you kidding? This happened way too many times throughout history.

So, everything that has happened many times through history is valid?

	01-07-2004 14:05									#19
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quote: Originally posted by CyberShy So, everything that has happened many times through history is valid?

I thought by putting the frown at the end of my statement showed that I too lamented the fact. I'm sorry you missed the point.

	01-07-2004 14:09									#20
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The frown was clear,
but my question was: 'is it valid'
Your reaction: 'are you kidding.....' suggested you meant it is valid because it unfortunately happened already oftenly in history.

oh well, whatever. I'm sure we agree

	01-07-2004 14:10									#21
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quote: Originally posted by Vince278 I thought by putting the frown at the end of my statement showed that I too lamented the fact. I'm sorry you missed the point.

For a frown that suggests lament you could try or

	01-07-2004 14:36									#22
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quote: Originally posted by Mad Bomber For a frown that suggests lament you could try or

I believe I did use the second one.

	01-07-2004 22:14									#23
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quote: Originally posted by CyberShy Why should it be valid to murder thousands of people only because there's not much culture?

exactly. This would be outrageous in real life.

We could raze all of West Virginia with no penalty

	01-07-2004 22:51									#24
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Great idea, Dis!

To the original question, you have a choice. It's very easy to tell when a city is size one and only slightly more difficult to tell if it has no culture (meaning the 4-5 turns after a lib or temple has been finished, and thus generated some culture, but not enough to bump the borders). If you choose to attack, it's with the knowledge that the city will be autorazed.

	02-07-2004 00:51									#25
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quote: Originally posted by Vince278 I believe I did use the second one.

I stand corrected

	02-07-2004 08:01									#26
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quote: Originally posted by Vince278 I always hear about the innocent bystanders. Where are all of the guilty ones?

Sigged.

	02-07-2004 08:51									#27
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quote: Originally posted by bob rulz Sigged.

Thanks. Thats the fourth time someone has done that.