07-07-2004 21:03									#1
	2104 end turn + 2105 discussion Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

For those not aware, Chaunk has stepped down for reasons that can be found in another thread. Hopefully he will return shortly. Meanwhile, as COO, I'm the backup turnplayer...

Here is the mid-turn save.

Wounded scout popped a monolith, and is now healed and veteran status. MorgCon is working the monolith. Western scout bounced off the fungus. Eastern scout moved east and found two pods.

Tech: InfoNets complete... 8 tech/turn, 1 accumulated, cost: 35, next tech in 5 turns (Ind Econ)... If we pop two pods, it will be in 4 turns.

FM would increase our energy output from 10 to 15. This would probably increase our tech output to 10. Assuming we get Cent Eco about 5 turns after Ind Econ, we'll have it in plenty of time to build formers after the CP's complete.

No other faction has Ind Base, and only the Angels have InfoNets. All player factions are size 2.

Note that MorgCon grows in 9 and completes the CP in 9. However, my calculations indicate that assigning a doctor just before growth means it won't quite finish until the following turn.

I will be available to finish the turn in approximately 12 hours, based on any feedback between now and then.

****

Possibilities next turn...

Western scout tries again to auto-complete a Node.
Eastern scout should pop one of the pods to try to auto-complete a Node.
Veteran scout heads for the river for the southern pod.

Attachment: acdg3-morgan-2104_endturn.zip
This has been downloaded 1 time(s).

Last edited by jtsisyoda on 07-07-2004 at 21:24

	07-07-2004 21:05									#2
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Screenshot...

Attachment: 2104_screenie.jpg
This has been downloaded 64 time(s).

Last edited by jtsisyoda on 07-07-2004 at 21:14

	07-07-2004 23:15									#3
	Put an end to popups!

Looks good to me, though I'd wait for cities to be built east of Mt. Drogue before we pop those pods.

	07-07-2004 23:45									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

yea, free facilities are always the best

	08-07-2004 08:15									#5
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Our plan in the While We're Waiting game was to pop all the pods we could before 2114. Lab points are pretty valuable at this stage, while worms are very weak. They're usually just easy credits and morale upgrades.

I strongly suggest popping at least two more pods, so we finish Ind Econ one turn ahead of schedule. The western and southern pods are within base radii, so maybe we could do those two.

For the eastern pods, waiting might be ok... the general agreement was that two of our scouts would head back toward the bases for disbandment toward formers. Just before that, they could pop nearby pods. However, eastern slopes usually aren't rainy, so we'll probably have better sites for bases elsewhere. In that case, we might be better off popping the pods sooner rather than later.

	08-07-2004 12:41									#6
	Increase the size of your Attachments

I'd also vote sooner rather than later for the eastern pods. The scout will survive anyway and if there's a rover in it, we could set course for the Hive and be the first faction meeting them, right, Archaic?

What me might consider is planning a second base on Mount Drogue (just did so in the Minigame, is nearly as good as rectanks), not for growth but for industry (and energy).

	08-07-2004 12:55									#7
	Inflate your Upload Space

While we certainly want to meet the Hive first, before any other faction, I would advise against us doing so until we have discovered IA. We have no way of knowing how hostile the Hive will be at this stage. We don't want to provoke them into a war this early if they've been set to victim.

I would however agree to sooner rather than later on the pods.

	08-07-2004 14:50									#8
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Yep, another "pop the pods" vote. Remember the cut off date is 2113 though...

	08-07-2004 15:34									#9
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Although IŽd love to build a third base before popping those pods, the possible benefits arenŽt that much higher than those of popping it now.

Rather Sooner than later it is for me

	08-07-2004 18:41									#10
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Egads, our tech cost went to 35! We were the first to research a tech on the new planet, and so we are tech leaders. Our next tech may cost as much as 54, but I hope it'll be less than that.

It's an interesting point in scenarios made like this, that starting techs cost more. The angels initial tech cost will have been ~31 I think (32 maybe?). There cost will now probably be 28. However, in normal games, their tech cost would be 14 or 15 like ours was. Having the tech trade flag activated does give us some definate advantages.

Note that the gaians and spartans have now joined us on 2 pop. Thus, we know the angels planted 2 bases in 2101, the gaians one in 2101, one in 2104 (It's not yet impacted the power graph), and the spartans one in 2101 and then 2103. We planted two in 2102.

The hive started with bases prefounded in 2100. I think 4 prefounded bases sounds feasable, one in each corner of their landmass? The PK's and uni didn't start with any prefounded bases. I think they both now have 2 bases - certainly the PK's do (2101 and 2103 I think) but the uni may only have one - it's hard to tell because of their extra tech. I'll have to go through the old saves. Also, buster may have given them some extra units which would affect their power graph.

Does anyone know if the Ai were started out with 3 CPs instead of 2?

	08-07-2004 21:42									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

So far it looks like 5-2 in favor of popping pods now.

I suggest the eastern scout first pop the pod directly south, then head east then north for the other pod. It uses the same movement, but ends up closer to the frontier that way.

As far as the Hive goes... better we find them than they find us. Demanding withdrawal is nerve-wracking for me.

	08-07-2004 21:58									#12
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Still abstaining from input about scout movement. I think the odds are good that a non-fungal pod will produce something worth a couple of turns worth of scout support.

	09-07-2004 02:22									#13
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

So we will be setting both bases temporarily to Net Nodes incase we get an atuo completion?

Also can the Scout now on the Monolith take the river down to that southern most pod and pop it next turn. That will give us 3 pops in one turn.

	09-07-2004 02:33									#14
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

No it can't. It'd need to have started on the river to pop that southern pod next turn. It'll be able to pop the pod in 2106.

We get one tech point from each pod. We make 8 tech/turn, and have a tech cost of 35. We currently have 1 tech point in the bag.

I believe both our bases make 4 tech, hence we want to aim for 6 pods popped in the next 4 turns if we can (35 cost - 1 accumulated. 2x4x3 (2 bases at 4/turn times 3 turns) = 24+1already, 25. We then need 10 points in the fourth turn for IndEcon in 2108. 2 pods +2x4 point bases is 10, but we can easily pop 4 pods, which puts us at 37 tech. This wastes 2 points, 2 pods. If we can find 2 more pods, then we'll be cooking on gas, otherwise we need a net node for one turn to make 35 points with 4 pod pops.) As we can only see 4, this could be a problem. It might be worth considering only popping two pods?

	09-07-2004 11:02									#15
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Good point on the lab point truncation. Yes, both bases produce 4 tech. So either 2 or 6 pod pops would be ideal. We have four turns to find and pop two additional pods. I consider this more likely than not, especially with rivers speeding movement.

	09-07-2004 17:42									#16
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Worst case scenario though, we only find one more pod, and pop 5...

Hopefully we can pop a NetNode and this'll be moot though. In that case, we should pop 4 pods, ideal in this current situation.

	09-07-2004 21:57									#17
	Increase the size of your Attachments

If they turn out to be resource specials, though, it will be important to know, so we can take advantage of them. I believe the eastern-most pod would be energy, and the other eastern pod would be nuts. The southern pod could be anything.

	10-07-2004 09:29									#18
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

I downloaded the next turn in case Poly has another slowdown. I haven't opened it yet. Chaunk, when will you be available to play it?

	10-07-2004 12:55									#19
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Yep, I've got the turn too. I'll be able to play this afternoon - 4-5 hours or so. If you want to play before then, go ahead jtsisyoda. It's not like there's an huge amount to do... The hardest choice seems to be "press the 6 key or the 2 key with the eastern scout."

	10-07-2004 13:22									#20
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

No, go ahead, I'm going to sleep now.