07-08-2004 14:00									#271
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quote: Originally posted by Guynemer I may not be the best person to talk about this, as I just finished the busiest month of my life, as intern in the newborn nursery, but... Frankly, this is a choice I'd like to see more women make. Optimally, more people would use birth control; but religion has done such a good job stigmatizing it that the majority of insurance programs won't cover BC pills or Depo-Provera or IUDs or anything else. I also have this thing about telling people what they can and can not do with their own bodies. I know, I'm nutty like that.

Was this an example of an unfortunate use of a pronoun, or did you just say you walked out of a newborn nursery wishing women had more abortions?

	09-08-2004 07:40									#272
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MM, if I told you how many babies I saw born to teen mothers, drug users, or women having their sixth kid at age 23, you wouldn't believe me.

	09-08-2004 07:47									#273
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quote: Originally posted by Ben Kenobi Sperm and egg cease to exist at conception, Skywalker. Therefore the term 'fertilised egg' is meaningless. Just use the word zygote.

I was responding to Urban Ranger. A "fertilized egg" is a zygote.

	09-08-2004 07:53									#274
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I saw a TV documentary on the weekend which showed an actual termination at 4 weeks. It didn't change my views.

	09-08-2004 07:59									#275
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quote: Originally posted by Guynemer MM, if I told you how many babies I saw born to teen mothers, drug users, or women having their sixth kid at age 23, you wouldn't believe me.

Do you think Obi Gyn has ever been in a crack baby ward, or babysat for one?

Had to treat a six month old H.I.V. + baby?

Fathered any children?

Had to make a decision between the mother's life and the life of the foetus?

Explain to a woman that the baby is going to come out disassembled?

I think he'd find a large dose of reality might make him a bit less quick to make assumptions about the motivations of women and doctors. Certainly my friend who worked in a mission hospital said that the neonatal/maternity part was the worst, bar nothing- physically, mentally and emotionally draining. She's in geriatric medicine now.

	09-08-2004 08:06									#276
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quote: Originally posted by molly bloom Had to make a decision between the mother's life and the life of the foetus?

That's a no brainer to me - the woman is more important - but many right to lifers actually put the interests of the unborn above the woman. It's a very telling sign of the attitudes to women which drive their position.

quote: I think he'd find a large dose of reality might make him a bit less quick to make assumptions about the motivations of women and doctors. Certainly my friend who worked in a mission hospital said that the neonatal/maternity part was the worst, bar nothing- physically, mentally and emotionally draining. She's in geriatric medicine now.

So true. People like this have very romantic, unrealistic and sanitised views of what birth is.

When one of my kids was born, a baby was born dead in the next room. Whilst I was filling out the birth certificate, the duty nurses were filling out a death certificate for that baby. On another occasion when my wife gave birth, a woman died giving birth in another room.

These are the sort of experiences that changed my views. Our Real life experience did not stack with the right to life theory.