07-08-2004 18:56									#1
	Best way to ensure army appearence? Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Long-time Civ player, but only recently started playing C3C seriously enough to get into the mechanics. I usually play Regent on 80% archi, wet, temp, stationary hordes, Persian.

As far as I can tell, it takes an elite unit winning a combat to produce a leader and thus an Army. Is there any rhyme to this reason? Is there any way to increase your chances for gaining leaders and thus armies?

I was playing last night and had to clean the smelly Mayans off my continent. I usually count on having at least one iron as a resource which makes the Persian Immortal rush basically unstoppable in the Ancient game. Hoplites stop them cold sometimes, but I'm rarely next to the Greeks.

Anyhoo...about 10 to 20 turns into this Immortal sweep I had at LEAST five elite Immortals. I kept trying to get them to turn into leaders, but to no avail. Here's a couple things I've noticed about rank increases with combat units, though (like going from regular to veteran, for instance)

1) Surviving consecutive attacks in the same turn.

2) Killing enemy units in consecutive turns.

3) Killing the last unit in a city.

This last one seems to be the one that gives me leaders most of the time. I cannot recall getting a leader out in the open, although it could just be the crackpipe talkin'.

Anyone have any ideas? I'm beginning to shift from a primarily "leave me alone so I can build up and research until I dominate you through tech...the better to wipe you out" player and more into an aggressive early expansionist. Gotta love those Persian Immortals. The creation of armies would definitely aid toward my new-found maniacal dictator persona.

	07-08-2004 19:08									#2
	Got spare money?

It's all just chance.

I'm sure someone will come here with the exact % in a minute. I want to say 1/16 but can't for sure.

The only thing that will boost that is after your first army wins a victory, you can build the heroic epic which increases chances of leaders. (I believe it increases to 1/12)

I've come to where I get more leaders in the open than in cities, but that's more likely because I take special care of the Elite units, don't want to risk them dying because I want the leaders.

Typically, find a unit in the open. Preferrably bombard it to where it's got 1-2 hp left, then hit it with an elite. Just protect your elites, and keep smacking units.

Militaristic can help in that it'll get you more elites quicker.

	08-08-2004 09:45									#3
	Support Apolyton

UnO is right. No trickie factors... on offense, elites have a 1/16 chance of generating an MGL, increased to 1/12 with the Heroic Epic. Ya just gotta keep banging away!!

	09-08-2004 17:28									#4
	Increase Your PM Length

Play larger worlds. Bigger worlds = more units = more battles = more elites = more armies.

You're lucky to get more than just a few armies through combat in small or medium worlds.

	09-08-2004 18:25									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

On defense the odds are a bit lower, but I'm not sure of th exact odds.

	09-08-2004 19:06									#6
	Put an end to popups!

Yep thats your chances so if you want to increase the chances of getting a great leader then pray to the RNG gods

	10-08-2004 00:35									#7
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Well, the best way is to reload but I don't think that's what you meant

	10-08-2004 01:47									#8
	Put an end to popups!

Creating and Using Leaders, by SirPleb.

Written for PTW, but the leader generation mechanics are the same for C3C.

	10-08-2004 05:45									#9
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Well, MGL's can't rush improvements or wonders in C3C. Otherwise, yeah, it's the same.

	10-08-2004 06:18									#10
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Yes, but they're generated the same, so the strategies to get them are the same.

	11-08-2004 23:19									#11
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

MGLs can rush improvements and small wonders in Conquests, just not Great Wonders.

The best way, I find, is to learn to baby your elite units. Use the elites as "finishers" to kill off the last, beat up units in your path. Use bombard units to soften units for your elites to kill. If you do not *need* to prosecute a war quickly, don't! Use "lazy war" (Catt's term, IIRC). Fight slower, giving the AI more opportunity to produce units for you to kill (this typically applies AFTER you've cut them off from any particularly useful strategic resources - basically, drag the war out once you've clearly won). Wait for your elites to heal before marching on the next city. Stuff like that.

-Arrian

	12-08-2004 00:20									#12
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Well praying to the RNG goods helps as well.

Great post Arrian. Ive done that before, but I dont think I could have articulated it as well as you could have.