10-08-2004 21:24									#1
	Pop based factions Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

I had been wanting a faction whose strength was population and had gone through a few variations. The wild card in a pop faction, is the pop-booming. Pop booming too early allows a faction to run away with the game.

I think the whole population based faction is attractive because it is one angle that hasn't really been done in the game. I have three pop based factions that have been swimming in my head for a while now. Chew on these and give me your opinions. Everything about these are prototype, including the names (which aren't all that good), I have not yet even plugged these into a faction editor, so it is likely there are mistakes.

Aquafarmers
Builder equivelent of Pirates that is pop boomable. Aquafarmers are a collective of farmers which took to the sea to avoid the constant raids by waring factions.

+1 Police: {Crave stabiblity over freedoms}
FREE UNIT: Sea Terraformer
Enhancements may be built in ocean and trench squares with the discovery of Advanced Ecological Engineering: {Trained for life at sea}
Sea colony pod & sea former prototypes FREE: {Advanced oceanic technology}
Bonus mineral from ocean shelf squares: {Culture and technology adapted for the ocean}
Free Tech: Doctrine: Flexibility
Free Tech: Centuari Ecology
No Priorities or Adversions


Planet Cancer
A paranoid splinter group which believes that Planet wants to kill off the invader humans, and the best way to insure human surival is to quickly spread to every corner of Planet much like a virus.

+2 Efficency {Narrowly specific societial goal}
+4 Fungus Food Production {Blind willingness to eat fungus in order to spread}
-3 Planet {Planet senses the Cancer's intent and actively seeks to eliminate them}
-2 Support {Most support goes into building colony pods}
-1 Economy {Hastily developed infrastructure}
Free Tech: Social Psych
May not use Green {Growth resricted}
May not use Cybernetic {Again, slowed reproduction}
Interested in Pop growth
Use Force: Sometimes


edit: Upon further review I realised the Planet Cancer is just a weakened version of the Gaians. I will try to come up with a "grows out" style pop faction and repost it here.


Metropolotians
The ultimate in OCC style SMACing. A loose confederation of megacity-states that build up, rather than out.

-4 Efficiency {Redundacy between each city-state}
May excede hab complex by 10 {Mega-Highrise structures}
+1 Economy {Concentrated markets}
+1 Research {Upper class education system)
-1 Industry {Little room for industry}
Free Tech: Biogenetics
Interested in Pop growth
No Priorities or Adversions
Use Force: No

Last edited by livid imp on 25-09-2004 at 01:59

	10-08-2004 21:46									#2
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I dont think you can harvest from fungus if you have a negative planet rating.

was that done on purpose?

	10-08-2004 21:52									#3
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You should give the planet cancer thing a psi bonus of perhaps 50% however, since they would be skilled at eliminating native life. Overall effect would be about 20% combat bonus in fighting. And try actually giving some of the factions a growth bonus?

	10-08-2004 22:29									#4
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Aquafarmers faction sounds cool. Kind of a Svensgaard on steroids. You might wanna throw at least one negative in there, but otherwise sounds good.

I believe that the Planet Cancer faction would only get 1 nutrient from fungus because of the -3 planet, so it's kind of counterproductive. Maybe if it was just -2 planet, it would work better. Then, they'd get 3 nuts from the fungus, but would still have some trouble fighting worms. And then change that +2 efficiency to +2 growth, and I think they'd be great.

Metropolitans sounds really cool.

Have you looked at my "Familial Tribes" faction? It's a real growth monster, even from the very start of the game it has +4 growth, but it has plenty of penalties to balance it out. They are also flexible - build or conquer strategies work equally well. And the huge specialist bases that you could have by mid-late game after nutrient satellites!!! This faction would be weak with the AI, but very strong with a human player, I would think.

The Familial Hordes

+2 Growth - Society puts heavy emphasis on family life and encourages large families
-2 Research - Society tends to stick with old family traditions and customs, and is reluctant to adopt new technology
-1 Support - Faction dislikes diverting local community resources to support units in the field
-1 Econ - Most business transactions are at a small scale, local level, and families prefer to do business with people they know instead of huge megacorporations
-2 Probe - Society is very welcoming and open

Agenda: Planned - Citizenry likes to make sure that their communities and families will receive the resources they need.
Aversion: Green - Citizenry dislikes any regulations that restrict the gathering of resources for their families and communities.

Faction gets a free children's cheche in every base. - Emphasis on family care and development.
Faction can exceed hab limits by 10. - People are used to cramped living quarters.
Faction starts with social psych

Last edited by Zeiter on 10-08-2004 at 22:51

	10-08-2004 22:47									#5
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quote: Originally posted by Whoha I dont think you can harvest from fungus if you have a negative planet rating. was that done on purpose?

Yes, the theory is (and god knows I really don't know for sure) that the +4 fungus and the -3 planet will equate to a +1 fungus production. I admit I have no idea if this will work out or not. I meant to test it last night but I have a very busy family life at home.

The idea was to allow easy spreading while still leaving the mindworms as a major challenge. That is also the reason I didn't add a Psi bonus Natalinasmpf.

And no, Growth bonuses are very easy to be imbalancing, I left them out very intentionally.

	11-08-2004 00:06									#6
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quote: Originally posted by Zeiter Aquafarmers faction sounds cool. Kind of a Svensgaard on steroids. You might wanna throw at least one negative in there, but otherwise sounds good.

Actually it is the Pirates without their military bonuses and the SE differences. Keep in mind once aquafarmers hit the land all they get is a +1 police, so not too terribly strong.

quote: Originally posted by Zeiter I believe that the Planet Cancer faction would only get 1 nutrient from fungus because of the -3 planet, so it's kind of counterproductive. Maybe if it was just -2 planet, it would work better. Then, they'd get 3 nuts from the fungus, but would still have some trouble fighting worms. And then change that +2 efficiency to +2 growth, and I think they'd be great.

As I posted earlier, the 1 nut from fungus was what I was going for, not 4. The 4 was to negate the -3 planet. Not very elegant, but it gets the job done. +2 Growth? No way. Once they got Demo/Planned they would be unstoppable. Constant pop boom with 2 nuts in every patch of fungus, scarey. This faction was designed to growth out, not up.

quote: Metropolitans sounds really cool.

Yea, they are my favorite of the lot too.

quote: Originally posted by Zeiter Have you looked at my "Familial Tribes" faction?

Yes I saw it when you posted it earlier. At first I thought it is a good design, but I am now thinking it might be a little too strong even with all the penalties. Being able to pop-boom that fast (I believe) would more than make up for the penalties. Really the only way we'll know for sure is by play-testing.

	19-08-2004 12:22									#7
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

A cool thing I think that could balence pop factions would be +2 Growth and -2 Planet and -1 Efficiency. They both are major penalties that realy harm the factions ability to deal with late-game problems. So they get the large bases, but they also get more problems.

But a Pop Faction SHOULD be like the believers or spartans, in that it's realy an early game thing for them, y'know? Since they get the perks of huge pop very early, they should get the consequinces of having a large population much harder.