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Boris Godunov
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Portland, OR
Aug 2001
time: 00:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe
I see now,
Bravery equates to intelligence.
If one is smart enough to see that the fight is nonwinnable soon enough, then one is brave by not fighting.
OTOH, If one is unwise enough to attempt to fight the inevitable then one is a coward.
Finally, some would argue Clinton was brave to fight the good fight against the evil vindictive repubs.
Got it.  |
You're saying Nixon was stupid? I don't think he was, just corrupt and sleazy and, well, evil. We know for a fact he clung on to power until it was made clear to him by his own friends that he had no hope of overcoming an impeachment trial. How does that make him brave?
Had Nixon done the same path as McGreevey, I'd give him some marks for courage. Had, when the scandal broke, he had fessed up and stepped down, sure, I'd say he acted with some bravery. But he did nothing of the kind and put the country through the wringer to delay the inevitable. No, Nixon wasn't stupid, he was just power-hungry.
McGreevey's political future was by no means assuredly defunct, as far as we know. Even moreso not to the degree that he would be unable to finish his term. I'm sure many people, had they been his position (like Nixon, Clinton), would have clung on longer and tried to fight it, draggin the state through the mud.
So, Ogie, were McGreevey's reasonings as he stated instead of out of political cowardice, would appearances be any different? If not, isn't your harping on it just, oh, politically-motivated speculation? Seems so!
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Ogie Oglethorpe
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Marietta, GA
Dec 1999
time: 05:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Boris Godunov
You're saying Nixon was stupid? I don't think he was, just corrupt and sleazy and, well, evil. We know for a fact he clung on to power until it was made clear to him by his own friends that he had no hope of overcoming an impeachment trial. |
Isn't that by definition a gross overestimation of his position and hence a stupid one in this instance.
quote:
McGreevey's political future was by no means assuredly defunct, as far as we know. Even moreso not to the degree that he would be unable to finish his term. I'm sure many people, had they been his position (like Nixon, Clinton), would have clung on longer and tried to fight it, draggin the state through the mud.
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Rest assured this was not a decision made in a vaccuum. I can almost guarantee advisors on state and national level weighed in on the matter. And very likely in their opinion the situation was likely untenable. Also rest assure the decision to resign was not done for the greater good of the residents of NJ but again IMO the greater good of the Dem party.
quote:
If not, isn't your harping on it just, oh, politically-motivated speculation? Seems so! |
No arguement. The indulgence of political speculation is party and parcel for these forums, no?
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Boris Godunov
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Portland, OR
Aug 2001
time: 00:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Well, only if you think the real scandal was his sexual preference  . I think the REAL scandal here was the corruption investigation against him and his staff. |
It might be that that is the case, but until there's solid evidence to the contrary, I'm willing to take McGreevey at his word wrt to why he is resigning. After all, the scandals have been around for months, but he hasn't moved. I'm willing to bet that the whole reason his lover was put into the security post was out of a similar form of blackmail (which is distressing enough, actually), so it's conceivable he could have had the "I'm gay!" out well before this instance.
But again, if he's really resigning because he wants to deal with his personal problems instead of being Governor, would it appear any different? I don't think it would, and people are going to second-guess the reasons regardless.
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Boris Godunov
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Portland, OR
Aug 2001
time: 00:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe
Isn't that by definition a gross overestimation of his position and hence a stupid one in this instance. |
Overestimation != stupid. At the point where Nixon was compared to where McGreevey was 2 days ago, it was entirely reasonable to believe he could ride things out and carry on. But he knew he was guilty and continued to lie to people about his involvement, even until his death.
quote:
Rest assured this was not a decision made in a vaccuum. I can almost guarantee advisors on state and national level weighed in on the matter. And very likely in their opinion the situation was likely untenable. |
Everything I've read is that he consulted with just a handful of close friends and advisors before he made his decision, and that he also did so very quickly after learning about the pending lawsuit.
quote:
Also rest assure the decision to resign was not done for the greater good of the residents of NJ but again IMO the greater good of the Dem party. |
Maybe, but I also think it's best for NJ. What's the point of going through the massive taxpayer expense of a special election in 3 months to elect someone who will then serve just a few months before having to start campaigning for the 2005 election?
At any rate, what I took issue with more than anything was your second-guessing his reasons for getting married and having a family and being closeted. Until you've been in such a situation, you're talking out of your ass.
But hey, here's my own political punditry: Republicans are just steaming mad that they lost a punching bag and a potential black eye for the Dems and are now just *****ing and moaning out of their own politically ineffectual way in NJ. It's all they can do, and they know it, so they'll take as many cheap shots as they can.
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Boris Godunov
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Portland, OR
Aug 2001
time: 00:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
I don't think that resigning because he had a gay affair really passes the smell test. Clinton had an affair and survived, and NJ is a fairly liberal state and wouldn't go all nuts on a homosexual governor. It could be because he was going to get sued by Cipel (ties to the corruption), but that exactly wasn't why he said he was resigning (though it could fit in where he doesn't want the office to be attacked). |
And it could be that he is resigning to devote his energies to fixing his family situation and personal life, and that trying to do that would impede his ability to be governor. He's got kids to deal with, not to mention the wife, rest of his family, friends, etc. I don't think I could be effective in my job, especially as governor, were I going through such things.
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Boris Godunov
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Portland, OR
Aug 2001
time: 00:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe
Why? Aside from the empathy you feel towards his situation, why does that preclude me from discussing a public figure, his 'personal' life, or how it impacts his ability to govern?
As far as I know when you are a politician, your entire life becomes open to scrutiny like it or not as it reflects the integrity of you and how you will represent your constituancy. Does my lack of familiarity with the subject matter deny me my right to question his motivation? |
It's not about you questioning his motivation to resign so much as you questioning his motivation to lead the life he has up until this point. You didn't ask any questions, you just assumed the worst about his intentions and actions wrt his personal life. Nobody said you didn't have the right to question them, but don't cry and whine when your doing so exposes your complete lack of understanding of the situation. Unless you're contending that every gay person who has gotten married has done so for a sleazy, disingenuous and dishonest purpose. Are you?
quote:
Any other thought policing you wish to enforce? |
So my objecting to your pontificating about a subject on which you are admittingly ignorant is "thought policing?" I don't recall demanding you think a certain way, dear Ogie, only that you refrain from making aspertions until you know the whole story.
quote:
You've seemingly gotten the Doublespeak down with such mottos as:
Bravery through surrender.
and
Cowardice through resistance. |
Yeah, lord knows my position wasn't qualified or bit more complicated or anything. You yourself seem to have mastered the art of Black or White thought. Congratulations to you! 
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Ogie Oglethorpe
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Marietta, GA
Dec 1999
time: 05:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Boris Godunov
It's not about you questioning his motivation to resign so much as you questioning his motivation to lead the life he has up until this point. You didn't ask any questions, you just assumed the worst about his intentions and actions wrt his personal life. Nobody said you didn't have the right to question them, but don't cry and whine when your doing so exposes your complete lack of understanding of the situation. Unless you're contending that every gay person who has gotten married has done so for a sleazy, disingenuous and dishonest purpose. Are you?
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Nope just for the politican ones which to now has been on the money.
Seriously, I used the factoid that his previous inlaws knew of his sexual orientation therefor so did he. It is an easy extension to jump towards. (You raise points regarding that assumption which may or may not be the case. You'll pardon me if I naturally think the worst of pols in general) That being said the rest follows. Speculation. Damn right! And I really see no problem with that.
quote:
So my objecting to your pontificating about a subject on which you are admittingly ignorant is "thought policing?" I don't recall demanding you think a certain way, dear Ogie, only that you refrain from making aspertions until you know the whole story.
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I see, I can think anything I want just can't say it? 
Really the point I keep coming back to my Dear Boris is that OT represents nothing more than a series of speculations. Why should I refrain or be in any way limited from making those speculations for whatever reason. I suspect were I to refer to the views of another 'poly member that once stated that freedom of speech does not necessarily mean freedom from being offended. (or words to that effect) Am I now less deserving of my ability to voice them than any other 'poly member? You certainly have the right to ignore or discredit them.
As I have previously stated your arguements have not dissuaded me but I respect the fact that you have them and made an effort to state them.
(In any event, I truly mean no offense btw)
quote:
Yeah, lord knows my position wasn't qualified or bit more complicated or anything. You yourself seem to have mastered the art of Black or White thought. Congratulations to you! |
I obviously know that but it is good to see what rise I can get out of you.
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Boris Godunov
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Portland, OR
Aug 2001
time: 00:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe
Nope just for the politican ones which to now has been on the money. |
Cop out. If you think McGreevey is sleazy and disengenous based on his being gay and married, why isn't that true for all gay people who get married?
quote:
Seriously, I used the factoid that his previous inlaws knew of his sexual orientation therefor so did he. It is an easy extension to jump towards. |
I'd also add that his previous inlaws asserted to uncertain terms that the failure of his first marriage had nothing to do with his sexuality.
quote:
Speculation. Damn right! And I really see no problem with that. |
If I were to speculate, sans proof, that you got married and had kids solely out of political ambition, would you not see a problem with that? What if I speculated you got married because you wanted to hide being gay? Or I speculated you got married to try and suppress your secret desire to rape women?
quote:
I see, I can think anything I want just can't say it? |
Yes, I had proposed a rule saying you can't say it. Can I not criticize you for speaking out of your ass, huh? HUH?! Don't try and limit my free speech!
quote:
Really the point I keep coming back to my Dear Boris is that OT represents nothing more than a series of speculations. |
Does it? I see plenty of people citing sources and presenting supporting facts for what they write. Don't try and wiggle out of your making unfounded assumptions on a cop out like, "everybody does it!" Not everyone does, and certainly not about an issue like this.
quote:
I respect the fact that you have them and made an effort to state them.
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Low standards for respecting an argument...I certainly don't abide by them. I respect arguments based on, you know, facts.
quote:
I obviously know that but it is good to see what rise I can get out of you. |
You couldn't get a bigger rise out of me than a naked Janet Reno spread out on the hood of a sports car could. I'm unemployed, at home cleaning house and bored, which is why I even bothered.
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Whoha
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The TOC is supposed to be classified guys...
Dec 2001
time: 23:34
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"McGreevey's political future was by no means assuredly defunct"
Nope, hes dead:
http://www.nypost.com/news/regionalnews/26824.htm
"N.J. GOVERNOR RESIGNS OVER GAY AFFAIR WITH AIDE IN $5M BLACKMAIL FLAP
By ANDY GELLER, DAN MANGAN and STEFAN C. FRIEDMAN
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
HAND IN HAND:
Gov. Jim McGreevey and wife Dina leave the statehouse in Trenton after his stunning announcement yesterday.
AP
Email Archives
Print Reprint
August 13, 2004 -- New Jersey Democratic Gov. Jim McGreevey stunned the nation yesterday by announcing he is resigning because he is gay and had an extramarital affair with a man who aides said tried to blackmail him for up to $5 million.
"My truth is that I am a gay American," McGreevey, a twice married father of two, declared at a Trenton news conference.
"I engaged in an adult consensual affair with another man, which violates my bonds of matrimony," said the governor, a Catholic, with his second wife, Dina, and his parents at his side.
"It was wrong. It was foolish. It was inexcusable."
McGreevey did not detail what the "circumstances surrounding the affair" were.
But sources told The Post — and The Associated Press also reported — that the man involved in the affair was Golan Cipel, 35, an Israeli poet whom McGreevey hired in 2002 as his homeland security adviser, setting off a firestorm of criticism.
And Channel 4 quoted a federal law-enforcement official as saying Cipel tried to extort $5 million from the governor.
A senior McGreevey political adviser said that three weeks ago, Cipel tried to blackmail the governor by threatening to file a sex-harassment suit.
"A demand was made for millions of dollars," the adviser said. "Unless these monies were paid, the governor would be exposed to charges of sexual harassment and worse. Therefore it was turned over to appropriate law enforcement."
The adviser said a lawyer for Cipel "indicated that should the money be paid, Cipel would disappear until after the 2005 election."
A second source, a high-ranking member of the McGreevey administration, said Cipel made several threats about a suit and demanded "an exorbitant sum of money to make it go away."
There were widespread reports that Cipel planned to file the sex-harassment suit today.
McGreevey said that in doing his job, it would have made "little difference" that he was gay.
"In fact, having the ability to truthfully set forth my identity might have enabled me to be more forthright in fulfilling and discharging my constitutional obligations," he contended.
But he added, "Given the circumstances surrounding the affair and its likely impact upon my family and my ability to govern, I have decided the right course of action is to resign."
The governor, a former Woodbridge, N.J., mayor who took office 21/2 years ago, said he would leave his post on Nov. 15 to provide an orderly transition.
The choice of the date means no special election will be held and state Senate President Richard Codey will become acting governor.
Former Republican Gov. Christie Whitman criticized McGreevey's plan to wait until Nov. 15, saying it "smacks of politics." She said it "would be in the best interests of the state" for the governor to step aside immediately.
Cipel met McGreevey in 2000 when the former suburban mayor visited Israel.
Cipel, who spent five years in the Israeli navy, served as assistant to the press officer of the Israeli Consulate office in Manhattan from 1995 to 1999.
He then returned to Israel and became the spokesman for the Israeli town of Rishon Letzion.
In a Jan. 19, 2001, interview in a local Israeli paper, Zman Mekoni, Cipel described his meeting with McGreevey.
"I told him I knew everything about his campaign. Probably he liked the way I thought. When I was in the United States a month ago, I met him again and he told me I would come to work for him."
Cipel's selection as homeland security adviser — at a salary of $110,000 a year — proved highly controversial because as a foreign national, he couldn't get a federal security clearance.
Cipel was reassigned as a special counsel — at the same salary — and left the governor's employ in August 2000.
At the news conference, McGreevey said his sexuality and his affair left the governor's office vulnerable.
"I am removing these threats by telling you directly about my sexuality," he said.
"Let me be clear: I accept total and full responsibility for my actions. However, I am required to do now to do what is right to correct the consequences of my actions."
The governor said he had felt sexual ambivalence since boyhood.
"From my early days in school, until the present day, I acknowledged some feelings, a certain sense that separated me from others," he said.
"Thinking that I was doing the right thing, I forced what I thought was an acceptable reality onto myself, a reality which is layered and layered with all the, quote, good things, and all the, quote, right things of typical adolescent and adult behavior.
"Yet, at my most reflective, maybe even spiritual level, there were points in my life when I began to question what an acceptable reality really meant for me. Were there realities from which I was running? Which master was I trying to serve?" he said.
McGreevey's first wife, Kari, and daughter, Morag, live in British Columbia. He has a 2-year-old daughter, Jacqueline, with Dina.
As governor, McGreevey proudly discussed his Catholic faith but disagreed with church leaders over his support for abortion rights and same-sex partnerships. He pushed for the state's domestic-partnership law, which went into effect this year.
McGreevey took office in January 2002 and despite inheriting a $5 billion budget deficit, he steadfastly refused to boost income taxes for most New Jerseyans, instead raising taxes on millionaires and casinos.
Born in Jersey City, McGreevey graduated from Columbia University in 1978 and earned a law degree from Georgetown in 1981 and a master's degree in education from Harvard University.
Additional reporting by Liz Kelley and Perry Chiaramonte "
I think the bolded stuff speaks for itself. But thats not going to stop me, I would love for someone to ask if the condition this israeli set for not coming forward was the Homeland security post.
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Ogie Oglethorpe
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Marietta, GA
Dec 1999
time: 05:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Boris Godunov
Cop out. If you think McGreevey is sleazy and disengenous based on his being gay and married, why isn't that true for all gay people who get married?
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I allow for your arguements that some are not aware of their sexual preferences. I do not think this the case. Marriage of convenience is disingenuous no matter what the cause especially if one partner thinks the other is genuinely attracted to them.
quote:
I'd also add that his previous inlaws asserted to uncertain terms that the failure of his first marriage had nothing to do with his sexuality.
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Which really has what if anything to do with whether or not McGreevey knew of his orientation?
quote:
If I were to speculate, sans proof, that you got married and had kids solely out of political ambition, would you not see a problem with that? What if I speculated you got married because you wanted to hide being gay? Or I speculated you got married to try and suppress your secret desire to rape women?
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You of course are free to do so. It wouldn't be appropriate to do so because I am not a public figure, nor have you seen heard or read of me. Plus there is this little thing called moderators that would likely think it a personal attack likely ending up getting you a Mingapulcan vacation.
quote:
Yes, I had proposed a rule saying you can't say it. Can I not criticize you for speaking out of your ass, huh? HUH?! Don't try and limit my free speech!
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quote:
Does it? I see plenty of people citing sources and presenting supporting facts for what they write. Don't try and wiggle out of your making unfounded assumptions on a cop out like, "everybody does it!" Not everyone does, and certainly not about an issue like this.
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Whats so special about this issue? Why is it reseverved? Your closeness and empathy to the issue while my lack thereof, I believe is the real point.
Quoting stats and sources is something I do as well. Heres a neat statistical exercise since your at home with little to do. Shall we do a count of posts and see what are speculative without sources vs. those with. I guarantee the sheer volume of unsubstatiated speculation far outweighs the posts with quoted sources etc.
quote:
Low standards for respecting an argument...I certainly don't abide by them. I respect arguments based on, you know, facts.
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Which to date in this arguement have been I know a guy and have friends that are so and so. More anecdotal than hard factual if you take my meaning.
The respect shown is not for the arguement but moreover for civility of the forums.
quote:
You couldn't get a bigger rise out of me than a naked Janet Reno spread out on the hood of a sports car could. I'm unemployed, at home cleaning house and bored, which is why I even bothered. |
Janet is rather testosterone laden so....
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Barinthus
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A Magical Moment...
Jan 2004
time: 21:34
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Just in...
quote:
Man Says McGreevey Made Sexual Advances
By JOHN CURRAN, Associated Press Writer
TRENTON, N.J. - Gov. James E. McGreevey began suffering fallout from his bombshell resignation announcement Friday as his former homeland security adviser accused the governor of sexual harassment and Republican leaders called on him to leave office immediately.
"While employed by one of the most powerful politicians in the country, New Jersey Governor McGreevey, I was the victim of repeated sexual advances by him," Golan Cipel said in a statement read by his attorney during a news conference in New York. The attorney added that McGreevey has made Cipel the victim of a "smear campaign."
McGreevey announced his resignation Thursday in a dramatic, nationally televised news conference in which he revealed he had an affair with another man. His spokesman, Micah Rasmussen, vehemently denied the accusations, calling them "completely and totally false allegations from a person trying to exploit his relationship with the governor. The matter has been referred to federal authorities for investigation."
McGreevey did not name the man in his news conference, but two sources close to the governor, both speaking on condition of anonymity, said it was Cipel. One of the sources, a high-ranking member of the McGreevey administration, said Cipel threatened McGreevey with a sexual harassment lawsuit unless he was paid millions of dollars.
McGreevey named Cipel as New Jersey's $110,000-a-year director of homeland security in 2002. But Cipel was transferred to a different position later that year after a storm of opposition from lawmakers who questioned his qualifications and later left state government.
Cipel, a poet and former lieutenant in the Israeli Navy, landed the job despite having no security experience, and he raised concerns among government agents who reportedly refused to share information with him because was a foreigner with no security clearance.
The saga took another strange turn Friday as Cipel alleged "intimidation" by McGreevey representatives cowed him into keeping quiet about the affair until now. Cipel attorney Allen M. Lowy said his client was offered money by representatives of McGreevey after the governor was informed of a possible lawsuit. He said "only time will tell" whether a lawsuit against McGreevey is filed.
"After a long period of pain and introspection, I realized that in order to live my life, to move forward with my life, I needed to put this behind me. But the only way to do this was to have Gov. McGreevey take responsibility publicly for his horrible actions, which he did by resigning from public office," Cipel said.
The developments occurred as Republican leaders called on McGreevey to leave office immediately, saying that news of the affair is likely to be first of many damaging disclosures.
"It is my suspicion that there will be more awkward stories in the days and weeks to come — stories that will make it very difficult for him to carry out the duties of his office," said state Republican Chairman Joe Kyrillos.
Had McGreevey stepped down immediately, a special election would be have been held to serve out the remainder of his term, which ends in January 2006. The decision to leave office in November allows Democratic Senate President Richard J. Codey to finish the term.
Democrats said GOP leaders were unfairly trying to capitalize on what was McGreevey's personal decision.
"This is the time for the people's business, not for partisan politics," Codey said.
Republican lawyers said they were considering legal options that would force McGreevey to resign earlier, but added that pursuing impeachment was not one of them.
McGreevey's resignation brings an end to a political career that has been marked by a series of scandals and missteps, including the Cipel appointment.
McGreevey was introduced to Cipel at a reception during a trip to Israel in 2000 when he was running for governor. The married American politician and the young Israeli poet were introduced at a wine-and-cheese reception and hit it off immediately, according to an Israeli mayor who introduced the two.
Soon, McGreevey paved the way for Cipel to come to the United States. Six months later, Cipel was working on McGreevey's campaign, having obtained a visa in which he listed McGreevey donor Charles Kushner as a sponsor on his visa application and then taking up residence in an apartment less than a mile from McGreevey.
Working first in a $30,000-a-year job public relations job arranged by Kushner, Cipel was named to head the state Office of Homeland Security in February 2002.
McGreevey said he did not think a background check was necessary for Cipel, who had also worked as a public relations officer in the Israeli consulate in New York.
"Golan is smart, incisive, hard-working and trustworthy, and he has brought a unique point of view to the work he does," McGreevey said at the time.
But nagging questions about his qualifications and the reason for his appointment trailed Cipel, who was told by McGreevey not to grant media interviews in the meantime.
Asked by reporters on several occasions if he was gay or had a romantic relationship with Cipel, McGreevey would never answer directly, dismissing the suggestion as "ridiculous."
The heat was turned up after the Star-Ledger of Newark reported that the U.S. Secret Service and the FBI (news - web sites) had both refused to share information with Cipel because of his lack of security clearance.
Buckling to pressure, McGreevey reassigned him as a "special counsel" in the governor's office. He left state government five months later and landed a public relations job with McGreevey's help before fading from public view.
"The rumor mill, even back then, was rampant with rumors about some relationship with him and the governor, but that wasn't our issue," said GOP Assemblyman Paul DiGaetano.
"The issue was here's a guy being put forward for one of the most sensitive positions in the state, with little or no experience, little or no credentials. The whole activity was very suspicious," said DiGaetano, who has filed to run for governor next year.
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The Mad Monk
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of Ice Cream
Mar 2000
time: 23:34
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...and now it's in the open:
quote:
Party nudges McGreevey toward door
Tue Aug 17,10:08 AM ET
By Rick Hampson, USA TODAY
A number of New Jersey Democratic and Republican leaders finally agree on something: Gov. James McGreevey, who appointed a man who aides have said was his gay lover to a high-paying anti-terrorism job, should resign sooner than planned.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
When he announced last week that he was gay and had a homosexual affair, McGreevey, 47, a married father of two, said he would step down Nov. 15. That meant the state Senate president would become governor for nearly a year. The deadline for a special election is Sept. 3.
Since the Senate president, Richard Codey, is a Democrat, Republicans are howling. Editorial pages across the state also have urged McGreevey to quit now.
Now some state Democratic leaders are working behind the scenes to force McGreevey aside. They want to avoid more political damage to the party. And they want U.S. Sen. Jon Corzine (news, bio, voting record) to run in a special election this November because he would be the early favorite.
In a short campaign against a Republican opponent, Corzine would be formidable, if only because of name recognition. He spent $63 million of his own money to win his Senate race in 2000. He probably would not even need his personal wealth in a short campaign.
"If the Democrats have Corzine in the bag, there's no way McGreevey will stay," said Alan Rosenthal, a Rutgers University political scientist.
Last Thursday, McGreevey declared himself "a gay American." He said he was resigning because he had violated his marriage vows by having the affair, which affects his ability to do his job.
The man in question is Golan Cipel, an Israeli whom McGreevey appointed to a $110,000-a-year job as state homeland security adviser without a background check. Cipel, however, says he's not gay and was a victim of McGreevey's unsolicited advances.
Corzine, 57, heads Democrats' effort to win a U.S. Senate majority from Republicans, who hold a 51-48 edge. He is a potential Senate Democratic leader or member of a John Kerry (news - web sites) administration. So why would he trade Washington for Trenton? Three theories:
•Patronage. The governor is New Jersey's only statewide elected official and by some measures is the most powerful state chief executive in the nation. For instance, the governor appoints the attorney general, who in turn appoints county prosecutors.
•Loyalty. Corzine has established a reputation as a consensus builder and team player. If it's the party's will that he run for governor, he might oblige. "The question is, what kind of leverage do the party leaders have with him?" said Peter Woolley, a Fairleigh Dickinson University political analyst.
•Ambition. The former Goldman Sachs vice chairman might enjoy being in charge, rather than working with 99 equals in the Senate. "In his bones, he's an executive," Rosenthal said.
As governor, Corzine would appoint his successor in the Senate until the next general election - most likely Rep. Bob Menendez. But his own tenure would be limited to five years, instead of as many as eight if he could wait and run for a full term in 2005.
New Jersey voters are not clamoring for McGreevey's departure. In a Fairleigh Dickinson University poll released Monday, 48% said he should leave immediately, and 41% said Nov. 15 is the right date. The poll found nearly half believe he's resigning because of corruption, compared with 8% who said it's because he's gay and 11% who said it's because of the affair.
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http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=sto...ddoor&printer=1
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13-08-2004 22:25
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