03-04-2000 19:58									#1
	Just a thought about diplomatic negotiations Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

First I was thinking that u wrote in plain text to your neighbours. But that would be too complicated so then a came to think of an other idea.

The negotiation window should include many things. U have the chatwindow in the middle and small buttons containing what options u have. U also have a list containg what your advisors want and what your people want.

These things can u do:
- Flatter/Criticize/appease
- Ask/Suggest/Demand/Instruct
- Propose agreement
- Trade/Exchange/Buy/Sell

I think I need an example to show what i mean:

We assume that u want to trade techs with your enemy. U open the negotiation window and greets him welcome. Then u click on the 'flatter' button and choose one of the alternatives that show up under the chatwindow, to make him more cooperative. Then u press at the exchange button and choose the alternative technology. The rival civ wants to know what technology u want. This is where my idea gets interesting.
Beacouse u have a window containing everything that u might want to trade if the price is the right. And so has he...

I'm not good at explaining this but i hope u understand the idea.

	04-04-2000 05:01									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

I don't know, the idea of a flatter button becomes a little annoying, it would just become a routine part of negotiating and become annoying after a while, maybe we could have some kind of "tone" setting where you could ajust your tone of voice and the way you say things. This could replace mood when speaking, alowing a nice amount of deceit in negotiating.

	05-04-2000 00:52									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

I like the mood idea.

But u should be able to both flatter and critizice your neighbors. Suck up to them will not necessary mean that they will be more cooperative (just like humans don't).

	05-04-2000 10:07									#4
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Well there is also the saying flattery will get you nowhere, and if you do it too often, it tends to wear down. Also if you do it a lot it can hurt you in some instances. FE flattering a hated enemy will likely think you're mocking him.

	06-04-2000 01:11									#5
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I still don't know about flattery...although I would very much enjoy a feature to criticize his goverment or actions. These criticisims could be at different levels, say, just saying "I don't agree with your use coal mines in your country" but not actually making a big deal about it because you aren't realy that enviromental and your nowhere near the country so the smog won't hurt you very much. This would vary in influence depending on your county's power and respectiblity, and of course your relations with the other country and the amount of trade and investments the other country has in your economy.
And you could have something at the other end of the spectrum you could say "pull your forces out of egypt or we'll be forced to go on the offensive. Such threats would depend a great deal on your reputation (whether you will or won't stick to your word), goverment (people will be less afraid of a democratic goverment because there's a chance it won't pass), military might (obviosly), and invested interests (whether they think you really would care that much about the region).
The absance of this system was most obvios in SMAC where other countries could criticise your government but you could have no say about there's.

	06-04-2000 02:15									#6
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While I agree with you on the critisizing part, flattery can be a way of getting something done. However rathering than having say a button, I think the suggestion about conducting meetings in differnt moods would be better. FE an submissive mood would put on heavy flattery and could really help if your civ is just about to be crushed or you need there help for something and the country has an overinflated ego. Things like this go on all the time, even when a country knows it could beet the crap out of that other country. On the other side we have something like dominating and aggresive. These would be hurt by flattery so it isn't used. Instead its used more for your example on moving troops out of egypt.

You can still put whatever agendas you want reguadless of the mood used, its simply put in a differnt way. Now since most players will want to control the negotiations directly they can temp deviate from there mood, however this usually comes at a price. FE demanding (ie in a more forceful manner) something in a submissive mood will generally give the impression that your not really that submissive. On the other side, backing down on your agressiveness to may help with that issue, but may make other issues where your more aggressive harder because they might believe your bluffing.

Anyway there could be combinations or say 2 moods used at one time. FE submissive and noncomittal or agrresive and diplomatic. This has a lot more potential than a simple flattery button and allows you to both critisize and flatter your opposing civs to get the results you want (hopefully).