19-09-2004 17:32									#91
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...

...arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr...

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	19-09-2004 17:43									#92
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quote: Originally posted by Geronimo The more freshwater that is removed from the oceans (either through 'natural' evaporation or artifical means) the saltier the oceans will have to become.

Arrr, this be no problem. IIRC, something like 99% of the world's water be in the oceans.

	19-09-2004 18:11									#93
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The water we desalinate in this manner will eventually end up back in the oceans.

Any global warming effects from removing reflective deserts should be countered by increased cloud cover as water from post desert farms evaporates. You cover the world's deserts with farmers fields and world rainfall will increase.

Btw, you can forget SoCal in this. Turning deserts into farmland will cause the three toed horny lizard to become endangered. After that frigging owl bit there's no way us Oregonians are going to let em get away with it. We'll be down south with big signs 'Save the Horny Lizard, DOWN with water desalinization', just to get even.

	19-09-2004 21:27									#94
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Now that they can desalinisate, perhaps they will return the sources of Jordan and other rivers to Lebanon, and Golan with eastern shores of Tiberias lake to Syria....

	19-09-2004 21:53									#95
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quote: Originally posted by Pekka drosedars, hey I drove through the Nevada deserts. There's no 'sensible desert' and 'insensible desert'. It's really a desert, and just because there are small areas where some grass grows, it still is a desert. The people who really want to live there, by all means, they should do that if they want to. But they are moving into desert. Fact. To me, it's like 'hey I want to move in a war zone'.

pekka, hey I've lived in the Nevada deserts...for 18 years. Thank you, yes, I noticed that it's desert out here. But there are different kinds of deserts with different kinds of growing conditions and precipitation patterns. Some desert types are more livable than others. You might check out a book sometime from your local library on the subject.

And for the record, I didn't move here because I wanted to. I was five at the time. I bloody hate the desert in all its forms as far as living in one. After I've completed my degree I plan on moving somewhere green and wet.

	20-09-2004 06:35									#96
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quote: Originally posted by DRoseDARs It costs so much because it still a relatively "new" technology and as such isn't widely manufactured enough to bring down production costs. The more people buy it, the cheaper it becomes to produce it. It a capitalist thing that I don't know how to explain properly. My feeling is that the government should step in a find a surefire means of meeting our energy demands without killing us with resultant pollution. This coupled with these desalinization plants would ease a lot of problems here in the US.

Arrr, ye be daft, mate!

[non-pirate mode]
The reason photovoltaics are expensive is because they are pathetically inefficient. 5-6% at best, with some expensive lens/filter methods doubling that. It's unavoidable because only a very narrow wavelength bandwidth has the hv power level to liberate electrons. The voltage produced is also very low.
[/non-pirate mode]

	20-09-2004 06:48									#97
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Where will they put the salt from the desalinization efforts? It will be toxic waste. … quote: The more freshwater that is removed from the oceans (either through 'natural' evaporation or artifical means) the saltier the oceans will have to become. Arrr, this be no problem. IIRC, something like 99% of the world's water be in the oceans.

Arrr, ye shivvered yer own timbers there, mate.

	20-09-2004 07:45									#98
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quote: Originally posted by DRoseDARs After I've completed my degree I plan on moving somewhere green and wet.

You're gonna hate the humidity.

	20-09-2004 08:38									#99
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I think I'd rather drown breathing the open air than have chapped lips and dry, flaky skin 365 days a year...

	20-09-2004 09:08									#100
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Have you ever been someplace with high humidity? Go to New Orleans in the summer.

	20-09-2004 09:30									#101
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I was born in Chicago, I've been along the entire west coastline (from Seattle to San Diego over the years), I was in Austin TX over New Years, I've visited Little Rock AK, and I went to Orlando FL one summer. Do those places count?

	20-09-2004 09:37									#102
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Forgot to add: Honolulu, Sydney, and the Great Barrier Reef.

	20-09-2004 09:45									#103
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I guess so.

	20-09-2004 11:09									#105
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Whadya mean? CA coast isn't high humidity. Humidity gets higher in the valley with all the irrigation going. San Antonio in the dead of winter doesn't count either.

I refer you to Lancer's thread about Earth-enema: check out Ft. Polk. Orlando in the summer is indeed nasty for humidity.

	20-09-2004 12:09									#106
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Forget about the waste salt, just dump it back in the ocean. You would have to produce enourmous amounts of desalinized water to have any environmental effect. Local areas with higher salt concentration could be avoided by a proper distribution, like underwater brine pipelines with distributed emission.

"The solution to pollution is dilution"

	20-09-2004 12:54									#107
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quote: Those of you in the wetter parts of the world may not care but for those of us who aren't this might be big news. Scientists in Israel have begun construction of a desalinization plant which uses a break through new design. Reverse osmosis is a process where a semi-permiable membrane is used to filter out contaminents from water thus making the water clean and drinkable. You can think of it as a plastic sheet which has very tiny holes in it which water molecules can go through but which bacteria and other contaminents cannot. Traditionally, Reverse Osmosis could only be used to clean fresh water (not salt water) because the desolved salt ions were smaller then the water ions thus the salt would pass through any membrane the water could. Until now! Using a new process which uses special filter which contain magnetically charge layers and high pressure tubes salt water can be turned into fresh water cheaply and economically. Currently, the Israelis estimate the desalinized water will only cost about 20% more then cleaning regular fresh water supplies plus it will be cleaner. As the process is mass produced and the membranes are perfected prices are expected to fall even lower. That means the world's big shortage of clean drinking water might just be solved. Previously desalinization cost 400%-500% more then cleaning fresh water so only a few plants in very rich countries were built. The new technology is cheap and easy to replicate even in the worst of conditions. That means every seaside city should be able to have a safe, clean, and reliable source of drinking water in the near future.

Cracker, this schnitzel ain't that new, I did a report on reverse osmosis 2years ago for extra credit in my biology class.
and the odds are that water will become the new oil, and only those with desalinizing technology or access to potable water will be like the oil barons etc. and Kevin Costner will grow gills, and liveo ut in the middle of the ocean driinking his own urine and growing tomatoes.

	20-09-2004 18:41									#108
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I live on the California coast. I can affirm the relative humidity is just about perfect all the time. We may have the best weather in the world.

	20-09-2004 19:21									#109
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And that's why we hate you!

	20-09-2004 19:22									#110
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It's also why the average house costs $500k+.

	20-09-2004 19:23									#111
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Which is why everyone rents, apparently.

	20-09-2004 20:19									#112
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara What could we do with unlimited water and power?

Arrg, Hose down them college wenches on Spring break!

	20-09-2004 20:26									#113
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Talking like a pirate is so last night...

	20-09-2004 21:05									#115
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Avast, that's verrey good news for we pirates

Now we won't have ye filthy landlubbers to the south craving our water.

	21-09-2004 01:05									#116
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quote: Originally posted by Chemical Ollie Forget about the waste salt, just dump it back in the ocean. You would have to produce enourmous amounts of desalinized water to have any environmental effect. Local areas with higher salt concentration could be avoided by a proper distribution, like underwater brine pipelines with distributed emission. "The solution to pollution is dilution"

so true

	21-09-2004 01:08									#117
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Yeah for desalinization!

Isrealis have been doing a lot for enviro-friendly sciences as of late... and cloning!@

	21-09-2004 01:08									#118
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The "Left Behind" folk are jsut spinning over this one.

	21-09-2004 18:03									#119
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quote: Cracker, this schnitzel ain't that new, I did a report on reverse osmosis 2 years ago for extra credit in my biology class.

No, this is a different way of implementing reverse osmosis that is much cheaper than old designs.

	23-09-2004 06:05									#120
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quote: Originally posted by Pekka drosedars, hey I drove through the Nevada deserts. There's no 'sensible desert' and 'insensible desert'. It's really a desert, and just because there are small areas where some grass grows, it still is a desert. The people who really want to live there, by all means, they should do that if they want to. But they are moving into desert. Fact. To me, it's like 'hey I want to move in a war zone'.

He lives in the "high" desert. which is a different type of desert. They get more rainfall than us. Not a whole lot more, but more.

I was born in the desert (a hospital actually ). I do not intend to move. We have a sizable river flowing next to our city. It's not like we don't have water. It's just that California and Arizona takes it all for irrigation and other uses. We lack politcal power.

As for this technology . But it won't help my state at all. Sure California can make more water, but they still won't let our state have more Colorado river water. Californians are *******s .

Deserts are not inhospitable. Native americans have been living here for years. But there are limits to how much population deserts can handle. And I believe Las Vegas has exceeded that limit. But if we could have a little more of that river water... The river goes through our state before it gets to California. I think that should entitle us to more water. But they don't see it that way.