24-09-2004 13:53									#1
	How long does Anarchy take? Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Hi everyone:

Somebody knows how long does the period of anarchy take, or where can I get the info?.

Does somebody know the algoritm, the relation between the number of cities and the amount of turns under anarchy?

Thank you very much.

	24-09-2004 14:01									#2
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Anarchy never lasts less than 3 turns, and I have seen it last as long as 9 turns.

Normally, if you have only a handful of cities, you may get away with 3 or 4-turn anarchy, but for large empires, it lasts at least 4 turns. As far as I know, the actual number of turns is random, the only thing depending on the number of cities you have being the minimum number of turns you can expect.

	24-09-2004 14:55									#3
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I read the things about Anarchy a few years ago, when Civ 3 had just come out.

IIRC the formula under Civ3 Vanilla was:
S+R+1=Turns of Anarchy

S means Size and R means Random.
Both S and R could vary between 1 and 3. If you are relatively small, compared to other civs, S will be 1, but you still have no influence over R, as that is completely random. Anarchy when you are small can vary between 3 and 5, you just have to be lucky to get 3. When you are big it can vary between 5 and 7.

The max in Civ3 Vanilla was 7 turns, and the minimum 3 turns. In C3C the maximum Anarchy time is 9 turns so I guess S and R can now vary bewteen 1 and 4.

Hope this helps,

Tarq

	24-09-2004 15:11									#4
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Thank you very much for the formula.

Now I suppose the result is calculated from the beginning of the Anarchy Period.

An I wonder how computer calculates S (size), what does it use, land area or number of cities?.

If computer uses land area I suppose I can use the rank in Demographics to calculate S directly.

	24-09-2004 18:30									#5
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and one, maybe two turns of anarchy when you are a religious civ...

	24-09-2004 18:45									#6
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quote: Originally posted by Shogun Gunner and one, maybe two turns of anarchy when you are a religious civ...

There's no maybe about it. Two turns in C3C, one turn previously.

	24-09-2004 18:48									#7
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I wasn't aware that it was always two turns in C3C. Am I mixing up a PTW game? Perhaps. Thanks for the clarification punkbass

	24-09-2004 20:00									#8
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No problem. Religious was toned down slightly, much like industrious (though I would call industrious nerfed )

	26-09-2004 00:08									#9
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quote: Originally posted by Kramsib Thank you very much for the formula. Now I suppose the result is calculated from the beginning of the Anarchy Period. An I wonder how computer calculates S (size), what does it use, land area or number of cities?. If computer uses land area I suppose I can use the rank in Demographics to calculate S directly.

I am afraid I cannot help you any further. I told you all I know.
I only know the relative size is important; 20 cities may be a lot, but if all your opps have 50 cities you are small. Maybe you can only get the max for S (3 or 4) when you are the largest civ?

	26-09-2004 00:36									#10
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Max in vanilla was 8 turns.

Note that if you trigure anarchy right when offered the first time you get to the dm, they'll be one turn less, but that's because you just lost that turn of city production and so are even.

	27-09-2004 01:08									#11
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I have had 1 turn government transitions with non-religious civ's before. (Americans, 5 cities, huge, 1650BC, Republic, C3C). The maximum # of turns I have seen is 8 with the average about 4-6 on regent.

	27-09-2004 01:45									#12
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Really? I thought that to be impossible. You have a save for me to check?

	27-09-2004 03:02									#13
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It could happen in Vanilla and in PTW, if you decided to switch in mid-turn, right after researching the new government form. Then a 2-turn Anarchy period would seem a turn shorter, yielding a 1-turn Anarchy. The same thing made a religious civ do a government change, seemingly without any Anarchy at all.

	27-09-2004 22:18									#14
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Is the length of anarchy at all configurable in the editor?

	27-09-2004 22:58									#15
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quote: Originally posted by Modo44 It could happen in Vanilla and in PTW, if you decided to switch in mid-turn, right after researching the new government form. Then a 2-turn Anarchy period would seem a turn shorter, yielding a 1-turn Anarchy. The same thing made a religious civ do a government change, seemingly without any Anarchy at all.

Sigh...This is probably the case but I could have sworn that I have had it happen in C3C (but not with current patch 1.22)

	27-09-2004 23:12									#16
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Well, in C3C the minimal Anarchy period is 2 turns, religious civ or not. So you still could experience the nearly-1-turn Anarchy. The difference is, there is no more ultra fast switching for religious civs in C3C.

	30-09-2004 04:23									#17
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quote: Originally posted by Modo44 Well, in C3C the minimal Anarchy period is 2 turns, religious civ or not. So you still could experience the nearly-1-turn Anarchy. The difference is, there is no more ultra fast switching for religious civs in C3C.

Well, you still lose that turn's city shield production in all cities. (But not the gold or worker actions.)

So, it's more like 1/2 a turn saved than a full one.