15-10-2004 02:51									#61
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He placed 26 lights including the sun.

Saw the animations, one of them is very good, the other is not great.

Btw, I never said dust can't be added, I just said artists don't add it, probably in fear of showing off their hard work in its purity.

	15-10-2004 02:54									#62
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The real problem with CGI, it always seems to me, is that they look too 3D - real pictures are flat.

	15-10-2004 03:11									#63
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quote: The real problem with CGI, it always seems to me, is that they look too 3D - real pictures are flat.

I think it has something to do with trying to look as real life as possible, not as real life picture as possible.

	15-10-2004 03:50									#64
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It's on a flat screen. If it were a hologram, making it look 3D would be good. But it's not.

	15-10-2004 04:27									#65
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its all in the lighting

	15-10-2004 07:03									#66
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quote: Originally posted by Kuciwalker It's on a flat screen. If it were a hologram, making it look 3D would be good. But it's not.

That's not it. "Real" pictures are 2D representations of a 3D world, so these CGI images should also be 2D representations of a 3D world.

	15-10-2004 08:07									#67
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Uhm, they are.

	15-10-2004 08:53									#68
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My point was, you can't have an image that looks "too 3D." That's a silly idea.

	15-10-2004 08:55									#69
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I'd draw a picture of myself hitting it.

	15-10-2004 09:12									#70
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger That's not it. "Real" pictures are 2D representations of a 3D world, so these CGI images should also be 2D representations of a 3D world.

Not my point. They don't look 2D. Look at a normal movie, look at a CGI movie. The normal movie looks flat - and real. The CGI movie looks 3D - and fake.

	15-10-2004 09:38									#71
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yeah... computer graphics are just too 3d, too shiny, too crisp... they're all around too perfect. it's like theyre digital and someone needs to introduce an analog element, so to speak.

	15-10-2004 13:00									#72
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Well, I don't think CGI is always - per se - too perfect, it just costs a lot of efforts to make it look real. I also would say it is much easier to make technical structures (buildings, vehicles etc.) look real than humans, animals or other "organic" things.

	15-10-2004 13:30									#73
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I can't believe they gave her camel toe!


Check out the one of her in the black bikini.

	15-10-2004 14:52									#74
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"I have a sneaking suspicion that if there were a way to make movies without actors, George (Lucas) would do it."
- Mark Hamill

	15-10-2004 16:04									#75
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The Pictures of the women look (mostly) great,
but what IMHO looks very artificial is the face of the Baby.
IMHO they added too little childlikeness. It resembles more the miniaturized face of an adult, than a real face of a baby.

	15-10-2004 17:02									#76
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quote: Originally posted by BeBro Well, I don't think CGI is always - per se - too perfect, it just costs a lot of efforts to make it look real. I also would say it is much easier to make technical structures (buildings, vehicles etc.) look real than humans, animals or other "organic" things.

I've never seen it look real. I think there's something fundamentally wrong with their idea.

	15-10-2004 17:25									#77
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I'd like to see film makers start using CGI to synchronize the movement of lips and faces of actors in dubbed movies. Wouldn't it be awesome if in your favorite foreign film the dubbing was rendered like natural because the mtion of the actors' lips and faces was synchronized with the pronunciation of the words in your native tounge?

I thought that the CGI rendering of the characters in Final Fantasy was almost lifelike. They reduced the plastic-like appearence of their CGI figures by dulling the surface on the skin. Unfortunately the viewer would still get the impression of skin that was still too homogenious. On close -up shots though you could actually see tiny hairs, veins and skin lines.

	15-10-2004 18:42									#78
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But some 3D things looks very real... I've noticed several times when walking near water, that I've said the water looked like computer graphics

	15-10-2004 19:32									#79
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Sims!

	15-10-2004 19:45									#80
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* alva kicks Skanky out of the thread.

	15-10-2004 19:49									#81
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quote: Originally posted by Adagio But some 3D things looks very real... I've noticed several times when walking near water, that I've said the water looked like computer graphics

It seems to me that water is pretty easy to render, at least for raytracers... or perhaps it's just POV-Ray that does a good job of it (I'm not quite sure of how other renderers fare). As evidence, I submit http://www.lyseo.edu.ouka.fi/~lighten/bigcoolwater.jpg . I created this image quite a while ago (that file on the server was last modified in February 2003) with a piece of landscape generating software that's quite dead and rendered it with POV-Ray. Compared to the horrible-looking land and the decent but definitely not good sky, the water actually looks quite cool. Sure, it could use improvement - it should reflect a lot more and refract a lot less, and there should be different-looking areas of the surface (air going in different directions causes waves to go in different directions, I guess) but the only thing that's really important here is what it looks like compared to the rest of the image...

	15-10-2004 19:56									#82
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I think the "real" factor has to do with how light reflects off various surfaces. The CGI programs use equations that are very accurate for "inorganic" things like metal and plastic, but are not that accurate for "living" things like human skin.

	15-10-2004 20:48									#83
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quote: Originally posted by Kuciwalker Not my point. They don't look 2D. Look at a normal movie, look at a CGI movie. The normal movie looks flat - and real. The CGI movie looks 3D - and fake.

Of course it doesn't look 2D. A normal movie don't "look 2D," either.

	15-10-2004 20:53									#84
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quote: Originally posted by Ari Rahikkala It seems to me that water is pretty easy to render, at least for raytracers... or perhaps it's just POV-Ray that does a good job of it (I'm not quite sure of how other renderers fare).

It depends. Doing things like sweat on a person's face or water condensing on certain type of objects is very hard.

quote: Originally posted by Ari Rahikkala Sure, it could use improvement - it should reflect a lot more and refract a lot less

It has too much reflection already - and the light source seems to be wrong.

	27-02-2005 00:54									#85
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Was going through some threads to save my own and saw this one. Besides the problems already mentioned - too many light sources (and the proportion of light coming from the non-primary ones is all wrong - I'm a serious amateur photographer whose done a few gigs for close friends) and the hair, there's another factor that has only been dealt with the last couple of years.

It has to do with the fact that with skin, and certain other surfaces, the light is not simply reflected from the surface, it also penetrates and reflects back from below the surface. The inner luminous aspect to skin is what makes it so develish to CGI. I cannot remember the programmer who pioneered this approach, but he has been getting some phenomenal results.

	27-02-2005 01:00									#86
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probably already said but the absorption and dispersion of light on the hair and skin is what makes it unreal

	27-02-2005 02:18									#87
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger It has too much reflection already - and the light source seems to be wrong.

When was the last time you saw the bottom of a lake through water from that angle? As far as I know lakes are supposed to be *blue*, not some sort of greenish brownish light cyan (can you tell I had problems figuring out what I should call that colour )?

	27-02-2005 03:04									#88
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I wonder, would those cgi clips look more realistic, if they were copied couple of times to lowzy VHS-casettes?

Or if they applied the same visual effect they did for Saving Private Ryan, removed some colors, made it a bit bleaker...

	27-02-2005 03:36									#89
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quote: Originally posted by Ari Rahikkala When was the last time you saw the bottom of a lake through water from that angle? As far as I know lakes are supposed to be *blue*, not some sort of greenish brownish light cyan (can you tell I had problems figuring out what I should call that colour )?

our lake looks brown up close. of course we live in a desert. from an airplane it looks blue though.

	27-02-2005 03:42									#90
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quote: Originally posted by monolith94 "I have a sneaking suspicion that if there were a way to make movies without actors, George (Lucas) would do it." - Mark Hamill

I thought he already was