15-10-2004 08:47									#1
	Creating a Modern-World Balance mod Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Hi, i'm looking to create a playable world of most of the modern nations which is balanced (i'll explain in a moment) allowing playability with all civilisations yet maintaining realism & open-endedness.

Essentially it'll be a few changed rules and a World map, I have already obtained a world map with a slightly oversize Europe for editing. The game will start in the ancient era just like a new game, and there'll be about 25 civ's probably.

Basically the problem with most World maps is that certain civs are given way too much land resulting in some massive AI's/Humans and other civs have no realistic prospect due to crowding, furthermore because of these skewed elements Modern history is not nearly reflected in any way and things just don't seem real.

The idea then is to create a World map, where upon entering the Industrial and Modern era's some resemblance to our World today may been seen and the game will be sufficiently balanced to stop 1 IA storming it.

I will need to make many changes to acheive this, firstly there is the issue of Continental balance, here are some solutions:

1. Try and get a reasnable amount of Civ's to all continents, particulary the America's.
2. Increase the size of Europe and UK, they are already far too cramped to enjoy any realistic prospect of Victory
3. Add minor nations where neccesary to balance the seeming superpowers

Europe's objectives will be helped by the following

- Increase of natrual resources in Europe particulary relating to Food and Commerce, fish have boosted for this purpose giving more trade and food and added in higher quantities to the UK,France,Germany, Italy and Spain.

- Starting Civ's limited to UK,Germany,France,Spain,Italy,Greece,Poland, Sweeden, Finland Ukraine and Russia - this will always lead to a more crowded Europe but not to the extent that one civ run's away with it and kills off all other Euro states easily.

- Extra civilisaton traits given & Tech's - All civ's to start with Pottery (for Graneries) and Agriculture state allowing them to REX easier and making more use of thier cramped Cities.


America will be hampered by:

- Slightly disproportionatly less resources than normal

- Natrual Borders to Stop Mexico spreading too far into North or South America while also controlling the spread of the South American Civ's.

- Less Civ Advantages, the fortunate starting Mexicans and Americans will have no advantages at all while Canada will keep a couple to make up for all that tundra of thiers.


Russia will be controlled by :
Ural mountings being unpleasant and vast hence limiting the speed of their Eastern Expansion

A Powerful Japan,China and India


Africa will need multiple civ's to colonize it's vast space, these will be South Africa, Kenya,Eygpt and Morrocco, more be added to enable it to be poor.

Japan will be boosed in almost every way possible, to make up for thier Island start, given they are a massive economic power these days.

Realism may be added in the following ways:

Landmark Terrain given to certain cities which enables Irrigation to give a +2 food benefit instead of +1, These Cities would be New York, Mexico City,Tokyo, Beiging, Rivers may not be present however meaning that the Cities will not initialy be too overpowed (ie not giving them a super start) but in the Modern age after Sanitation & Railways the Tiles will be mega Colossol cities.

Planned Civ's (some already implemented):

UK (Probably call it this rather than England)
France
Spain
Germany
Poland
Italy
Greece
Sweeden
Finland
Russia
Ukraine
Morroco
Eygpt
Kenya
South Africa
Arabia
Turkey
India
China
Korea
Japan
Australia
America
Canada
Mexico
Brazil
Argentina


Loads of other ideas, May need more Asian civ's & any other interesting way to help out the Economic superpowers of the Modern day get out of thier cramped environments.

Cheers
Matt

	16-10-2004 05:08									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Not to kill your idea or anything, but lookie here:

http://www.mil-sim.net/modules.php?...ownloads&cid=18

	16-10-2004 19:19									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Frankly, the realism in the World 2004 mod suffers from the authors' simplistic worldview. It's basically a strategy war game where you can't manage without bombing people. I'll quote.

quote: Fight the increasing threat of terrorists, insurgents and separatists all around the world. Confront those who sponsor their local extremists in their Jihad against the "capitalist infidels" without formal declaration of war.

	16-10-2004 20:17									#4
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Lol, we call that AI here in America ;-). There's pretty much no way around that unless you want to play a 31 player multiplayer game. While that would be Uber-cool, probably won't happen very soon.

I'm mainly trying to recruit people for the inner-site Democracy Game, if you're interested, PM me on the Mil-Sim system.

	16-10-2004 23:16									#5
	Put an end to popups!

The 2004 is different to what I'm aiming at, my game will start in 4000BC yet the natrual Terrain of the game and the design of the Nations will ensure a slight simularity with our World certainly at some points (probably not 2004 as the Human and KAI will have taken over loads no doubt!)

	16-10-2004 23:33									#6
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Er, okay, lemme get this straight. Do you want like to like have a one city start in the Modern Age on a world map, or are you making everything else up from scratch or what?

	17-10-2004 00:53									#7
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

I think he means that it's like our world, except that all civs start at the same time (4000BC) in their respective locations.

Actually, if the parameters are set in a certain way, the end result can be surprisingly similar to our world in the Modern Age. I just played as Scandinavia on El Mencey's 362x362 world map, with Catherine placing St. Petersburg, Murmansk and Kursk just where they should be. Creepy.

	17-10-2004 00:58									#8
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Worthingtons:
But of course you realise that there's a bit of a silliness problem involved with making ancient tribes out of some modern nations. Franks, Greeks and Finns existed as distinct tribes in the Stone Age, but it would be odd to send emissaries to visit the great chief of the Neolithic tribe of the Canadians.

	17-10-2004 01:15									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Plus the US wouldn't exist at all. Aaand, the Carthanginians, the Mayans, the Aztecs, the Incans, the Sumerians, the Zulu, and the Babylonians (Some more people too) don't exist as they do today.

	17-10-2004 08:23									#10
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Tau, yes I do realise that but there's not much that can be done about that really, apart from advancing the Start date which I'm not Keen on doing.

While these Nations didnt exist as such in those places people did - and it'll be just like the discovery of the 'New world' when our European civ's finally stumble accross America as they'll be so far backwards In comparison to Europe i'm sure.
Cheers
Matt

Ps - I've been doing a bit of Test running, so far it would appear London and Rome are perhaps sligtly overpowered for the Wonder race, however many of the other things are working out nicely - and there's just about enough room for the Various Euro Tribes to survive.

	17-10-2004 10:03									#11
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So, from what I can tell, you're aiming for balance and not realism, right?

	17-10-2004 14:13									#12
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bit of both really, balance but realism when the game enters the late 'era's

Playtesting my beta version atm, which is playing very well although India is far too powerful as I forgot to include Thailand.

	17-10-2004 21:34									#13
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Well, it seems like you want more balance then realism from your posts. Some countries are meant to be a lot stronger then others.

Are you going to slow down the clock at all? It starts out at what, 50 year intervals?