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Apolyton Civilization Forums : Powered by vBulletin version 2.0.3 Apolyton Civilization Forums > Other Games > Other Games > Are second sequels doomed to fail?
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LeftHand is offline LeftHand
Settler
New York
Jul 2004
time: 05:19
  Old Post 11-11-2004 19:11
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#1 Report this post to a moderator
Are second sequels doomed to fail? Get a bigger avatar today!

I don't like Civ3 as much as I liked Civ2 and still do. The same happened with MOO too..

Is there any series of games where the second sequel was actually a lot better than the previous one? The only second sequel that did not totally let me down was X-COM series and the first sequel was the best of course, but the second sequel was still enjoyable.

Adagio is offline Adagio

Emperor

Jun 2001
time: 06:19
  Old Post 11-11-2004 20:19
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...and put in The Settlers III for this also... didn't live up to The Settlers II at all... (Kinda like all Settlers games released after)

And SimCity 3000 didn't hold me as much as SimCity 2000, luckily the 4th one was much better...

And there's probably many more games that gits this...

Adagio is offline Adagio

Emperor

Jun 2001
time: 06:19
  Old Post 11-11-2004 20:20
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Most "3" games are just made to harvest what the first two games seeded...

General Ludd is offline General Ludd
Emperor
Minion of the Dominion
Aug 2001
time: 05:19
  Old Post 11-11-2004 21:03
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MOO3
Civ3
HoMM3&4
Doom3
Settlers 3
SimCity3
Warcraft3


Yep... seems so. What did I miss?

Dis is offline Dis
Emperor
Las Vegas, Nevada
Feb 2000
time: 21:19
  Old Post 11-11-2004 21:27 Visit Dis's homepage!
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fallout3? . too soon to tell.

Baldur's Gate 3? hasn't been made

Dis is offline Dis
Emperor
Las Vegas, Nevada
Feb 2000
time: 21:19
  Old Post 11-11-2004 21:30 Visit Dis's homepage!
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ahh, I found a good one

The Elder Scrolls III. Morrowind

Dis is offline Dis
Emperor
Las Vegas, Nevada
Feb 2000
time: 21:19
  Old Post 11-11-2004 21:30 Visit Dis's homepage!
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P.S. Civ3 is actually a pretty good game.

Apocalypse is offline Apocalypse
King
Lexington, VA: College - Houston, TX: Home
Aug 2005
time: 00:19
  Old Post 11-11-2004 21:51
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Tony LaRussa Baseball 3 was good.

Japher is offline Japher
Prince
Ook! Ook! Ack! Ack! Ack!
Jun 2002
time: 05:19
  Old Post 11-11-2004 22:31
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I like Super Mario 3

LeftHand is offline LeftHand
Settler
New York
Jul 2004
time: 05:19
  Old Post 11-11-2004 23:25
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Warcraft 3 was a disappointment. WC2 was just too good. Settlers, I agree.

Super Mario 3 could be an exception. Super Mario 1 was good, but Super Mario 2 was bad... Super Mario 3 was good again.

Sandman is offline Sandman
Prince
Sinister Penguin
Aug 2001
time: 05:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 00:03
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I reckon most games can stand one cloned sequel, but for second sequels, you need to reinvent the game.

DrSpike is offline DrSpike
Deity
Enthusiastic member of Apolyton
Sep 2001
time: 05:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 00:05
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WC3 was very different from WC2, and highly successful, both in SP and MP. It still has 100,000s of players more than 2 years after release.

Japher is offline Japher
Prince
Ook! Ook! Ack! Ack! Ack!
Jun 2002
time: 05:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 00:09
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What about Command and Conquer?

All because they don't put a "3" after their games doesn't mean they aren't sequals.

Also, games like Heroes of Might and Magic have had doezens of sequals, it seems. While the game doesn't change a whole hell of a lot that is part of it's appeal.

Same with Leisure Suit Larry

Apocalypse is offline Apocalypse
King
Lexington, VA: College - Houston, TX: Home
Aug 2005
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  Old Post 12-11-2004 00:15
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Wing Commander III is really good.

Stuie is offline Stuie

King
Have a beer!
Sep 2001
time: 00:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 00:23 Visit Stuie<br><a href=/members><img src=/forums/images/inmate-icon.gif border=0></a><BR>'s homepage!
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Rome: Total War is the third in the series and the best in my opinion. But then again I'm a sucker for the time period...

Adagio is offline Adagio

Emperor

Jun 2001
time: 06:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 02:09
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quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike
WC3 was very different from WC2, and highly successful, both in SP and MP. It still has 100,000s of players more than 2 years after release.


But for those (like me) who liked WC 2, but hate the changes they made to WC3, then is kinda natural to say that WC3 really sucks...

This would kinda be the like if for example Bullfrog makes a game they call Syndicate 3, but this time they don't just rely on firepower, but also on witchcraft (or whatever)... and then let's say that this game sells much more than the first two games, but all the fans of the original games hates it...

Would you call it a success? Seen from the money perspective for the company, then yes it's a success, but by seing on the negative side effects of it, then it's a failure


* Adagio looks towards the "settlers"* 5


* I hate to call the 5th version a settlers game

Sava is offline Sava
King
GO GO GO!
Mar 2001
time: 23:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 03:01
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the only thing good about Warcraft 3 is the WC3 mod for Counter-Strike.

Kuciwalker is offline Kuciwalker
Emperor
of Schmooism
Feb 2001
time: 00:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 03:20
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I also have to say SMB3. And C3 was pretty good.

Standup is offline Standup
Prince
UK
Apr 2002
time: 05:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 03:30
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Championship Manager 3 was a big improvement although i really didn;t take to Championship Manager 4.

Railroad Tycoon 3 wasn't an improvement.

Grand Theft Auto 3 was worth buying.

DrSpike is offline DrSpike
Deity
Enthusiastic member of Apolyton
Sep 2001
time: 05:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 04:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Adagio


Would you call it a success? Seen from the money perspective for the company, then yes it's a success, but by seing on the negative side effects of it, then it's a failure


From the money/sales side and the fact that 100,000s of player still play it more than 2 years after release. What more do you want?

If you don't like it, fine, that's your prerogative. But as a game it clearly doesn't suck in the way that virtually would say MOO3, for instance, does.

Adagio is offline Adagio

Emperor

Jun 2001
time: 06:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 05:11
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quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike
From the money/sales side and the fact that 100,000s of player still play it more than 2 years after release. What more do you want?

If you don't like it, fine, that's your prerogative. But as a game it clearly doesn't suck in the way that virtually would say MOO3, for instance, does.


But the point was that it doesn't feel like Warcraft for me... nomatter how good the game is (even if I liked WC3), it went too far away from what I felt was Warcraft, to make me like to call it Warcraft...
They should have called it something else, just not Warcraft 3


And the same thing about Dune... the first Dune game was AFAIK nothing like the sequels (the gameplay changes drastic, while only the story remained)... I never played the first Dune and loved Dune 2, but I don't like it that they made a game called dune 2 that played completely different than the first game... Again here they should have given it a different name

Or like that Fallout Tactics... I've never played it, but from I've read it only has the basic story in common with Fallout 1+2. At least the people who made that game didn't call it Fallout 3




Not all is about money... do you see where I'm heading?

Dis is offline Dis
Emperor
Las Vegas, Nevada
Feb 2000
time: 21:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 05:45 Visit Dis's homepage!
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with regards to fallout tactics. They use the same basic story outline, but they also use the combat system (slightly modified in real time modes) and character system. Though some skills like science are largely useless

The biggest difference is it's a different genre. It's not a role playing game, but a squad based tactical game.

Urban Ranger is offline Urban Ranger
Apolyton Duke of Off-Topic

Donate to the Red Cross
The City State of Noosphere, CPA special envoy
May 1999
time: 13:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 11:05
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Apocalypse (XCOM 3) isn't bad.

Barinthus is offline Barinthus
King
A Magical Moment...
Jan 2004
time: 21:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 13:36
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Final Fantasy III, American version was champs.

Adagio is offline Adagio

Emperor

Jun 2001
time: 06:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 16:16
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quote:
Originally posted by Dissident
The biggest difference is it's a different genre. It's not a role playing game, but a squad based tactical game.


Exactly my point...

Pekka is offline Pekka
Chieftain
em seu burro dos pais!
Feb 2002
time: 07:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 18:40
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GTA 3, definitely!

Thanks for reminding about the XCom..

ZargonX is offline ZargonX
Emperor
Space
Sep 2002
time: 00:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 20:08
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Well, for "3s" that didn't quite live up to their expectations, let us not forget Star Control III, which was a highly disappointing game.

Then there is Rollercoaster Tycoon 3, which has just come out, and looks like it could be quite good, if they hadn't released it full of critical bugs

Adagio is offline Adagio

Emperor

Jun 2001
time: 06:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 23:30
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But I believe those bugs would be quickly fixed (I hope ).. if not, then it should be on that list also...

lord of the mark is offline lord of the mark
Emperor
FUKCOV - Former United Kingdom Colony of Virginia
Dec 2000
time: 00:19
  Old Post 12-11-2004 23:30
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I liked Caesar 3, but then i never played its predecessors.

Oerdin is offline Oerdin
King
of Internet Music.
Sep 2001
time: 21:19
  Old Post 13-11-2004 00:06
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This is WAY back in the day but Wing Commander 3 was by far the best in the series. Mechwarrior 3 kicked ass too.

 
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