17-11-2004 05:03									#61
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quote: Originally posted by Pythagoras I have never heard of a good Star Trek game (shame) and there have been very very few good star wars games.

Those were Star Wars games, and they were all good (KOTOR very, very much so).

	17-11-2004 05:06									#62
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Civ2 for its endless adaptability to scenario making.

	17-11-2004 05:06									#63
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There are no good Star Trek game and no good Star Wars games.


The Star Trek games are somewhat better, however, do to the fact that they are not related to Star Wars.

	17-11-2004 05:11									#64
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quote: no good Star Wars games.

Again, KOTOR.

	17-11-2004 05:14									#65
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Maybe we need to mind staple some of the fanatics, oh wait, that would include me to a degree.

	17-11-2004 05:51									#66
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quote: Originally posted by Pythagoras I have never heard of a good Star Trek game (shame) and there have been very very few good star wars games.

ST TNG: A final Unity, a bit old now but really good IMHO

	17-11-2004 06:27									#67
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Star Wars needs a TBS. Maybe landbased for the history of Tatooine? Or spacebased beginning at the beginning of the Old Republic, with the Hutts as a civilization? I suppose you should be able to play as the Hutts. Beginning at the beginning of the Old Republic, what civilizations could there be in addition to the Republic and the Hutts? Could the Sith be a civ?

	17-11-2004 07:18									#68
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quote: You mean besides TIE Fighter, X-Wing, even KOTOR?

You forgot Jedi Knight 2.

	17-11-2004 07:22									#69
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I hated Jedi Knight 1, so never played 2

	17-11-2004 07:43									#70
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Rebellion was underestimated too.

	17-11-2004 07:49									#71
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quote: You mean besides TIE Fighter, X-Wing, even KOTOR?

Those suked too... I hate them all I tell you all!!!

please feed the troll

	17-11-2004 08:24									#72
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Panzer General 1 is my favorite TBS game with just a campaign. SMAC is all randomly generated so it's infinately replayable, which is why I rate it higher.

	17-11-2004 08:36									#73
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I voted for SMAC because it had the most options (actually SMAX has the most options, but it seems unbalancing- just doesn't seem as fun as the original)

But I wonder if I should have voted for Civ2. Because I have played more civ2 than smac. But smac is still on my hard drive, civ2 isn't. Civ3 is the reason civ2 is not on my hard drive. I can't go back.

	17-11-2004 08:39									#74
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quote: Originally posted by Oncle Boris Rebellion was underestimated too.

That is not possible, it was simply unplayable. I gave it away three times and everyone gave it back, saying it sucked.

I finally tossed it in the trash.

	17-11-2004 08:43									#75
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you aren't supposed to accept the games back when you give it away.

I played Rebellion for like an hour. Something didn't seem right in that game. I can't say what exactly. It just wasn't fun.

	17-11-2004 08:44									#76
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quote: Originally posted by Dissident But I wonder if I should have voted for Civ2. Because I have played more civ2 than smac. But smac is still on my hard drive, civ2 isn't. Civ3 is the reason civ2 is not on my hard drive. I can't go back.

I think that is the key, if you do not play it any longer, then it really is not the best. That is why I did not vote for SMAC or Civ2. I still play Moo1/2 Homm2/3 and since I have played more Moo1 and it is the eldest of them, it gets the vote.

I think that is also important and why games of the last two or three years don't qualify. Let's see if they manage to pass the test of time first.

	17-11-2004 08:53									#77
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I don't see what was so wrong with Rebellion, it was fun for a few hours.

True, I never brought a game to its end, so maybe the problem was one of micromanagement that I couldn't suspect.

	17-11-2004 09:00									#78
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that was the last time I bought a game based on what was written on the back of the box

	17-11-2004 10:36									#79
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Rebellion had so many pop out panels and things to figure out, it was micromanagement hell, Sort of like Moo3, but even less compelling. At least I did paly a few games of Moo3 before I gave up.

	17-11-2004 16:23									#80
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Is Jagged Alliance a TBS?

If so, it gets my vote. JA2 that is....

	17-11-2004 16:30									#81
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It was called 'Starwars Supremacy' over here. Its another one of those games that i just cant decide if i like it or hate it, as some parts of it are fun(starwars characters to play with) while others are not like the whole interface. I still have it and i still play it from time to time, hopeing i'll find the great game beneath it. There was a fan made patch thing called 'rebedit'(i think), that enabled you to change some stuff in the game making it better, apparently.
Starwars games rulez.

Best TBS - Call to Power2, in that i've spent more time on it than Civ2 which just comes in second for me. CTP2 isnt a perfect game, but its got potential atleast to be the undisputed king of TBS with the source code project here on poly, mainly i suppose because no one makes them(TBS) any more

	17-11-2004 21:07									#82
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I am surprised to find that Warlords II or III got no votes.

	17-11-2004 21:34									#83
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quote: Originally posted by Oncle Boris Rebellion was underestimated too.

It was fun for the "how awesome of an empire can I build" value, not really playing. Way too much MM.

They should make a sequel and fix all the problems.

	18-11-2004 00:48									#84
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quote: Originally posted by Unspeakable Horror ST TNG: A final Unity, a bit old now but really good IMHO

Good call. The Voyager FPS was also decent.

For Star Wars there's KOTOR as many have said, and some decent fliers.

	18-11-2004 03:35									#85
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Tricky one this. Played PG1 loads but haven't for the last couple of years. Similar story with Civ2 - don't like Civ3 but i did get use to the graphics. I know i'm shallow but if for no other reason than my TFT doesn't cope with non native resolutions too well for that blocky effect.

So just to vary the voting a bit Imperialism 2 closely followed by MOO2 and HOMM3.

	18-11-2004 06:14									#86
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I also tried and disliked Star Wars Rebellion. I guess I wished it was a TBS. The most fun you can have with it is to start it and wait, and watch what happens when you lose.

I don't normally play FPS, but I do have Voyager Elite Force as one of the two games on my PS2. I don't bother with the FPS campaigns, I just do multiplayer.

	18-11-2004 13:01									#87
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quote: Originally posted by vmxa1 That is not possible, it was simply unplayable. I gave it away three times and everyone gave it back, saying it sucked. I finally tossed it in the trash.

Ah bummer I'd have been glad to take it off your hands.

	18-11-2004 18:54									#88
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quote: Originally posted by Pythagoras but the combination of a great story that really shows BR's education and a TBS is the primary reason I think its a great game.

You mean is philosophy background. Actually I think Civ2 showed that as well, but in Civ2 it was subtle, so subtle that most people dont see it till its pointed out, and even then some will deny it (see my column, Civ2's Hegelian Tech Tree) in SMAC, OTOH, the philosophy is "in your face", and rather heavy handed ("oh wow, I can research Will to Power")

That had a lot to do with why SMAC rubbed me the wrong way, I think. I fully understand that it was quite different for most everyone else.

	18-11-2004 18:59									#89
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quote: Originally posted by Dissident I voted for SMAC because it had the most options (actually SMAX has the most options, but it seems unbalancing- just doesn't seem as fun as the original) But I wonder if I should have voted for Civ2. Because I have played more civ2 than smac. But smac is still on my hard drive, civ2 isn't. Civ3 is the reason civ2 is not on my hard drive. I can't go back.

I think its what you like most, played most, thought was best etc, not what youve still got on your hard drive.

For example I played Civ2 dozens of times, I think - playing many times on Deity level to see if i could win different ways, on different maps etc - and when i got tired of that i played scenarios, and the Civ:TOT fantasy and sci-fi games. But ive played it so much i have a hard time going back to it, even though there are some good scenarios ive never played.

SMAC on the other hand i played about 3 or 4 times before getting tired of it. OTOH I could very well see myself giving it a second chance, perhaps after Ive played several other TBS's.

	18-11-2004 21:36									#90
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quote: Originally posted by lord of the mark You mean is philosophy background. Actually I think Civ2 showed that as well, but in Civ2 it was subtle, so subtle that most people dont see it till its pointed out, and even then some will deny it (see my column, Civ2's Hegelian Tech Tree) in SMAC, OTOH, the philosophy is "in your face", and rather heavy handed ("oh wow, I can research Will to Power") That had a lot to do with why SMAC rubbed me the wrong way, I think. I fully understand that it was quite different for most everyone else.

I agree, his History background is also shown well in Colonization.