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Mountain Sage
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Well, here we go again. Pursuing my series of ‘crazy’ Sid games, here’s my latest: an OCC cultural win.
If somebody is interested in playing it, here is the starting location: I had to ‘twist’ the map a bit, in order to have a decent starting position. Of course, with my usual luck  my (only) iron resource was depleted after about 30 turns. Needless to say, my knights, railroads and factory were a bit more complicated to build, and the Iron Works would remain a hopeless dream… 
The strategy of this game was simple (in fact, I wanted to achieve a diplo win…  ): go for Republic asap, build the Great Library, then be in a position to built Copernicus’ Observatory and Newton’s University. Afterward, go for Steam Power, Industrialization, ToE etc.
In between, I managed to build the Mausoleum of Mausollos, Sun Tsu, Leonardo’s Workshop, the Sistine Chapel and The Universal Suffrage.
About the map:
This is a tiny archipelago map, 8 civs, 80% water. All islands started with all resources needed to build a spaceship. As in other Sid games (as explained in my 5CC thread), the number of cities determines if the game is winnable or not. In this case, the number of cities should not exceed the magical number of 4. With 5 and more, the AI manages to out-science you at the beginning of the Middle Ages (about 10-15 turns to get Theology to your 25+). After a few techs, you’re hopelessly out-researched.
Therefore, this map was built in order to accommodate a maximum of 4 cities per island. Some AIs built only 3, with no noticeable lagging behind in research. With my twisted sense of humor, I put some volcanoes on some islands. It was quite fun watching a torched city being founded again for the 3rd time…  Well, at least it kept whole generations of archeologists happy 
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Mountain Sage
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The starting location (I have seen worse ones....)
 Attachment: 4000bc occ.jpg
This has been downloaded 192 time(s).
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Dominae
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I assume you edited that start?
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vmxa1
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Oviedo, Fl
Nov 2001
time: 21:18
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Yeah when you consider that he said he had iron and coal in the city as well. That could mean evey tile has a bonus. That I have never seen.
Last edited by vmxa1 on 27-11-2004 at 10:18
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Mountain Sage
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quote:
Originally posted by Dominae
I assume you edited that start? |
Of course. I 'cheated' outrageously this time. I lost a few games by not having, for instance, saltpeter and therefore no musketeers (no GA) and being wiped out by a bunch of Cavalry (against my MI).
I got in trouble when my source of iron became exhausted...
In fact, as explained, all the map is edited (max. of 4 cities per civ on each island).
To compensate a bit, I put all available resources and acouple of luxuries on each island.
If I were to play again, I would not load my island that much, it's not necessary, especially with aluminium and uranium (I wanted to try a spaceship win if I had doubts about my diplo victory).
Oh, ivory is almost essential and you should be the only one having it, otherwise you don't have a pre-built for your wonders.
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Aeson
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orangesoda
Nov 2001
time: 22:18
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To me "decent" is that you have a start as good or better than both of your opponents. The Food to grow to size 6. The Production to get the Great Library with a Curragh, Garrison, Garrison, Curragh (if necessary), Granary->First Trade (hopefully Alphabet for Masonry right before getting Writing)->Great Library prebuild.
I play with 2 AI on Tiny, which usually helps, but 3 AI could work better in some cases. If you're going to ctrl-alt-q to a "decent" start, using Dry/Cold settings helps out but isn't required. No Alphabet AIs helps a lot but isn't required. No Barbarians helps quite a bit but isn't required.
You need to get the Great Library for it to work, and Invention from it, and have Iron to build/upgrade Berserkers (IIRC... been several months since I've played). The tech pace can't be too fast or you can't get the Archers and Curraghs to upgrade or the cash to do the upgrades. For 20k to work you might need to get a Library and Temple build in somewhere early.
Load up the Berserkers and raze cities. Leave the AI's units outside of cities alone. (You can draw AI units out of cities if you have to by suiciding a unit somewhere on their island if you can land... not always a given.)
It takes a good 300 turns under good conditions to get 20k in one city. That means you could conceivably start building Culture at 1250AD and still hit 20k by 2050AD if all the Wonders were still buildable. ~1000AD is probably the cutoff date for starting full bore on Cultural improvements though, as the AI will be building Wonders. If you're going to be able to handle the AI this way, it's most likely to be in hand by late BC's or early AD's though, leaving plenty of time. Until that point the Palace, Great Library, Temple, and Library will be accumulating culture to help somewhat offset the Wonders that the AI will take early on.
If you don't get the Great Library... try again. If you don't get Iron... try again. If you don't get to Invention soon enough... try again. If the AI gets a big island and has inland cities... try again. If something goes wrong and you can't militarily deal with the AI... try again.
It's definitely not a sure thing, but the odds are best this way I think.
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Mountain Sage
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quote:
Originally posted by punkbass2000
One question: Why France? For the extra commerce/shields at city size? They don't seem totally counter-intuitive to me, but I would think other traits could be better.
BTW, did you miss out on Shakespears? |
I was more concerned in maximizing the gpt, in order to research at 90-100% and keep some military units (for which you have to pay). I believe in the MA I had 1 pike, 3 Med Inf and 2 trebuchets. The pike became a musketeer, which triggered my GA.
Then, with France as industrious, I needed only 2 workers (less costs) to improve all the tiles.
As I never planned military expeditions like Aeson's and switched government only once to Republic, militaristic, expansionist and religeous civs were out. My map has lots of coast, in order to give chances for other civs to meet fairly early, so seafaring was not a necessay trait.
I never tried to go for Shakespeare, as I zoomed for the essential techs, from Astronomy then to Theory of Gravity. I even missed out Economics, imagine!
As for winning on an unedited map, it should be possible, but my previous (missed) games show that with 5 cities and more, the AI becomes unstoppable in terms of research output. Even on a tiny 80% water map, most other civs will have more than 4 cities, but it's worth another try, I guess.
One of the differences with Aeson's game is that I tried to play it the most 'normally' possible, i.e. with 8 civs (vs. his 2) and giving them the same bonuses in terms of luxuries and resources.
Anyway, as stated, my idea was to have a diplo win at Sid (or even a spaceship). I had not expected the 20K. As I remember, the next civ was Egypt with 16K.
If somedody else comes up with a win on an unedited map, please post it...
Now I'm back to earth (so to say), Emperor, Rome, continents, 8 random civs, conquest win...
Without bragging, is there another interesting challenge around?
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27-11-2004 00:57
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