16-12-2004 08:52									#271
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quote: They either did purposely overwater the ground or they maltreated the ground. Both are as bad as eachother.

If they maltreated the ground then it wasn't the conspiracy you are trying to find .

quote: What turnovers?

Have you or have you not been constantly refering to the TWO FUMBLES?

quote: Because there was something on the line. What does a #3 receiver playing on a non-playoff team have to play for?

Baltimore in 2002 finished only 2 games out of the playoffs. And lost 2 out of their games after Stokley was out by less than 10 points. I'd say there was something on the line.

quote: throughout the last 20 years or so the best teams have always had high turnover differentials.

And also either a high ranked offense or a high ranked defense . Marginalizing offense and defense performance to turnovers is silly.

	17-12-2004 06:38									#272
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quote: Have you or have you not been constantly refering to the TWO FUMBLES?

In the New England game, yes. You diverted discussion to the Houston and Jacksonville games.

quote: Baltimore in 2002 finished only 2 games out of the playoffs. And lost 2 out of their games after Stokley was out by less than 10 points. I'd say there was something on the line.

It's Baltimore... he's hardly going to be looked at a lot, is he. Even when he did get on the field he probably wasn't looked at much.

I'll have to check if he was put on IR or not.

quote: And also either a high ranked offense or a high ranked defense . Marginalizing offense and defense performance to turnovers is silly.

Not really, because turnovers give you a free ticket to get more yards and hence a high ranked offense. A team which has a ot of yeards generally has a defense giving it turnovers and hence more oppurtunity to get more yards.

They go hand in hand, and hence another reason I think yards is a bad statistic for a good offense

quote: If they maltreated the ground then it wasn't the conspiracy you are trying to find .

If they care for player safety they'll shut the roof. If they didn't, or they watered down the field, then they must have done it for a different reason (i.e. to slow down the other team and make the field fit their style)...

	17-12-2004 06:49									#273
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I'll bet Stokley played for the U of C...

	17-12-2004 10:54									#274
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quote: In the New England game, yes. You diverted discussion to the Houston and Jacksonville games.

Well, against Jacksonville, Indy lost two fumbles in one game and Peyton had an INT in the other.

quote: It's Baltimore... he's hardly going to be looked at a lot, is he. Even when he did get on the field he probably wasn't looked at much.

Every reciever in Baltimore matters. They have to pass sometimes and it isn't like their starters were that 'go-to'.

quote: Not really, because turnovers give you a free ticket to get more yards and hence a high ranked offense. A team which has a ot of yeards generally has a defense giving it turnovers and hence more oppurtunity to get more yards.

You have really bassackwards. Turnovers give you a free ticket to more points, especially if it is close to your endzone. You still have to work for yards and turnovers, if anything, give you a smaller field, meaning you have less yards you can gain.

quote: If they care for player safety they'll shut the roof. If they didn't, or they watered down the field, then they must have done it for a different reason (i.e. to slow down the other team and make the field fit their style)...

And with the propensity for sudden storms in the South, they should close the roof for every game? Have you ever been to the Southern US? Here in Atlanta we have clear sunny skies which out of nowhere erupt into pouring rain, which is done in 10 minutes and sun is out again.

	17-12-2004 12:27									#275
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quote: Well, against Jacksonville, Indy lost two fumbles in one game and Peyton had an INT in the other.

Jacksonville had nothing to do with the New England game. You are seriously trying to divert discussion here. What do a couple of WR fumbles in the Jacksonville game have to do with James fumbling twice in the New England game? Not a lot, I assure you

quote: Every reciever in Baltimore matters. They have to pass sometimes and it isn't like their starters were that 'go-to'.

But when your base formation doesn't call for 3 WRs, and Stokely is a slot receiver, he doesn't get looked at much because he's not on the field much.

quote: You have really bassackwards. Turnovers give you a free ticket to more points, especially if it is close to your endzone. You still have to work for yards and turnovers, if anything, give you a smaller field, meaning you have less yards you can gain.

But if a team has 10 drives, they generally have more total yards than a team with 13 or 14, no?

quote: And with the propensity for sudden storms in the South, they should close the roof for every game? Have you ever been to the Southern US? Here in Atlanta we have clear sunny skies which out of nowhere erupt into pouring rain, which is done in 10 minutes and sun is out again.

I know fully well about those type of climates, and the reason grounds get wet are because of consistent rain which has time to sink into the surface. When you get 10 minute rainfalls, it doesn't have time to soak in and linger around for a week. So if the water did linger around, it must have been a long shower which means they could have closed the roof. Otherwise in about 6 hours the ground is dry again and you'd have sworn there was no rain, especially in the heat common in those climates.

	17-12-2004 19:01									#276
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I can't believe you guys are still going at it.

	17-12-2004 19:29									#277
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This will go on until Indy loses in the play offs.

	17-12-2004 22:32									#278
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quote: In the New England game, yes. You diverted discussion to the Houston and Jacksonville games.

quote: Jacksonville had nothing to do with the New England game. You are seriously trying to divert discussion here.

quote: We had 0 turnovers against Houston, and I believe 1 against Jacksonville in two games.

Res ipsa loquitor

quote: But when your base formation doesn't call for 3 WRs, and Stokely is a slot receiver, he doesn't get looked at much because he's not on the field much.

He still is a factor in the offense. 3rd down and long? He is obviously used. After all, Bryan Westbook was just a 3rd down back a few years back when Staley was the feature back, but he was very important.

quote: But if a team has 10 drives, they generally have more total yards than a team with 13 or 14, no?

Did you mean 'less' or 'more'? And it depends. Having more drives can mean more punts or quicker TDs.

quote: When you get 10 minute rainfalls, it doesn't have time to soak in and linger around for a week.

A week? What about earlier that day? or the day before?

	17-12-2004 22:34									#279
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Talk about the Rams! :doitnow:

	17-12-2004 22:47									#280
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Rams suck .

	17-12-2004 22:55									#281
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Rams suck .

No they don't! They just have injuries this year! Now say more about them and shut up about all other teams!

	17-12-2004 23:03									#282
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The Bills would cream the Rams.

	17-12-2004 23:04									#283
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quote: Originally posted by pchang This will go on until Indy loses in the play offs.

or wins the superbowl

	17-12-2004 23:19									#284
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quote: Originally posted by Kidicious No they don't! They just have injuries this year! Now say more about them and shut up about all other teams!

Um... Rams suck more?

Bulger just isn't that great of a QB, I'm convinced.

	17-12-2004 23:25									#285
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quote: Originally posted by Richelieu The Bills would cream the Rams.

I think the Bills are a good team. And they did cream the Rams.

	17-12-2004 23:26									#286
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Um... Rams suck more? Bulger just isn't that great of a QB, I'm convinced.

Why do you say that? He seems to do much better than every other QB that steps in for him? What do you consider his weaknesses?

	17-12-2004 23:36									#287
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He throws too many interceptions compared to his TDs.

	17-12-2004 23:52									#288
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui He throws too many interceptions compared to his TDs.

Most of those are on 3rd and long. They are more like punts. True that he hasn't thrown enough TDs this year. Why do you think that is, and don't just say he sucks. Maybe it's because the defense is on the field too much. But also they are having trouble in the red zone. He has run a couple in. Too me that is a sign of problems in the passing game.

	17-12-2004 23:58									#289
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Last year Bulger had 22 INTs for 22 TDs. This year he's got 12 INTs for 17 TDs. I'd say the problem is with Bulger

	18-12-2004 00:22									#290
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Certainly not. I'm not saying Chandler is a great QB, but he threw 6 ints last week. Obviously it's a team problem, if it's really a problem at all. I don't think that it's the reason they are losing games.

	18-12-2004 04:53									#291
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If it will quiet Imran, I hope Peyton gets his ring.

Even if the Colts have to beat the Chargers in the AFC final.

	18-12-2004 05:12									#292
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quote: Originally posted by Kidicious Why do you say that? He seems to do much better than every other QB that steps in for him? What do you consider his weaknesses?

His biggest weakness is the offensive line. He has no had no time to throw this year, and really no running game. Everybody knows he's going to throw, and his line can't stop anybody.

And remember folks... there are games on Saturday, so don't wait til Sunday to make picks and set rosters

	18-12-2004 05:20									#293
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quote: Originally posted by Ming His biggest weakness is the offensive line. He has no had no time to throw this year, and really no running game. Everybody knows he's going to throw, and his line can't stop anybody.

That's true, but he's done pretty good considering that. They should run more in the red zone. Maybe they will these last games with Steven Jackson.

	18-12-2004 05:29									#294
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They need to run out of their base formation more. They change formation to run a lot of the time. You can't telegraph your intentions to the defense and expect to be successful.

	18-12-2004 11:04									#295
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This looks like a boring week. The Packers vs. Jags game seems to be the most exciting.

	19-12-2004 00:52									#296
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And Colts - Ravens isn't? If the Ravens lose they are pretty much out of the playoffs while Peyton goes for the touchdown record.

Plus it's an AFC game

	19-12-2004 02:04									#298
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The Giants are playing like a football team today. 4thQ lead against the Steelers!

	19-12-2004 02:10									#299
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quote: Originally posted by pchang They need to run out of their base formation more. They change formation to run a lot of the time. You can't telegraph your intentions to the defense and expect to be successful.

They change their formation for sure, but they run or pass out of any formation. They problem is they only run on 1st and 10, or short yardage. That's where they need to make some changes, and that's an area where I agree that they should run more. They should run on 2nd and 10 more definitely.

	19-12-2004 02:12									#300
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Crap. How many TDs is that for the Bus now?