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Kloreep
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of the pillow
Jun 2002
time: 00:17
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Here's my work on the trade conundrum. There are two possibilities I see: One in which we don't give Python a share in Gunpowder (they never payed us, after all; there was a big stink over us not needing Mono from them, which was going to cheapen the price), and one in which we let them in if they pay us the gold they would have now.
Theology: Cost: 40 (100% Sunshine; 1067 beakers)
Invention: Cost: 44 (1/3 Tabemono, 2/3 CoD&Python; 1173)
Gunpowder: Cost: 48 (1280 beakers; researched by Tabemono, CoD payed us 433 gold or about 1/3rd, Python did not pay us at all due to Mono mixup)
Invention & Gunpowder for Sunshine: 92 tech points
Theology for 3: 120 tech points
Tabemono effectively owns 46 2/3 of these tech points, seeing as Python never payed us for Gunpowder. Accordingly, Sunshine owes us 6 2/3 tech points in this deal.
So far as I know, Python funded 1/3rd of Invention like we did. So Python effectively owns 14 2/3 of these tech points. They owe 25 1/3 tech points to Sunshine in this deal.
CoD owns 1/3 of each. So CoD owes Sunshine 9 1/3 tech points in this deal.
A simpler way of putting this scenario, in which Python is not given a share of Gunpowder, would be:
Python owes 18 2/3 (498 gold) tech points to Sunshine and 6 2/3 (178 gold) tech points to Tabemono
CoD owes Sunshine 9 1/3 tech points (249 gold)
Of course, this is assuming Python does not have a share in Gunpowder. If we're generous and let them pay us back at this late date, they owe us 16 tech points, but get 1/3 of Gunpowder in the sale to Sunshine (and any other teams.)
If we do let Python on board the Gunpowder train, then:
Python owes Tabemono 16 tech points (427 gold)
Python, CoD, and Tabemono each owe Sunshine 9 1/3 tech points (249 gold)
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Kloreep
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of the pillow
Jun 2002
time: 00:17
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Python already has GP. We sent it to them but they never sent anything back. :S But read below, I think we can use that.
Okay, how about this: We say that CoD's portion entitles them to give it to Python and Monkey (IOW, entitles them to embargo Monkey), and we get the rights to the other three teams on this continent. Since Python has never payed anyone for GP so far as I know, this lets CoD wrangle any payment wanted out of them, rather than making us do it.  This is slightly generous to them, really, as they would have to buy up an extra 9% - 105 gold - to give them the rights to Monkey if we were counting them, since CoD would need 3/7 rather than 2/6. But it's simpler just to assume Monkey doesn't exist, and throw CoD the rights to Monkey as an afterthought, IMO. Call it compensation to the CoD/Python alliance for our oversight on Mono with Python.
Invention remains split between us now and forever. Since LL (and IIRC MAST too?) already have it, there's not much point in assigning rights at this point. (Though we should make sure no one on the other continent traded it; if they did, we're owed some gold.)
This leaves us with the rights to Gunpowder on our continent. LL will have to research it themselves, or get someone to break a NTA. The former wouldn't be too hard for them, but at least it delays them.
So:
Python pays Sunshine 14 2/3 tech points; they owe Sunshine compensation for 25 1/3 tech points. (Roughly 100 gold, I'd say.)
CoD also pays Sunshine 14 2/3 tech points (remember, no rights to Gunpowder on this continent); they too owe Sunshine compensation for 25 1/3 tech points. (Roughly 100 gold, dividing by 7.)
We pay Sunshine 62 2/3 tech points (remember, we get all rights to GP on this continent); Sunshine owes us 22 2/3 tech points. (Roughly 85 gold, dividing by 7.)
Sunshine agrees not to trade Invention or Gunpowder to anyone else. We all agree not to trade Theo to anyone else.
Unless there are objections to this proposal, I think we should send it to CoD & Python.
I'm not sure Python is going to be too happy about this, but tough. 
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Kloreep
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of the pillow
Jun 2002
time: 00:17
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Sending the following to Arrian, Cort Haus, Modo44, and OctavianX
quote:
I propose the following as a Sunshine-Tabemono-CoD-Python trade.
Please correct me if I'm wrong on this, but I believe that Tabemono, Python, and CoD each own 1/3rd of Invention, having payed 1/3rd of the cost each. (I know we have 1/3rd of Invention, but I don't remember if CoD and Python invested equally or not. BTW, you guys didn't trade Invention to MAST and LL, did you?)
CoD payed 1/3rd of the cost of Gunpowder and thus owns 1/3rd of it. Python received it but didn't pay us (Monotheism screwup on our part). I propose we break up Gunpowder rights, giving CoD the rights to Python and Monkey, and Tabemono the rights to Sunshine, MAST, and Latin Lover. CoD can collect payment from Python if they feel necessary (I guess that would be about 7 tech points worth of gold, but it would be between you two). Tabemono can sell Gunpowder on its own continent.
This would mean the Theology trade would work as follows:
Python pays Sunshine 14 2/3 tech points (1/3rd of Invention); they owe Sunshine compensation for 25 1/3 tech points. (Roughly 100 gold, dividing by 7.)
CoD also pays Sunshine 14 2/3 tech points (1/3rd of Invention); they too owe Sunshine compensation for 25 1/3 tech points. (Roughly 100 gold, dividing by 7.)
We pay Sunshine 62 2/3 tech points (Gunpowder and 1/3rd of Invention); Sunshine owes us 22 2/3 tech points. (Roughly 85 gold, dividing by 7.)
Strict NTA: All parties agree not to trade the techs received to other civs.
If this is agreeable to your teams, I'll send this on to Sunshine. |
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12-12-2004 03:50
I'm afraid they're really necessary when doing trading of a joint tech like this. 
I'd say you should move forward with it.
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