18-12-2004 00:52									#1
	2153: Pre-planning discussion and build/movement orders Full PM-box? Change here!

In 2153 Yang discovers Superconductor (weapon-5, Gatling lasers)

we have a probe team sitting in the Pegasus in Great Collective Bay

In 2153 Mercury will dock in Arcadia university, and Mr Longstrider will lope down to Monitoring Station and relieve Zak of Optical Computers

The only other tech Yang has that we lack is Polysoft. If he'll talk to us this turn or next, why don't we try to trade for/buy Polysoft, then steal Superconductor or if we can't get Polysoft, take our 50:50 chances of getting Superconductor?

Our probe would be returned to MT, GH or SC4 in 2153, and the Peg can reach any of these (or be offshore) for pick-up again in 2154, so we don't loose very much by this (other than possible war with Yang)

But I don't think Yang will risk war - he has only 2 impact units in the 4 bases nearest us, and seems to be gearing up for a Morgan conflict (as they themselves are, with 2 military units now in Red Fungus Resort and 2 probes in Choke-on-This

	18-12-2004 03:19									#2
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If we can handle Yang, and by "handle" I mean stop him from doing damage, that's a good plan. A trade, and no war, would be most favorable, as a start to using Yang against others...

	20-12-2004 18:05									#3
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I've had a look at some things we could do in MY 2153:

How should we set our energy allocations? After pacting with Lal and getting all that extra commerce & energy, the inefficiency created by running uneven economy-labs allocations has become rather large.

To compare with the MY 2152 situation:

Currently we're running 60-20-20 and we produce 14 surplus credits and 7.2 labs. However as the drone problems with SC1 and SC2 can be solved next year (see below), psych can be reduced again.

Under 60-10-30 we produce 15 surplus credits and 13.6 labs.
Under 60-0-40 we produce 18 surplus credits and 16.8 labs. Downside of putting Psych to 0% is that we need to garrison Arcadia University with two units, which means one unit less moving to the front.
Under 50-10-40 we produce 11 surplus credits and 22.4 labs.
Under 50-0-50 we produce 14 surplus credits (by changing the AU doctor to a technician) and 24.8 labs. Next tech breakthrough anticipated in 29 years. Drawback here is again that by putting psych to 0%, we'd have to keep two units garrisoning Arcadia University, which means one unit less that can move east.

To summarize, the two questions are:

Should we let as many units as possible move to combat and lose some credits & labs as a consequence (due to investing in psych), or instead keep an extra unit as a garrison unit?

And second question: What do we value most? Some extra credits now, or roughly speaking double as many extra labs, but labs that will only result in a tech a considerable number of years down the road?



Btw, we got a free network node in Rio Grande after conquering Koppernigk Observatory. It seems that bug is working again where one gets a free facility in one of your domestic bases, when you conquer a base of a faction that has that facility as its free fac.



As Gythium harbour will grow to size 4 next turn, we need to appoint a doctor. May I therefore suggest to put the two remaining GH workers on the 2-1-1 tile and the 1-2-2 forest tile? GH will grow despite producing not enough nuts to feed its population.

In combination with this, may I suggest to move the SC2 forest worker to the 3-1-0 tile? This will allow SC2 to grow in 2 turns. That fourth worker would also have to be a doctor, but that doctor (and the resulting +2 psych) would allow us to move the Ogre to SC4, so that base can grow to size 3 without needing doctors.



A possible unit shuffling plan for solving drone troubles. Very important nothing happens wrong here, or we'll have drone riots after all:
Shrek Ogre in SC2 moves to SC1.
Fiona Ogre in GH moves to SC2.
One of the hoplites in SC1 moves to SC2.
One of the three hoplites in SC4 moves to GH.

	20-12-2004 19:30									#4
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quote: Originally posted by Maniac Btw, we got a free network node in Rio Grande after conquering Koppernigk Observatory.

That's weird!
But fine with me, I say we cash in our artifact right away

As for the rest, I wouldn't value labs at all right now. 60-10-30 would be my best bet, we need those troops on the front.

	20-12-2004 20:27									#5
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quote: Originally posted by Snoddasmannen That's weird! But fine with me, I say we cash in our artifact right away

Wouldn't it be better to wait for the trade with Angels? And the anticipated extraction(s) from Zak? Just to make absolutely sure we don't get something we have access to anyway...

	20-12-2004 20:38									#6
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quote: Originally posted by Maniac Btw, we got a free network node in Rio Grande after conquering Koppernigk Observatory. It seems that bug is working again where one gets a free facility in one of your domestic bases, when you conquer a base of a faction that has that facility as its free fac.

Hmm - you're right.

But we lost the one at Kop Obs

I missed picking that up 'cos when I checked our F3 screen we were reporting 2 nodes, and I assumed that was correct (I never did look at Kop Obs to verify that we had captured theirs)

But why Rio Grande? - and not Vladivostok - it's not as though its the nearest base (nor even the same base # built - ie the uni's 2nd built, gives the node to our 2nd built, or something logical like that. RG is our tenth built, while Kop Obs is the Uni's 4th)

	20-12-2004 20:41									#7
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And it's not free:

(We are also paying upkeep for AU's network node)

Attachment: rio grande budget.jpg
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	21-12-2004 01:41									#8
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quote: Originally posted by Modo44 Wouldn't it be better to wait for the trade with Angels? And the anticipated extraction(s) from Zak? Just to make absolutely sure we don't get something we have access to anyway...

Agreed

I am interested to hear what the others have to say about cashing the aa as well. I have suggested this previously but have always had to admit defeat This time I think the idea has more merit, or am I still in the dark here?

	21-12-2004 06:10									#9
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No - we got a bonus when we first got that podpop crawler built - that allowed us to just use 1 AA for the Command Nexus - and at that time in the turn thread we said that we'd cash in the second AA for a tech

I don't think we should rush it, though (although it is on the Mercury's next manifest - it's wending its way to Vald for onward transmission to AU to link with the node there)

Right now we'd have a probability of getting polysoft, opticals or superconductor - which would be a waste as Yang has all 3, or maybe Synthetic Fossils, which Lal will have in 5 or 6 turns. Or even worse, a chance of getting Int Int, so essentially we'd have given away EthCalc and Soc Psych for nothing.

So I'd wait for the right moment strategically - for instance, when cashing it might give us D:AP or Fusion Power, or summat huge like that

	21-12-2004 08:49									#10
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Some Builds for 2153 for bases needing new orders:

Arcadia University:- will commission a Crypteia in 2153. Needs a crawler (3 rows of ten minerals) to crawl food. We have only 9 turns' worth left in the foodbox at the present -2 rate of attrition. Even if we were able to put the doctor back to work we are still at a -1 rate. Of course, it's vying for primetime with a 1-2tr-6 cutter (the Enterprise) which is only 2 rows of ten minerals.

So a solution might be - Enterprise, followed by a couple of crawlers.

Fort Buster:- will commission a crawler in 2153. Another crawler so that we will have replacements for after the CDF hurry

Rio Grande:- producing a Hoplite in 2153. A crawler to work that 7-mineral tile

And on a side note:

quote: Posted earlier in this thread by Maniac In combination with this, may I suggest to move the SC2 forest worker to the 3-1-0 tile? This will allow SC2 to grow in 2 turns.

2 turns after the change in 2153 - in other words, it'll grow to size 4 in 2155

	23-12-2004 18:28									#11
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Build orders sound great.

Btw, since those formers near RG now have accumulated a terraforming turn already, should one already be able to finish a roard on the flat river tile NE of their current position?

	23-12-2004 19:31									#12
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Theoretically yes - but why would we want to put a road in the river bed - it acts as a road anyway (or are you anticipating another Rio Grande shift?)

Why wouldn't we move bith formers there and plant a forest for Messena to work immediately its established?

	24-12-2004 05:09									#13
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quote: Originally posted by Googlie Theoretically yes - but why would we want to put a road in the river bed - it acts as a road anyway (or are you anticipating another Rio Grande shift?)

A river only works as a road if you exactly follow the riverbed. So if we don't want to spend an entire movement point moving on or off the Rio Grande but instead interconnect the river with our road network, we still need to build a road somewhere on the river. I figured the pic below was the most efficient road towards Messena.

quote: Why wouldn't we move bith formers there and plant a forest for Messena to work immediately its established?

Forest sounds great there!
May I suggest to build the road first though (ie, if you agree to build one there), as building a road on a flat river tile costs two terraforming turns, while building a road on a forest river tile costs four terraforming turns (IIRC)? If I calculated right, the forest should still be able to be planted before Messena is founded.

	24-12-2004 06:03									#14
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Aha - then I agree. A road then a forest.

But my proposed site for Messena isn't the best (58:6). That's a Rolling and Moist tile. Better would be 57:7 (flat and rainy). Also, Messena would then be built in 2155 rather than 2156, and there'd be one less roadtile needed to link it to the rest of the world

That way the proposed forest on the river at 56:10 could be shared by Rio Grande as well as by Messena. And as well, it fits with a subsequent base at 52:6 that would complete that NW grid.

Attachment: messena site.jpg
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Last edited by Googlie on 24-12-2004 at 06:36

	24-12-2004 19:30									#15
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Turn's Up !!! - and some early unit moves:

• Got Adapt Econ from the Angels pre-accepted - accepted it
  
• Got 5 ec's from Morgan
  
• Mercury docked in AU - Longstrider loped down to MonStat. It'd cost 628 (I think that was the number) to mind control. Successfully extracted Opticals and returned to Argos
  
• Put Opticals pre-accepted in the Angels diplobox
  
• Invincible popped a facs completion - Minas Tirith now has a trance syntharmored speeder supply completed!!

Formers move 1 tile up Rio Grande and completed road - now working on a forest

• Colony pod copnvoy moved NE x 1 and are now 1 tile away from base site
  
• RT-2 moved southeast and now is on new riverroad tile with the Tomcats
  
• CRV-112 moved East 1 tile into fungus, ready for Pegasus pick-up
  
• Hunter moved north, jogging west en route to map the Morgan coastline - uncovered 2 juicy pods for popping next 2 turns
  
• Hermes moved south with her colony pod and crypteia cargo, and is now in a position to offload them next turn at the designated base site
  
• MT scout en route to form new base garrison moved onto Rio Rojo - will reach the site the turn the base is founded
  
• Pegasus moved south 3 tiles (first was fungus() through Styx

Pausing now for some screenies

	24-12-2004 19:34									#16
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SCC Hunter and those juicy pods

Attachment: 2153-hunter.jpg
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	24-12-2004 19:41									#17
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Hermes' cargo and scout due to meet in 2155

Attachment: 2153newbase.jpg
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Last edited by Googlie on 24-12-2004 at 19:46

	24-12-2004 19:51									#18
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Xak has changed production at Otk-Dis from an energy bank to an impact unit - and rushed it:

Attachment: otk-dis.jpg
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	24-12-2004 19:56									#19
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Pegasus and CRV-112 getting closer

Attachment: peg & crv-2153.jpg
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	24-12-2004 19:56									#20
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Invasion:

Mercury docked, and units deployed

• Synthspeeder to Argos and homed there - Garrison duty
  
• Chiron Knights NW onto river (for attack on Otk-Dis next turn) encounters a mindworm, so kills it, taking some damage (it'll be the one to "liberate" the base, healing in the process - moves onto tile
  
• Spartan kel joins it
  
• Warwag, from Argos, joins it
  
• Castor Horsemen, from AU (just landed) mosey down but end up just beside them

Last edited by Googlie on 25-12-2004 at 05:26

	24-12-2004 20:29									#21
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Engineering Corps report:

Tomcat Deployment

• As mentioned, road on river bed NE of RG completed - forest now being planted there
  
• Forest completed between RG and FB - Tomcat moves SW x 1 to forest tile 53:15 (can be used by RG, FB and SC3)
  
• Tomcat on monolith between SC and OA moves E x 1 and commences mine there
  
• Tomcat SW of SC moves W x 1 and commences road linking GH to SC
  
• 2 Tomcats north of Vlad completed farm - need fresh orders for 2154
  
• Others are in mid-task (Mine at MT, road linking SC and MT, Forest between SC2 and GH, Farm W of OA N of SC2)

Last edited by Googlie on 25-12-2004 at 05:56

	25-12-2004 05:21									#22
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All moves made. 2153 endturn attached

Need final concensus on slider allocation (eg, AU needs a doctor as all Impact Rovers are in the attack group - it'll be 2 turns before Mercury returns with Hoplite garrison units)

Attachment: acdg-3 - 2153 endturn.zip
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Last edited by Googlie on 25-12-2004 at 06:03

	25-12-2004 13:11									#23
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Wow great turn! Another completion pod!
Looks like we're all set for the CDF. Which SP are we going for next?

quote: Originally posted by Googlie Engineering Corps report: MT's speeder crawler completed this turn on a podpop, and next turn will work its way into the heartland, crawling as it goes

This always gets me REAL worried, driving around with half an SP, crawling. I always hide them in bases or keep them real closely escorted when I transport them, don't want a nasty mindworm to catch it!

	25-12-2004 19:43									#24
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It'd survive a mindworm attack - it'll be hardened, and its tranced.

But we could always send Rolling Thunder II down to GH to meet up with it (3 turns)

Or after the crawler gets commissioned next turn, build a hoplite at MT for escorting purposes (3 mins per turn for a ten-turn unit, but we could always rush it)

Or put a Hoplite in MT's build queue and let the 3 mins from this turn carry over (0 mins needed for completion, 'cos of the podpop) in which case we could rush next turn for 19 ec's (I think - I like Maniac to confirm these rush costs)

	26-12-2004 01:34									#25
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Turn looks wonderful as usual!

quote: Originally posted by Googlie But my proposed site for Messena isn't the best (58:6). That's a Rolling and Moist tile. Better would be 57:7 (flat and rainy). Also, Messena would then be built in 2155 rather than 2156, and there'd be one less roadtile needed to link it to the rest of the world

Btw, Vladivostok will grow to size 2 in four turns, and thus will require a second hoplite. Should we switch VV production to a hoplite, or solve it otherwise?

quote: FB's worker taken off the 1-4-1 forested mineral tile to the N and put on 1-2 crater tile to allow crawler to work the forest/min tile en route (next turn) to working RG's big mine (will rehome to RG while passing thru)

Something to think about : if we didn’t rehome the crawler to RG, we could make Fort Buster our most productive base with 15 minerals: a crawler every two turns.

quote: Need final concensus on slider allocation

IIRC Snoddasmannen suggested 60-10-30. As no one else told another opinion, I guess that’s the consensus.

quote: It'd [the super supply speeder] survive a mindworm attack - it'll be hardened, and its tranced

Even better – won’t it be commando? Command center + Fundy + Spartan morale bonus.

Also if the crawler hugs the coast while moving north, it won’t border any fungus tile. So I think it should be pretty safe.

	26-12-2004 05:09									#26
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quote: Originally posted by Maniac Btw, Vladivostok will grow to size 2 in four turns, and thus will require a second hoplite. Should we switch VV production to a hoplite, or solve it otherwise?

maybe we send RT2 there where it can wait and garrison until a Hoplite gets built after the crawler

quote: Something to think about : if we didn’t rehome the crawler to RG, we could make Fort Buster our most productive base with 15 minerals: a crawler every two turns.

- a crawler production line !!

quote: IIRC Snoddasmannen suggested 60-10-30. As no one else told another opinion, I guess that’s the consensus.

That seems to give the best combination of everything anyway

Re half-a-SP crawler:

quote: Even better – won’t it be commando? Command center + Fundy + Spartan morale bonus. Also if the crawler hugs the coast while moving north, it won’t border any fungus tile. So I think it should be pretty safe.

Plus its a rover chassis, so is moving 2 tiles at a time. It'll be on 60:26 next turn, and on the road to SC the turn after

	26-12-2004 07:02									#27
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quote: Originally posted by Googlie maybe we send RT2 there where it can wait and garrison until a Hoplite gets built after the crawler