26-11-2000 00:39									#31
	Put an end to popups!

Species won't make it Monday. ANybody else interested in this diplogame?

	27-11-2000 21:41									#32
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Doesn't look like this will get off the ground this week huh? Of course if we can get one more person to get in.......as far as what KenThur said...I agree completely. Exploration of the game is one of the most interesting aspects. I just want to play and have fun.....I'm not worried about where I start or anything like that....
<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by drake (edited November 27, 2000).]</font>

	27-11-2000 21:48									#33
	Full PM-box? Change here!

What are the thoughts of a smaller map with the 4 players we have?

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if i display a lack of skill, please note the enthusiasm

	28-11-2000 10:57									#34
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We could, but i'm going to stil try to find a 5th player before the starting time.

	28-11-2000 02:45									#35
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Just checking in. I will do my best to be online by 6 PM eastern. It is possible that I may not get on until 6:30.

I have not been able to prepare a 5 player world map. So we could just go with a standard world map and not choose any tribes from the Americas.

I am also not against a totally random Civ Map... however that could make the diplo story telling harder, since we would not have a common geographic reference point.

Hope we get started tonight.

Epik

	28-11-2000 03:05									#36
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yeah i feel pre-made map is a must

	29-11-2000 04:50									#37
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Originally posted by KenThur on 11-25-2000 09:03
I doubt that U'll will change your mindset(or start times) for this game but i'll use the thread to throw out some alternative ideas.

(Crusty)***You seem to be the one expressing a "mindset", and a somewhat narrow sounding one at that.

I'm certain many of Civ MP players that are extremely wary of ANY manipulation of the rules or maps to achieve "fairness" or "equality". Thus, we will not get involved in any contest where ANYONE changes / messes with what is an EXCELLENT game system as designed. All this discussion smacks of communists "leadership" trying to figure out how the world should set up & run. (plus, it's so much waste of valuable & limited play time)

(Crusty)***This excellent game system allows for even those who would like to play 2x2x, or on a geometrical homemade map, prince or deity level or scenario premade or homemade if you like.
Are you saying folks arent free to choose Comrade Thur?
Playing unjustifyably excessively long turns is a waste of time for others in a game BTW

Why don't U just PLAY? Why must all this time & energy be spent on managing the start? Especially for a DIPLO game, where U have 4000 years, thru untold players & eras to affect the end results? It is supposed to be about cooperation & building civ's... or being hell-bent on destroying each other as soon as U find'm?

(Crusty)***Every one does PLAY Civ, even those who don't fall into your preferred mold of play.

To try to pre-manage the outcome so that U end up with civ's that are all designed to be "equal" in opportunity, size, & everything else, is to not understand the fun of it nor how well Sid & his fellow geniuses designed in subtle play balances. (as cited; 1 of reasons raging barbs=good idea).
Nor are U recognizing the fact that "little" countries like Portugal, Netherlands, Japan, Sweden, Eygpt made BIG civ's during history. Or that "big", resource-rich countries like Australia or Brazil have never become major powers.

(Crusty)*** I agree with your point on differing empires in history... even think about the USA starting out "late in the game" (try starting out at 1500, or even 1000AD with a settler and a sail or a trireme as the case may be)
I am sure about not being alone in loving to play on an unknown and hostile world, with all the things you glorify as the only true game...
But am, like those you criticise in the "pre-made map-diplogame arena, also interested in exploring other types of games including one with a premade equal landmass for each player game. This is not a "fairer" game, just a differant parameter game. I am not interested in this because i think there is a problem with wonders and random starts, barbs and whatever. But it interests me to try out some even playing field strategies differant then trading and co operating. Who doesn't love to explore, and ransom barb kings, and exploit ai opponants or crush other human ones?

Taking your start situation and DEALING with it is what I love about this game. But I also love the freedom to play on a premade (human vs ai manipulated map) even a gometrical one if I choose. And as long as a player pulls no punches and all players are in agreement on the parameters it is no funny buisness, it is just variety!!
Are you against variety Comrade Thur?


<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by Crustacian (edited November 28, 2000).]</font>

	08-12-2000 02:29									#38
	Get a bigger avatar today!

so if there should be any DiploGames starting soon, could someone inform me over ICQ? I'd like to play a DiploGame at some point

	09-12-2000 02:48									#39
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

This game has already started in Tales from the MOnday Night Diplomatic Front. This thread should be closed if it weren't for KenThur's discussion. I'd ask around if your looking for a diplo-game, so you catch the next one.

	12-12-2000 13:53									#40
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Am interested if you need another player.