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Mathemagician is offline Mathemagician
King
Darmstadt, Hessen, Germany, Europe, Earth, Solar System, Alpha-Quadrant, Milky Way
Sep 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 10-01-2005 22:24
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quote:
Originally posted by Dimytes
Switching from one building to another for example from temple to a Factory after rusbuying the temple is no cheat. The ammount of production you gain per gold invested is the same as if you rushbuy something completley. I see this as an tactical option.


actually it is not the same. the amount you pay is not a linear function of the remaining production units.
if it was, buying a cheaper building to make use of the base city production might be tolerable. but the way it is, i would see it as questionable at least.

Mathemagician is offline Mathemagician
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Sep 2002
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  Old Post 10-01-2005 22:32
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the process of buying cheaper items first, then going up the 'ramp' to more expensive ones (also of the same type), while buying at least twice is called 'ramping' and is considered cheating - because of the mentioned effect.
i dont know how buying one item, switching to one of the same type and letting base production do the rest, is regarded.

Dimytes is offline Dimytes
Prince
Bjärnum, Sweden
Sep 2003
time: 06:32
  Old Post 10-01-2005 23:17
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Wow, I had no clue about that. Just made a study on it and can confirm that when a unit is near end of production the cost to rushbuy is about 2.3 times lower than when you start a new production. I have only made a test on settler.
So yes, after seeing that I agree it shuld not be legal.

©2004 Dimytes

filix is offline filix
Warlord

Apr 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 11-01-2005 03:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Dimytes
Wow, I had no clue about that. Just made a study on it and can confirm that when a unit is near end of production the cost to rushbuy is about 2.3 times lower than when you start a new production. I have only made a test on settler.
So yes, after seeing that I agree it shuld not be legal.

©2004 Dimytes


Everybody should know the trick
Try it in a game where everyone use tricks its fun
I accept that it might be called a cheat - it is in the game - i wont use it in "apolyton" games

Grandpa Troll is offline Grandpa Troll

Immortal
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Jul 2000
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  Old Post 11-01-2005 04:56
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quote:
Originally posted by Dimytes


Do you mean rushbuying 1 production type and then swith to another more expensive?

There are 3 production types, Buildnings(Cheap), Units(expensive) and Wonders(VERY expensive).

Imo rusbuying a colluseum and then switch to a wonder is a cheat since the cost per production is much higher for wonders.
Switching from one building to another for example from temple to a Factory after rusbuying the temple is no cheat. The ammount of production you gain per gold invested is the same as if you rushbuy something completley. I see this as an tactical option.

©2004 Dimytes


But we all agreed years ago here that if you rush buy-switch then its a cheat

(granary settler) amongst others

heck..ramping is a no-no from what i understood

Mathemagician is offline Mathemagician
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Sep 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 11-01-2005 14:48
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quote:
Originally posted by filix
Everybody should know the trick
Try it in a game where everyone use tricks its fun
I accept that it might be called a cheat - it is in the game - i wont use it in "apolyton" games


does that mean you used it in our inofficial fun game ?

filix is offline filix
Warlord

Apr 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 11-01-2005 17:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Mathemagician


does that mean you used it in our inofficial fun game ?


Yes when i play with the "not at apolyton forum" players
Like Paul, Attila, Dragon, Grafxfx, Yoda(if i ever get a win 95 partition), ...
Some might know them, the onliners
We talk about rules before we start the game.

TheBirdMan is offline TheBirdMan
Emperor
A real Master of CTP-PBEM - together with all the others.....
Sep 1999
time: 05:32
  Old Post 11-01-2005 17:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Dimytes
Wow, I had no clue about that. Just made a study on it and can confirm that when a unit is near end of production the cost to rushbuy is about 2.3 times lower than when you start a new production. I have only made a test on settler.
So yes, after seeing that I agree it shuld not be legal.

©2004 Dimytes


Did you use it in our SL-game(s)?

Mathemagician is offline Mathemagician
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Sep 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 11-01-2005 18:54
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quote:
Originally posted by filix
Yes when i play with the "not at apolyton forum" players
Like Paul, Attila, Dragon, Grafxfx, Yoda(if i ever get a win 95 partition), ...
Some might know them, the onliners
We talk about rules before we start the game.


hmm, i shall believe you that you havent been aware that i considered it a cheat and did not use it.
however, that cries for a revenge. some day.

filix is offline filix
Warlord

Apr 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 12-01-2005 00:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Mathemagician


hmm, i shall believe you that you havent been aware that i considered it a cheat and did not use it.
however, that cries for a revenge. some day.


I never played SL (Super-League)and im not Paul if anyone thought that. I played in GL-League some years ago. I played with Paul in the team "once where warriors", A girl played there too her name was Erica.
Math I hope you have some time very soon to play aother game with me. You can check every of my turns if you want.

I accept the rules which are made before the game
And i dont know how to use a hex editor.

I played a lot of online games and i dont like the idea that it is possible in Email games to play a turn several times. Who would like to start a game with me? I write too much and I dont play enough.

Last edited by filix on 12-01-2005 at 03:25

Grandpa Troll is offline Grandpa Troll

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Jul 2000
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  Old Post 12-01-2005 00:53
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Filix

I am an easy target and would love to play a pbem game with you

I am honest I just aint very good..but you know this

You are very good player

I will look at the Kaali server tonight

Gramps

P S Good to see you around my friend

Gramps

filix is offline filix
Warlord

Apr 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 12-01-2005 03:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Grandpa Troll
Filix

I am an easy target and would love to play a pbem game with you

I am honest I just aint very good..but you know this

You are very good player

I will look at the Kaali server tonight

Gramps

P S Good to see you around my friend

Gramps


I wrote this post too late I have to go to bed
Ill open a thread and we can talk about the settings for our alien acheolgie game

Grandpa Troll is offline Grandpa Troll

Immortal
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Jul 2000
time: 00:32
  Old Post 12-01-2005 03:28
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quote:
Originally posted by filix


I wrote this post too late I have to go to bed
Ill open a thread and we can talk about the settings for our alien acheolgie game


I would love to Filix

start a thread and you and I can chat about it

Gramps

Dimytes is offline Dimytes
Prince
Bjärnum, Sweden
Sep 2003
time: 06:32
  Old Post 12-01-2005 03:38
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quote:
Originally posted by TheBirdMan


Did you use it in our SL-game(s)?


I have used it but not as ramping. I know that I in some cases have for example rush bought a theather that usually takes one turn less than granary to produce and then switch to granary and let the city production take care of the last turn. I think this is the only case when I have switched after a rush buy.

I thought that the cost was linear.

©2004 Dimytes

Mathemagician is offline Mathemagician
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Sep 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 12-01-2005 03:48
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in the case you are describing Dimytes, it actually doesnt matter if the cost is linear. i still dont know if what you did is considered to be legal or not by the community. if someone could please say something about it.

filix is offline filix
Warlord

Apr 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 12-01-2005 03:52
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quote:
Originally posted by Mathemagician
in the case you are describing Dimytes, it actually doesnt matter if the cost is linear. i still dont know if what you did is considered to be legal or not by the community. if someone could please say something about it.


No thats not a cheat
Blackice told me its a cheat if someone switch from building to unit or from building to wonder
That is evil

Mathemagician is offline Mathemagician
King
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Sep 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 12-01-2005 03:58
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i wanted to know if it is legal in "Apolyton" games, you know that, filix ?

filix is offline filix
Warlord

Apr 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 12-01-2005 04:00
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quote:
Originally posted by Mathemagician
i wanted to know if it is legal in "Apolyton" games, you know that, filix ?


I think its legal but i never did that

Grandpa Troll is offline Grandpa Troll

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Jul 2000
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  Old Post 12-01-2005 04:10
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quote:
Originally posted by filix


No thats not a cheat
Blackice told me its a cheat if someone switch from building to unit or from building to wonder
That is evil


man if Blackice was here we would have a great Paul-SOL-discussion

Attachment: vulcan canon.gif
This has been downloaded 25 time(s).

filix is offline filix
Warlord

Apr 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 12-01-2005 04:12
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quote:
Originally posted by Grandpa Troll


man if Blackice was here we would have a great Paul-SOL-discussion


I know I love that
Im still surching for Petes new emailadress, anyone know it? I want to contiune our game

Last edited by filix on 12-01-2005 at 04:20

filix is offline filix
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Apr 2002
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  Old Post 12-01-2005 04:18
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doubblepost

Grandpa Troll is offline Grandpa Troll

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Jul 2000
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  Old Post 12-01-2005 04:31
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quote:
Originally posted by filix


I know I love that
Im still surching for Petes new emailadress, anyone know it? I want to contiune our game


filix

havent heard from me buddy in month

hopes hes ok

ctp is super but i mean in real life i hope nuthin happened

filix is offline filix
Warlord

Apr 2002
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  Old Post 12-01-2005 04:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Grandpa Troll


filix

havent heard from me buddy in month

hopes hes ok

ctp is super but i mean in real life i hope nuthin happened


His emailadress doesnt exist anymore and he isnt registered at apolyton I think
Im sure he started a new live

Last edited by filix on 12-01-2005 at 05:24

Grandpa Troll is offline Grandpa Troll

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  Old Post 12-01-2005 05:56
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yes

I would really like one day for him to say hello


like my old buddy Faded Glory

I just would like to know..not that I knew either in a real personal way..just the commaraderie we established and enjoyed through many a battle of wit and wisdom

Gramps

checkMate is offline checkMate
King
Mississippi
Sep 2002
time: 23:32
  Old Post 12-01-2005 07:23
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quote:
Originally posted by Dimytes


Do you mean rushbuying 1 production type and then swith to another more expensive?

There are 3 production types, Buildnings(Cheap), Units(expensive) and Wonders(VERY expensive).

Imo rusbuying a colluseum and then switch to a wonder is a cheat since the cost per production is much higher for wonders.
Switching from one building to another for example from temple to a Factory after rusbuying the temple is no cheat. The ammount of production you gain per gold invested is the same as if you rushbuy something completley. I see this as an tactical option.

©2004 Dimytes


Right, only moving to the more expensive is a cheat.

dancemasseuse is offline dancemasseuse
Prince
Houston
Jul 2002
time: 23:32
  Old Post 12-01-2005 08:15
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wow I have only done that a few times, but before I did I did ask. I think checkmate is who I asked as well as someone else I was playing at the time. I did notice during one game that I bought a building and switched back to a unit and saw the difference and never did that again, it was when the light went off in my head and I finally really understood what was said. I figured that is what they meant by cheating, because I did not understand it at that point. the only other times I did it in a game was I was so close to building marines that each needed 2 turns to complete, but the production was about 100 shy of completing it in 1 turn, so each second turn I only needed and additional 100 to 400 gold to have finished building it in 1 turn. so I consulted whoever I was playing and asked about it and was told the above. as long as I was buying the same thing, unit/unit, building/building, wonder/wonder, then it was proportional and legal. I have only done it a very few times, but I am sure it is with the people I talked to, so no one else has too worry if I did it in our game, smile. I did it so few times that I am sure where I did it. and I have NEVER done it in a SL2 game. what I was doing was buying a lawyer for about 1800 gold and then the marine still needed about 6000 gold to rush buy, but now it could be gotten in one turn because of how high the production was. And at that price for the money you can't always do it too often. anyway if that is a cheat then please let me know. I feel a sense of honor and want to play it straight up.

I have restarted when the AI unit was not in the square I attacked, but even if it was not in my favor did the same moves again.

I thought I saw some where in a forum that the farm under the city was not a cheat. I see it all the time In games I have played. I haven't done it, because I am kinda greedy and prefer to set on a good or hill with the extra gold involved. I never cared if someone did it so I never thought about it. Also there is a concept like this too. Often in old civilizations they did in fact build around fertile ground that was farmed first, so with the additional food would have grown faster. now I am not saying all cities did that, but many cities in south/central america, before the spanish conquest, did have orchards and very large gardens in side the walls. so why wouldn't the ability to do that in the game be legal and semi-realistic

also, smile, yes I get longwinded sometimes too, sorry guys.
what about this. I call it my "fleeing peasants" method of looking for enemy submarines. I go to each city and then the worker screen and pick up a worker and start trying to place him in each square. if he won't work in the square then a submarine is there and I attack it. I call it "fleeing peasants" to symbolize the old days when the lord of his lands did not always know brigands or an army was approaching until the peasants started fleeing and he sent troops to investigate.

Any comments???? ken/dancemasseuse

Mathemagician is offline Mathemagician
King
Darmstadt, Hessen, Germany, Europe, Earth, Solar System, Alpha-Quadrant, Milky Way
Sep 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 12-01-2005 15:50
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quote:
Originally posted by checkMate
Right, only moving to the more expensive is a cheat.


you can still ramp within the same type. this should be a cheat regardless.

Mathemagician is offline Mathemagician
King
Darmstadt, Hessen, Germany, Europe, Earth, Solar System, Alpha-Quadrant, Milky Way
Sep 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 12-01-2005 19:06
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Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

if you have a government type with a high rush buy factor, e.g. communism, and have a lot of money that you want to spend on cheap rush buying, you can do the following:
- switch government to another government, resulting in anarchy
- rush buy the items for the cheap anarchy rush buy factor
- switch government back to your original government

this should rather go into the strategy thread. usually it will take the regular 1-4 turns until the anarchy is gone, so no reason to call it a cheat. sometimes, however, mostly in the 2 newest ages, i have experienced that the original government will return right in the same turn.

does anyone have an explanation for this effect ? should the whole thing be called a cheat simply because of the possibility of restoring the government right away ?

Cuaich is offline Cuaich
Prince
Ontario, Canada
Mar 2001
time: 00:32
  Old Post 12-01-2005 22:22 Visit Cuaich's homepage!
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Interesting thread...I have nothing to add, other than to say "Thanks for killing a few boring moments at the office".

I'm learning a lot, but it is a hollow education as these "ideas" aren't to be used in games anyways!



Keep the entertainment value coming!

Cheers
Cuaich

Grandpa Troll is offline Grandpa Troll

Immortal
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Jul 2000
time: 00:32
  Old Post 13-01-2005 21:37
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quote:
Originally posted by Cuaich
Interesting thread...I have nothing to add, other than to say "Thanks for killing a few boring moments at the office".

I'm learning a lot, but it is a hollow education as these "ideas" aren't to be used in games anyways!



Keep the entertainment value coming!

Cheers
Cuaich


You are right they are not to be used and well..somefolks speed even though a posted speed limit is marked and enforced

Gramps

 
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