03-02-2005 07:37									#1
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A few weekss ago I was reading a few news articles online when I came across an article about the Iraqi insurgency.

quote: It's axiomatic among military thinkers that insurgencies are especially hard to defeat because the insurgents' goal isn't to win in a conventional sense but merely to survive until the will of the occupying power is sapped.

source:
http://www.realcities.com/mld/krwashington/10703534.htm

That's when this idea hit me. I've always wanted to see full scale guerilla uprisings and such in Civ. Partisans threatening my supply lines, insurgents sniping at my units, basically a full scale back and forth guerilla war. That would be nice, but Civ doesn't completely need it. What we really need is a fix for Oscilliating wars, and the conquerers who benefit from them. The fix comes directly from the quote.

The fix to Oscillating war is occupied cities still triggers War Weariness. However, nearly all governments need to have war weariness. War weariness also needs a few tweaks. First off in stead of low and high, ww needs a few more categories than it currently has, with a 1-5 or 1-10 step slider bar working fine. Secondly resistors should stay around far longer than they do now, and as long as a city has resistors during a time of peace then it's considered occupied (it should go without saying that if you capture a city from another civ and a state of war still exists the city is always considered occupied). With Occupied cities Civ has a chance to bring back reputation. A peaceful civ with lots of culture and lots of happy faces should have an easier time assimilating occupied cities than a warmongering civ, that rules with an iron fist, has nuked all of its neighbors, and hasn't signed a treaty it hasn't broken.

So what does everyone think of my idea that occupied cities should cause war weariness even when a civ is at peace? Of course guerilla warfare could easily fit into this equation as well, but this is just a fairly simple rule change that could have big ramifications. It could slow down world conquests, and it could make the various Oscillating war strategies less overpowering.

	04-02-2005 23:02									#2
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I think it looks great

It may be simply the generalization of something already present in Civ3, thus no new elements added for the player to manage, but it solves some issues. Also, it would bring certain aspect further into the game: public opinion (with more, or less impact), guerilla warfare (which was even used by "barbarians" against Romans), a true and important aspect of occupying cities, etc.

What would it ask from the players / developers?
What would it bring?

These two questions form what the idea must answer.

	16-03-2005 02:17									#3
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Insurgencies should also be able to cut off supplies, as Iraqi insurgents are doing when they blow up pipelines.

	16-03-2005 06:28									#4
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Insurgencies, terrorism, and other types of "unconventional warfare" is a must, especially because we all know, since 9/11, the Madrid train bombings, and the Iraqi insurgency, how effective it can be.

Insurgencies would be a great way to cure a thing in Civ3 I hate, by the time I reach the late Industrial Age I am almost always #1 because of conquest, even if I am playing a relatively peaceful stratagy simply because it is so tempting to go on a rampage with my Cavalry when the only resistance are Pikemen and Musketmen. The Modern Age becomes too damned easy. Insurgenicies would slow down conquest so it remains a competitive game through the Modern Age.

	16-03-2005 10:15									#5
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I agree. Great idea.

	16-03-2005 15:57									#6
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Am I the only one thinking that each time we have a top100 "firaxianally-implementable" great idea it will only end up going down to page 2... 3... 4... ?

Anyway, in the meantime there's Civ wiki.

	16-03-2005 16:26									#7
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You could have it implemented like in MOO2 oder 3,
i.e. after initial conquest the population is either subdued (giving only half of the production and having a large chance to rebellious) or "just" unhappy,
with the effect becoming lower and lower with each turn, until, after a couple of turns, the city is fully integrated into your society.

As for guerilla units:
Why not have such units invisible?
They would be an invisible military unit (at the control of the computer) being able to pillage terrain improvements, destroy city improvements and bombard military units without becoming visible (you could only see their effects).
The only way to see the unit would be, if a military unit tries to move to a place occupied by such guerilla unit (of course, if they move away the next turn they become invisible again, but hopefully until then the military has finished them )
But you shouldn´t have too much of them operating at the same time, maybe 3-4 units, as too much could unbalance the game.
(And it would also a good idea for a spy-mission: Support the guerillas [like the USA have done for example to the afghan mudjaheddin when the sowjets still ruled the country])