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Earl Grey is offline Earl Grey
Settler
NA
Jul 2001
time: 06:26
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Tech goals as the game progresses Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

(This topic is aimed at single player transcend level SMAC.)

What research goals do you consider important at different stages of the game?

I gather that the following is quite common:
Industrial Automation followed by Fusion Power and then Advanced Ecological Engineering, but what is next on the list?
Perhaps the three above aren't even on your list of prioritized research goals?

Stormwatcher is offline Stormwatcher
Settler

Dec 2004
time: 05:26
  Old Post 05-02-2005 15:53
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IMHO I prefer the orbital installations like Hydroponic lab and Orbital energy transmitter
to the superformer, so I choose Adv Space might (gives me PBs on the way!)

May give a little less resources than terraforming into infinity, but my resources are out of harm's way instead of being bombed by attackers. But I would like to hear what other players think about that.

It's mandatory of course to make sure you're the only faction with orbital installations then. Should be possible in most SP games, if Yang is not too fast :-)

I agree with the other two research goals nevertheless.

Senethro is offline Senethro
Prince

Jul 2004
time: 05:26
  Old Post 05-02-2005 17:05
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Mind machine interface anyone?

I often find myself going for Adaptive Economics so I claim the PEG soon after IA and the initial SP rush.

Dis is offline Dis
Emperor
Las Vegas, Nevada
Feb 2000
time: 21:26
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I don't know all the tech names, so bare with me.

Secrets of the human brain (if I play a faction that has any chance of getting it), Centauri Ecology, Industrial Automation, The tech that gives Virtual World, Doctrine: Air Power, I then try to clean up any of those techs that allow 3+ resources per square if I don't have them all by this point (I usually do). Then I go for Cloning Vats to keep it out of the hands of the AI. Then I go for flachette defense systems, then orbital defense pods (the ai's often build nukes, I need protection), and then I got for telepathic matrix so I can really exploit the cloning vats.

Earl Grey is offline Earl Grey
Settler
NA
Jul 2001
time: 06:26
  Old Post 06-02-2005 00:55 Visit Earl Grey's homepage!
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If I go for Secrets of the Human Brain in order to get the free tech it typically delays Industrial Automation by 5-10 years. IMHO it's not worth the delay.

The Cloning Vats take precedence over Fusion Power and Super Former?

Dis is offline Dis
Emperor
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Feb 2000
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I have seen the AI attempt to build them, I just can't let them have it.

Chaos Theory is offline Chaos Theory

King
Missouri / Misery; CC
Oct 2002
time: 04:26
  Old Post 06-02-2005 04:26 Visit Chaos Theory<br><a href=/members><img src=/forums/images/supporter-icon.gif border=0></a><BR>'s homepage!
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The Cloning Vats definitely trump super formers. Relative to Fusion Power, it would depend on what faction I'm playing (that is, can they pop boom normally), how much would I gain from fusion, am I at war, might I still be able to get the Cloning Vats if I go for Fusion first, etc.

Maniac is offline Maniac
Emperor
Gent, Belgium
Jul 1999
time: 06:26
  Old Post 06-02-2005 06:18
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AFAIK I think CentEcol - IndAut - Environmental Economics is the most common tech path for a classic builder game.
Though for some factions something entirely different can be best.
Eg for the Spartans (which have recently become my most favourite faction ), I'd go for CentEcol - DocFlex - PlaNets, and then depending on whether I'm interested in a military adventure either Nonlinear Mathematics or Intellectual Integrity.

Clear Skies is offline Clear Skies
Prince
looking for a saviour in these dirty streets
Jul 2000
time: 05:26
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I have a dreadful tendency to shoot straight for Centauri Empathy (after a shot at SotHB, obviously), then backtrack for Adaptive Ec, and then shoot for Pre-Sent and Fusion. After that my choices often depend on what I can trade, barter, bully or steal from the other factions - and on what I can't, as well (e.g. during a secret project race).

Sikander is offline Sikander
King
Boulder, Colorado, United Snakes of America
Jan 2000
time: 22:26
  Old Post 07-02-2005 16:37
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Centauri Ecology

Industrial Automation

Environmental Econ

Hybrid Forests (can't remember the name)

Air Power - Spaceflight

Fusion

baygator IV is offline baygator IV
Settler
sheffield
Feb 2005
time: 05:26
  Old Post 17-02-2005 08:24
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IMHO, the 3+ resource techs (gene splicling, environ. economics & eco. engineering) are very handy as is planetary economics (the Hybrid Forest one).

Fusion power too, but this one is almost a given.

Flubber is offline Flubber
Emperor
With a view of the Rockies
Aug 2000
time: 22:26
  Old Post 17-02-2005 10:50
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sikander's list although in certain circumstances I go to nonlinear maths or doc flex .

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Prince
of the town of ZZT
Dec 2003
time: 15:26
  Old Post 17-02-2005 13:53
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I like:

Ind Eco (FM Switch)
Biogenetics
Restriction lifting beeline.

+ Morganite ICS.

I'm a bad player though

Flubber is offline Flubber
Emperor
With a view of the Rockies
Aug 2000
time: 22:26
  Old Post 17-02-2005 21:02
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quote:
Originally posted by Clear Skies
I have a dreadful tendency to shoot straight for Centauri Empathy (after a shot at SotHB, obviously), then backtrack for Adaptive Ec, and then shoot for Pre-Sent and Fusion. After that my choices often depend on what I can trade, barter, bully or steal from the other factions - and on what I can't, as well (e.g. during a secret project race).



While I can see the value of centauri emp. - I have never understood people's desire to get SOTHB. yes being first there gets you an additional tech but for me its at the cost of going up a branch of the tree I don't want in the early game

** Note I have also been known to be peeved if a pod pop gives me a tech. I hate gaining ANY off-beeline tech as it slows subsequent research VERY MUCH. Getting an unwanted tech can slow ind auto by 10 years!!!! Plus the AI tends to research all across the tech tree so it is an easy matter to steal or trade for the etchs I value less

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Prince
of the town of ZZT
Dec 2003
time: 15:26
  Old Post 18-02-2005 02:03
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If early game mindworms were made really nasty, I could see the point of a SotHB beeline, but you get 2 techs for 1, then your tech cost goes up, like Flubber said. The free tech isn't even guaranteed.

Clear Skies is offline Clear Skies
Prince
looking for a saviour in these dirty streets
Jul 2000
time: 05:26
  Old Post 18-02-2005 03:19 Visit Clear Skies's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by Flubber
While I can see the value of centauri emp. - I have never understood people's desire to get SOTHB. yes being first there gets you an additional tech but for me its at the cost of going up a branch of the tree I don't want in the early game


Well, Biogenetics for the HGP, which is a damn good project. I admit Social Psych's a bit of a placeholder, but reccy commons are going to be pretty essential to get any base past size 2. And SotHB gives your sentinels free trance, which is always nice, especially with abundant native life. I admit it's not the best beeline, but I'm not as fixated with IndAuto as most - I tend to lay off crawlering in order to get a more balanced game.

Asmodean is offline Asmodean
King
Aarhus, Denmark
Aug 1999
time: 06:26
  Old Post 20-02-2005 22:15 Visit Asmodean's homepage!
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It really depends on circumstances. If I play as Zak, I never bother about SotHB, since that free tech is not worth it. If I play as Miriam or any other slow tech faction, I will dart for the SotHB, and usually be denied it, unless I have chosen the other facs wisely.

Asmodean

Dis is offline Dis
Emperor
Las Vegas, Nevada
Feb 2000
time: 21:26
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one thing I will not do is skip centuari:ecology again. You guys alway talk about getting industrial automation without delay. But I quickly reazlized how useless crawlers are when you have no terraformers.

CEO Aaron is offline CEO Aaron
Prince
Everything has its price. Even you.
Aug 2002
time: 05:26
  Old Post 21-02-2005 23:43
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My early tech goals vary widely by faction, since each faction has its own particular strengths and weaknesses that I wish to exploit. For police-happy factions like Sparta and Yang, I want Doctrine: Loyalty. For builder factions, I want Free Market and Wealth. For the green factions, Centauri Empathy. And all my factions want Centauri Ecology, Biogenics and Industrial Automation fairly early.

After my early tech goals are established, I usually stop thinking about tech for a while to focus on snapping up early SP's, and for a while, my tech goals are driven solely by the desire to build as many of these as I can. Once all the early SP's are accounted for, it's time to start planning for the midgame. At this point, I'll be either teching toward Environmental Economics, for tree farms and a Pop-boom. Usually I can grab Clean Reactors concurrently, and switch all my garrisons and formers to clean power. Once my Pop boom is complete, I'll go toward fusion power and retroviral engineering, for a revolution in energy and mineral production.

At this point, I aim my tech sights on Advanced Spaceflight. With resource satellites, I can send my production through the stratosphere, and seed bases virtually everywhere.

You'll note at no point do I really prioritize weapon techs. This is really because it's far too easy to swipe an encroaching unit and reverse engineer their weapons, or gain parity in weapon technology through judicious use of probe teams, and once I have technological parity, my superior production should overwhelm all proffered resistance.

Clear Skies is offline Clear Skies
Prince
looking for a saviour in these dirty streets
Jul 2000
time: 05:26
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quote:
Originally posted by CEO Aaron
For police-happy factions like Sparta and Yang, I want Doctrine: Loyalty.


...Yang comes with Loyalty.

*runs*

And yes, I'll shoot for Environmental Ec as early as possible - especially if I've managed to grab the Jungle by that point. Jungle + forests + tree farms = heaven'

CEO Aaron is offline CEO Aaron
Prince
Everything has its price. Even you.
Aug 2002
time: 05:26
  Old Post 22-02-2005 01:20
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Right, forgot that. I don't play Yang that often, his 'set it and forget it' SE choices are kind of boring to me. Here's one question I do have for Yang disciples: Do you often beeline for High Energy Chemistry? It seems to me that Yang can grab Applied Physics, High Energy Chemistry, then bypass impact in complete safety, going for Synthetic Fossil Feuls and Doctrine: Air Power.

Chaos Theory is offline Chaos Theory

King
Missouri / Misery; CC
Oct 2002
time: 04:26
  Old Post 22-02-2005 01:26 Visit Chaos Theory<br><a href=/members><img src=/forums/images/supporter-icon.gif border=0></a><BR>'s homepage!
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As Yang, I favor rushing for Industrial Automation, primarily for the SE settings. Police + Planned + Wealth yields the following appealing SE category effects:

+3 growth
+2 police
+2 support
+3 industry
-1 econ (almost the same as 0 econ)
-2 morale
0 planet
0 effic
0 probe
0 research

Once here, research proceeds as quickly as for the Gaians, or any other faction that can't reach +2 econ. Furthermore, probes and crawlers are available to close the gap.

sentry33 is offline sentry33
Warlord
Warsaw, Poland
Jun 2004
time: 06:26
  Old Post 22-02-2005 01:31
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Usual routes:

for PK, Uni, Gaians:
1. Centauri Ecology
2. Industrial Automaton
3. Secrets of the Human brain + free Centauri Empathy if I can snatch Empath Guild due to it
4. Env Economics - throught trade or research
5. Doc Air
6. MMI
7. Fusion Power
8. Orbital Spaceflight

for Hive:
1. Centauri Ecology
2. Planetary Networks
3. Industrial Automaton or Doctrine Flexibility (and infiltrate/steal/trade for IA)
4. Intellectual Integrity
5. Ecological Engineering/Doc Air/MMI - order depends on situation
6. Fusion Power
7. Orbital Spaceflight

not much of experience with rest of bunch

Last edited by sentry33 on 22-02-2005 at 01:39

Sikander is offline Sikander
King
Boulder, Colorado, United Snakes of America
Jan 2000
time: 22:26
  Old Post 22-02-2005 14:35
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quote:
Originally posted by Chaos Theory
As Yang, I favor rushing for Industrial Automation, primarily for the SE settings. Police + Planned + Wealth yields the following appealing SE category effects:

+3 growth
+2 police
+2 support
+3 industry
-1 econ (almost the same as 0 econ)
-2 morale
0 planet
0 effic
0 probe
0 research

Once here, research proceeds as quickly as for the Gaians, or any other faction that can't reach +2 econ. Furthermore, probes and crawlers are available to close the gap.


Yang also really benefits from the use of specialists, which you can spam like crazy once you have crawlers hauling nutrients. You can try to GA pop boom (can be difficult without Hybrid Forests or the HGP), or pod boom by simply using half of your bases to build colony pods and donating the proceeds to the other half of your bases. Once your donor bases get down to 1-2 population you can build a colony pod about every third turn in them (assuming you have crawled minerals to about 16 or so). Turn all of those specialists into librarians, and you'll have a respectable tech rate in short order.

Once your recipient bases are up to snuff you can begin to build up your donor bases by again using half to build up the other half.

If you use the stockpile energy bug to your advantage, Yang will always have tons of cash available, as he cranks out crawlers like nobodies business.

molly bloom is offline molly bloom
Prince
Lundenwic
Oct 2001
time: 15:26
  Old Post 22-02-2005 18:39
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quote:
Originally posted by CEO Aaron
Right, forgot that. I don't play Yang that often, his 'set it and forget it' SE choices are kind of boring to me. Here's one question I do have for Yang disciples: Do you often beeline for High Energy Chemistry? It seems to me that Yang can grab Applied Physics, High Energy Chemistry, then bypass impact in complete safety, going for Synthetic Fossil Feuls and Doctrine: Air Power.



The deep deep joy one has on discovering that Yang is based in the Monsoon Jungle with several large mineral deposits and has Doctrine: Air Power before everyone else.


And he's only one scrawny neighbour away, and mad as hell.

Ogie Oglethorpe is offline Ogie Oglethorpe
King
Marietta, GA
Dec 1999
time: 05:26
  Old Post 23-02-2005 02:38
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beelines typically

1)Centauri Ecology
2) IA
3) Env Econ
4) MMI

d=me is offline d=me
Warlord

Nov 2003
time: 05:26
  Old Post 23-02-2005 03:17
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I always try to the the hard to get discover techs like pre sentient alogrithms. and build the hunter seeker thing.

Dis is offline Dis
Emperor
Las Vegas, Nevada
Feb 2000
time: 21:26
  Old Post 23-02-2005 03:21 Visit Dis's homepage!
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my last game I built the hunter seeker. I have never seen the AI build so many probes. If you ask me the AI builds too many probes.

They had so many, they couldn't do anything. So they would repeatedly infiltrate my datalinks, even though they already had infiltration.

Flubber is offline Flubber
Emperor
With a view of the Rockies
Aug 2000
time: 22:26
  Old Post 23-02-2005 04:21
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quote:
Originally posted by Dissident
my last game I built the hunter seeker. I have never seen the AI build so many probes. If you ask me the AI builds too many probes.

They had so many, they couldn't do anything. So they would repeatedly infiltrate my datalinks, even though they already had infiltration.



I think a given AI faction will just get stuck on somethink it wants to build a lot of-- My last game, I was the Morganites and my Believer enemies were building dozens of (6)-1-1 Missile artillery. Not that anything they built would make a difference but what exactly is the use of dozens and dozens of slow artillery pieces against an enemy that is choppering you to death

I actually got very bored with the game since NONE of the AI even got fusion before I transcended (probably because the Believers were the big power) with Zak taken out and Lal decimated

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