18-12-2000 08:03									#1
	City defence- what do you do? Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Resources in Civ are limited, which means that one is limited in how much resources to spend on city defence. Spend too much, and you may loose out to others who are spending their resources on expansion. Spend too little, and if you get attacked, you could be screwed. Also in considering early city defense one must consider resources spent on technology principally or exclusively for defense.

I almost always play either 1 move double prod or 1x 1x, so it's along these lines I'm talking. I also generally play the no city bribe game.

Various philosoplies:

1. Screw denfence, except for a minimum to defend against Barbs. Expand fast enough, and who cares if you loose a couple cities in the process. It's better to have 25 cities and loose 2 or 3 before you can get your defenses up, than to have 10 very well defended cities of similar quality.

2.A defensive unit or two per city. You need warriors for martial law any way, so they might just as well be vet pikemen.

3. An good defensive units in each city and at least one good attacking unit able to get to the city in time.

4. Vet catapult, vet legion, and vet pikeman in each important city, prepared for a variety of possible attacks.

5. Build only on decent defensive terrain.

6. Meet enemy forces before they get to your land.

7. A small ammount of offensive firepower in enemy territory is worth more than excellent defence in all your cities, because it gets your opponent thinking defence instead of offence.

I personally use different strategies depending on the situation. #4 is a bit of overkill perhaps, because that's a lot of shields to use in all your important cities, and you have to take time to get a lot of techs early on that may not be along the tech path you want. My prefered method is #6. I do this by owning the sea. Then I just need to worry about a hopefully narrow land border.

The important thing to remember is that all resources you spend in defending a city that is never attacked, unless it serves a deterrent value, is basically wasted. So if you are going to spend a lot of resources on defence, by all means, try to provoke someone into attacking your cities so he can waste resources in lost units.

How do y'all balance the equasion of resources spent on defence vs. need? and how do you make the most of your defensive resources?

	18-12-2000 09:20									#2
	Increase Your PM Length

Well here's what you wanna do or atleast i find this to work really good.
Try to have your capital city w/o access to water ( so no landings can attack you) First build your cities on the coast around your empiore then build inward.
Expansion:
1. Build your city
2. Build defender of city
3. Build settler for expansion
4. Send settler out to build another city
5. Build necessary buildings(temple, library, marketplace)
6. Another defender
7. Settler(either for expansion or improvement)
I find temple, library, and m.place are the important buildings at first. No need to build any more when your expanding your empire.

My 2cents

	18-12-2000 10:03									#3
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at first, send horses out so that it would be impossible for you not to see an enemy slip by. When your horses find so much land that you can't have enough horses to cover all the land in all directions, then build city defense, warriors in inner cities, phalanx in the outer cities..

If the front is distinguished enough, move the phalanx to the outermore cities as you build outward so you won't have to build new phalanx.

	18-12-2000 19:09									#4
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More theories:

1. Great Wall (obviously) and Lighthouse are two of the best wonders for protecting your cities. Lighthouse means you don't have to worry so much about protecting your coastline, because you can win the battle at sea.

2. Build cities on good defensive terrain. I would expect to lose one vet crusader attacking a vet pikeman fortified on open terrain; the losses would be two or three crusaders against a vet pikeman fortified on a hill.

3. Multiple defenders. If you have three vet pikemen in a city on a hill, the bad guy will need more than nine vet crusaders to take the city. He won't actually start killing your defenders until he has lost at least six attackers.

	20-12-2000 10:32									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Obviously there is a lot to be said defensively about not building your capital or any other important city too close to the coast. On the other hand, especially in double production, I usually feel no need to attack someone early on who doesn't build by the sea, unless he has a heck of a lot of gold. With the trade he's missing out on, I'll just wait till I have Riflemen and cannons and he hasn't even got musketeers yet. Of course in single production sea squares aren't so important early on because sea squares aren't so disproportionately superior to roads in single production. But in double production I prefer to take my chances with an attack from the sea.

	20-12-2000 17:46									#6
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<center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
<img src=/forums/"/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font><font size=1>Originally posted by SunTzu on 12-17-2000 11:20 PM</font>

Expansion:
1. Build your city
2. Build defender of city
3. Build settler for expansion
4. Send settler out to build another city
5. Build necessary buildings(temple, library, marketplace)
6. Another defender
7. Settler(either for expansion or improvement)
I find temple, library, and m.place are the important buildings at first. No need to build any more when your expanding your empire.

My 2cents
<img src=/forums/"/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

That's usually my strategy too.
Once I've got a few cities established, I'll switch steps 5 & 6 round, and get my defense in there quickly.
After the 2nd settler, I'll build city walls, unless there is something more important needing done.

	21-12-2000 16:15									#7
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Somebody here has posted something about the
lighthouse .
I give you the following advice :
never build it , there are far better wonders like
hanging gardens for example .

	22-12-2000 07:05									#8
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I think that the secret of the game is to build as many settlers as you can until you see some enemy units. At least, that is the best I can manage. I know there are some really detailed strategies (ICS, 5-size cities, 1 major city strategy, etc), but in general terms, I'm going to try and expand in cities and tech until someones stops me.

I have found that an early emphasis on food and trade seems bad at first, but pays off later. It turns out (in my opinion) that growing your population puts you behind in the early part, but gives you a major leap when you catch up in tech (as you will).

Getting to Monarchy ASAP works well, and there is a clear path to that. And I think food/trade is the best *general* rule for that.

------------------
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	22-12-2000 07:08									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

<center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
<img src=/forums/"/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font><font size=1>Originally posted by Martin Schmidt on 12-21-2000 06:15 AM</font>

Somebody here has posted something about the
lighthouse .
I give you the following advice :
never build it , there are far better wonders like
hanging gardens for example .
<img src=/forums/"/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

I used to agree with that. But, having experienced the disadvantage of not reaching new land with triremes limited to coastal movement, I have changed my mind. And having vet Triremes, Frigates, and Ironclads are very valuable!

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1st Elder of the O.W.L. Alliance...

	22-12-2000 09:00									#10
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<center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
<img src=/forums/"/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font>
Resources in Civ are limited, which means that one is limited in how much resources to spend on city defence. Spend too much, and you may loose out to others who are spending their resources on expansion. Spend too little, and if you get attacked, you could be screwed. Also in considering early city defense one must consider resources spent on technology principally or exclusively for defense.

<img src=/forums/"/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>
don't build a single defensive unit till you meet someone, and then only in perimiter cities
<center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
<img src=/forums/"/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font>
I almost always play either 1 move double prod or 1x 1x, so it's along these lines I'm talking. I also generally play the no city bribe game.

Various philosoplies:

1. Screw denfence, except for a minimum to defend against Barbs. Expand fast enough, and who cares if you loose a couple cities in the process. It's better to have 25 cities and loose 2 or 3 before you can get your defenses up, than to have 10 very well defended cities of similar quality.

2.A defensive unit or two per city. You need warriors for martial law any way, so they might just as well be vet pikemen.

<img src=/forums/"/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>
Waste of time. Build temples instead. Build only when the city is in danger
<center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
<img src=/forums/"/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font>
3. An good defensive units in each city and at least one good attacking unit able to get to the city in time.

<img src=/forums/"/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>
If you build only when you see the enemy then you will have the latest units.
<center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
<img src=/forums/"/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font>
4. Vet catapult, vet legion, and vet pikeman in each important city, prepared for a variety of possible attacks.

5. Build only on decent defensive terrain.

<img src=/forums/"/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>
Stunts your growth HUGE. Only build on defensive terrain if your using it as a launch point to strike out at the enemy. Move settlers into cities when they are size 8 and turn the terrain to hills if you have problems.

<center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
<img src=/forums/"/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font>
6. Meet enemy forces before they get to your land.

<img src=/forums/"/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

less resource intensive if they die on your defences. Also means you don't have to incease luxery rates. Or spend money buying more offensive units.

	25-12-2000 02:23									#11
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No martial law? even early on at diety?

	25-12-2000 02:27									#12
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on diety a warrior in every city i guess.