11-03-2005 04:53									#61
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Last edited by DRoseDARs on 11-03-2005 at 05:00

	11-03-2005 05:00									#62
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http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...o_co/bankruptcy

Politics - AP
AP
Senate Passes New Bankruptcy Legislation

13 minutes ago

By MARCY GORDON, AP Business Writer

WASHINGTON - The Senate passed legislation Thursday that will make it harder for Americans to rid themselves of debt by filing for bankruptcy.

The House is expected to pass the measure next month, delivering to President Bush (news - web sites) a second victory this year on pro-business legislation he had sought.

The vote was 74-25 to approve the most thorough overhaul of bankruptcy laws in a quarter-century.

"The short answer is fairness," declared Sen. Orrin Hatch (news, bio, voting record), R-Utah. "Those who can pay their bills should pay their bills. That's the American way."

Congressional and industry backers of the legislation have been pushing for it for eight years but it repeatedly got stalled. This year, with Republican majorities increased in both the House and Senate in last November's elections, the bill's fortunes reversed.

Before the vote and in Senate deliberations over much of the last 10 days, majority Republicans knocked down Democratic attempts to ease the impact of the legislation on people facing huge debts they cannot pay down, including single parents, the unemployed and the ill.

The Senate instead handed Wall Street investment firms a bonus, defeating a Democratic amendment that would have restricted their ability to work for companies both before and after those companies file for bankruptcy.

Senators acted against the advice of Securities and Exchange Commission (news - web sites) Chairman William Donaldson, who said such a restriction was needed to build up investor confidence shaken by Enron, WorldCom and other corporate scandals.

For two straight days, Democratic opponents tried to soften the bill's impact on single parents and other groups, and to restrict credit industry practices that lawmakers said especially hurt the poor.

Critics said the bill would remove a safety net for those who have lost their jobs or face big medical bills.

"It will have a real impact on real people all over this country," said Sen. Russ Feingold (news, bio, voting record), D-Wis.

Supporters of the bill said bankruptcy often was the last refuge of gamblers, impulsive shoppers, divorced or separated fathers avoiding child support, and multimillionaires — often celebrities — who buy mansions in states with liberal homestead exemptions to shelter assets from creditors.

Somewhere between 3,675 and 210,000 people annually — from 3.5 percent to 20 percent of those who currently dissolve their debts in bankruptcy — would be disqualified from doing so under the legislation, according to American Bankruptcy Institute estimates. the institute is a group of bankruptcy judges, lawyers and other experts.

The legislation would set up an income-based test for measuring a debtor's ability to repay debts. It would require people in bankruptcy to pay for credit counseling and stiffen some legal requirements for debtors in the bankruptcy process.

The measure would ease some requirements for creditors and enable credit card issuers, retailers and other lenders to recover more of what is owed them.

Under the new income test, those with insufficient assets or income could still file a Chapter 7 bankruptcy, which if approved by a judge erases debts entirely after certain assets are forfeited. But those with income above the state's median income who can pay at least $6,000 over five years — $100 a month — would be forced into Chapter 13, where a judge would then order a repayment plan.

About 70 percent of the people who file for bankruptcy now do so under Chapter 7, while the other 30 percent or so fall under Chapter 13, according to the American Bankruptcy Institute.

Most of the Chapter 7 filers "don't have the income to fund a (repayment) plan that won't fail," said Samuel Gerdano, the group's executive director.

Under current law, a bankruptcy judge determines under which chapter of the bankruptcy code a person falls. Chapter 7 now allows people to escape paying any of their credit card and other debts. Filings under Chapter 13 force people to repay debts over time in accordance with a court-approved plan.

Banks, credit card issuers and retailers have lobbied for bankruptcy revisions that would force more people to repay at least part of their debt. Such a bill nearly passed in 2002. It failed when the Senate accepted, but House Republicans rejected, a Democratic amendment barring anti-abortion protesters from using bankruptcy to avoid paying court fines for blocking abortion clinics.

In Bush's first pro-business legislative victory this year, Congress last month sent him a bill placing most large multistate class action lawsuits under federal court jurisdiction, making it more difficult for plaintiffs to join together and win multimillion-dollar judgments in state courts.
___

On the Net:

Information on the bill, S. 256: http://thomas.loc.gov/

	11-03-2005 05:32									#63
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Roll call:

Alphabetical by Senator Name

Akaka (D-HI), Nay
Alexander (R-TN), Yea
Allard (R-CO), Yea
Allen (R-VA), Yea
Baucus (D-MT), Yea
Bayh (D-IN), Yea
Bennett (R-UT), Yea
Biden (D-DE), Yea
Bingaman (D-NM), Yea
Bond (R-MO), Yea
Boxer (D-CA), Nay
Brownback (R-KS), Yea
Bunning (R-KY), Yea
Burns (R-MT), Yea
Burr (R-NC), Yea
Byrd (D-WV), Yea
Cantwell (D-WA), Nay
Carper (D-DE), Yea
Chafee (R-RI), Yea
Chambliss (R-GA), Yea
Clinton (D-NY), Not Voting
Coburn (R-OK), Yea
Cochran (R-MS), Yea
Coleman (R-MN), Yea
Collins (R-ME), Yea
Conrad (D-ND), Yea
Cornyn (R-TX), Yea
Corzine (D-NJ), Nay
Craig (R-ID), Yea
Crapo (R-ID), Yea
Dayton (D-MN), Nay
DeMint (R-SC), Yea
DeWine (R-OH), Yea
Dodd (D-CT), Nay
Dole (R-NC), Yea
Domenici (R-NM), Yea
Dorgan (D-ND), Nay
Durbin (D-IL), Nay
Ensign (R-NV), Yea No suprise
Enzi (R-WY), Yea
Feingold (D-WI), Nay
Feinstein (D-CA), Nay
Frist (R-TN), Yea
Graham (R-SC), Yea
Grassley (R-IA), Yea
Gregg (R-NH), Yea
Hagel (R-NE), Yea
Harkin (D-IA), Nay
Hatch (R-UT), Yea
Hutchison (R-TX), Yea
Inhofe (R-OK), Yea
Inouye (D-HI), Yea
Isakson (R-GA), Yea
Jeffords (I-VT), Yea
Johnson (D-SD), Yea
Kennedy (D-MA), Nay
Kerry (D-MA), Nay
Kohl (D-WI), Yea
Kyl (R-AZ), Yea
Landrieu (D-LA), Yea
Lautenberg (D-NJ), Nay
Leahy (D-VT), Nay
Levin (D-MI), Nay
Lieberman (D-CT), Nay Pulled his head out of Bush's ass for a change.
Lincoln (D-AR), Yea
Lott (R-MS), Yea
Lugar (R-IN), Yea
Martinez (R-FL), Yea
McCain (R-AZ), Yea
McConnell (R-KY), Yea
Mikulski (D-MD), Nay
Murkowski (R-AK), Yea
Murray (D-WA), Nay
Nelson (D-FL), Yea
Nelson (D-NE), Yea
Obama (D-IL), Nay
Pryor (D-AR), Yea
Reed (D-RI), Nay
Reid (D-NV), Yea Wtf?
Roberts (R-KS), Yea
Rockefeller (D-WV), Nay
Salazar (D-CO), Yea
Santorum (R-PA), Yea
Sarbanes (D-MD), Nay
Schumer (D-NY), Nay
Sessions (R-AL), Yea
Shelby (R-AL), Yea
Smith (R-OR), Yea
Snowe (R-ME), Yea
Specter (R-PA), Yea
Stabenow (D-MI), Yea
Stevens (R-AK), Yea
Sununu (R-NH), Yea
Talent (R-MO), Yea
Thomas (R-WY), Yea
Thune (R-SD), Yea
Vitter (R-LA), Yea
Voinovich (R-OH), Yea
Warner (R-VA), Yea
Wyden (D-OR), Nay

	11-03-2005 06:26									#64
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quote: Originally posted by Rufus T. Firefly Swing states, nothing; the states with the highest rates of personal bankruptcies are -- you guessed it -- dyed-in-the-wool red states. Remember all those grinning rednecks who posted their pictures on WereNotSorry.com? Looks like its time for WhosSorryNow.com.

	11-03-2005 06:28									#65
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quote: Originally posted by DRoseDARs Roll call: Alphabetical by Senator Name Akaka (D-HI), Nay Alexander (R-TN), Yea Allard (R-CO), Yea Allen (R-VA), Yea Baucus (D-MT), Yea Bayh (D-IN), Yea Bennett (R-UT), Yea Biden (D-DE), Yea Bingaman (D-NM), Yea Bond (R-MO), Yea Boxer (D-CA), Nay Brownback (R-KS), Yea Bunning (R-KY), Yea Burns (R-MT), Yea Burr (R-NC), Yea Byrd (D-WV), Yea Cantwell (D-WA), Nay Carper (D-DE), Yea Chafee (R-RI), Yea Chambliss (R-GA), Yea Clinton (D-NY), Not Voting Coburn (R-OK), Yea Cochran (R-MS), Yea Coleman (R-MN), Yea Collins (R-ME), Yea Conrad (D-ND), Yea Cornyn (R-TX), Yea Corzine (D-NJ), Nay Craig (R-ID), Yea Crapo (R-ID), Yea Dayton (D-MN), Nay DeMint (R-SC), Yea DeWine (R-OH), Yea Dodd (D-CT), Nay Dole (R-NC), Yea Domenici (R-NM), Yea Dorgan (D-ND), Nay Durbin (D-IL), Nay Ensign (R-NV), Yea No suprise Enzi (R-WY), Yea Feingold (D-WI), Nay Feinstein (D-CA), Nay Frist (R-TN), Yea Graham (R-SC), Yea Grassley (R-IA), Yea Gregg (R-NH), Yea Hagel (R-NE), Yea Harkin (D-IA), Nay Hatch (R-UT), Yea Hutchison (R-TX), Yea Inhofe (R-OK), Yea Inouye (D-HI), Yea Isakson (R-GA), Yea Jeffords (I-VT), Yea Johnson (D-SD), Yea Kennedy (D-MA), Nay Kerry (D-MA), Nay Kohl (D-WI), Yea Kyl (R-AZ), Yea Landrieu (D-LA), Yea Lautenberg (D-NJ), Nay Leahy (D-VT), Nay Levin (D-MI), Nay Lieberman (D-CT), Nay Pulled his head out of Bush's ass for a change. Lincoln (D-AR), Yea Lott (R-MS), Yea Lugar (R-IN), Yea Martinez (R-FL), Yea McCain (R-AZ), Yea McConnell (R-KY), Yea Mikulski (D-MD), Nay Murkowski (R-AK), Yea Murray (D-WA), Nay Nelson (D-FL), Yea Nelson (D-NE), Yea Obama (D-IL), Nay Pryor (D-AR), Yea Reed (D-RI), Nay Reid (D-NV), Yea Wtf? Roberts (R-KS), Yea Rockefeller (D-WV), Nay Salazar (D-CO), Yea Santorum (R-PA), Yea Sarbanes (D-MD), Nay Schumer (D-NY), Nay Sessions (R-AL), Yea Shelby (R-AL), Yea Smith (R-OR), Yea Snowe (R-ME), Yea Specter (R-PA), Yea Stabenow (D-MI), Yea Stevens (R-AK), Yea Sununu (R-NH), Yea Talent (R-MO), Yea Thomas (R-WY), Yea Thune (R-SD), Yea Vitter (R-LA), Yea Voinovich (R-OH), Yea Warner (R-VA), Yea Wyden (D-OR), Nay

Reid ****ed us ehh. Oh well. We'll see how the congressmen do.

No surprise by Ensign as you said.

	11-03-2005 06:29									#66
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Sure a lot of Democrats who voted for this thing.

I'm not sure about Reid. Sometimes the leaders have to vote for a bill for procedural purposes.

	11-03-2005 06:30									#67
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quote: Originally posted by DanS Sure a lot of Democrats who voted for this thing.

traitors who deserve to be strung up with the rest of the Repukes...

	11-03-2005 06:32									#68
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quote: Originally posted by DanS Sure a lot of Democrats who voted for this thing. I'm not sure about Reid. Sometimes the leaders have to vote for a bill for procedural purposes.

Reid isn't much of a democrat anyways. He's from a small mining town south of Las Vegas. A very small town. If you blink, you miss it.

	11-03-2005 06:33									#69
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Can this even be said to be a GOP bill at this point? Looks like a bipartisan bill to me.

	11-03-2005 06:38									#70
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both my Senators from the lovely state of IL shall be spared when the revolution comes

	11-03-2005 06:47									#71
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quote: Can this even be said to be a GOP bill at this point? Looks like a bipartisan bill to me.

More screwing the proles.

	11-03-2005 06:57									#72
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quote: Originally posted by Rufus T. Firefly Swing states, nothing; the states with the highest rates of personal bankruptcies are -- you guessed it -- dyed-in-the-wool red states. Remember all those grinning rednecks who posted their pictures on WereNotSorry.com? Looks like its time for WhosSorryNow.com.

Indeed, my state of Indiana is one of the leaders in bankruptcies

As a lawyer who has worked a few bankruptcies, I find them distasteful to do and am glad I have washed my hands of them, though they are easy money for an attorney.

	11-03-2005 08:44									#73
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Barbara Boxer

	11-03-2005 08:47									#74
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Does the bankruptsy bill apply to the Iraq war fund?

	11-03-2005 09:24									#75
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quote: Originally posted by DanS Bankruptcy isn't a tool to take care of something merely unexpected.

No, bankruptcy is not merely for taking care of something unexpected, but that's part of it. That's how most companies go down - things go unexpectedly. Hm, say SARS, war, tsunami, drought, terrorist attacks, sudden shift in national policies, etc, etc.

quote: Originally posted by DanS The fact is that too many people are living paycheck to paycheck when their financial wherewithal is sufficient for them to plan ahead to weather the storms.

You are talking snarkly because nothing bad has unexpectedly happened to you. If you don't have a job for years, you will stop saying the same thing.

	11-03-2005 10:56									#76
	Got spare money?

If I have massive debts and need to delcare bankruptcy, i'll flee the country if this bill is not changed... I speak hebrew fluently and spanish passibly... I could get by.... I no longer feel any moral obligation if this piece of crap gets passed.

This bill is another big **** YOU to the American people...... welcome to Tyranny, population, us.

	11-03-2005 11:03									#77
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quote: Originally posted by Shi Huangdi It's funny that FreeRepublic and Gepap made nearly the same comment:

	11-03-2005 11:10									#78
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quote: Originally posted by Vesayen I no longer feel any moral obligation if this piece of crap gets passed.

You obviously don't feel any moral obligation to pay you debt anyway, why should this bill make a difference?

	11-03-2005 11:10									#79
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Vesayen: I'd return your freeriding ass back to the USA.

	11-03-2005 11:11									#80
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By Voting Position:

YEAs ---74
Alexander (R-TN)
Allard (R-CO)
Allen (R-VA)
Baucus (D-MT)
Bayh (D-IN)
Bennett (R-UT)
Biden (D-DE)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Bond (R-MO)
Brownback (R-KS)
Bunning (R-KY)
Burns (R-MT)
Burr (R-NC)
Byrd (D-WV)
Carper (D-DE)
Chafee (R-RI)
Chambliss (R-GA)
Coburn (R-OK)
Cochran (R-MS)
Coleman (R-MN)
Collins (R-ME)
Conrad (D-ND)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Craig (R-ID)
Crapo (R-ID)
DeMint (R-SC)
DeWine (R-OH)
Dole (R-NC)
Domenici (R-NM)
Ensign (R-NV)
Enzi (R-WY)
Frist (R-TN)
Graham (R-SC)
Grassley (R-IA)
Gregg (R-NH)
Hagel (R-NE)
Hatch (R-UT)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Inouye (D-HI)
Isakson (R-GA)
Jeffords (I-VT)
Johnson (D-SD)
Kohl (D-WI)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lincoln (D-AR)
Lott (R-MS)
Lugar (R-IN)
Martinez (R-FL)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Nelson (D-FL)
Nelson (D-NE)
Pryor (D-AR)
Reid (D-NV)
Roberts (R-KS)
Salazar (D-CO)
Santorum (R-PA)
Sessions (R-AL)
Shelby (R-AL)
Smith (R-OR)
Snowe (R-ME)
Specter (R-PA)
Stabenow (D-MI)
Stevens (R-AK)
Sununu (R-NH)
Talent (R-MO)
Thomas (R-WY)
Thune (R-SD)
Vitter (R-LA)
Voinovich (R-OH)
Warner (R-VA)

NAYs ---25
Akaka (D-HI)
Boxer (D-CA)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Corzine (D-NJ)
Dayton (D-MN)
Dodd (D-CT)
Dorgan (D-ND)
Durbin (D-IL)
Feingold (D-WI)
Feinstein (D-CA)
Harkin (D-IA)
Kennedy (D-MA)
Kerry (D-MA)
Lautenberg (D-NJ)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Lieberman (D-CT)
Mikulski (D-MD)
Murray (D-WA)
Obama (D-IL)
Reed (D-RI)
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Sarbanes (D-MD)
Schumer (D-NY)
Wyden (D-OR)

Not Voting - 1
Clinton (D-NY)

	11-03-2005 11:13									#81
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc You obviously don't feel any moral obligation to pay you debt anyway, why should this bill make a difference?

I love your Ford quote. Specifically, the irony of it.

	11-03-2005 11:36									#82
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I take my stance as a person several thousand dollars in debt and working at a relatively low paying job, Dancing Cow.

	11-03-2005 11:40									#83
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You remind me of this guy I work with. Have you ever ended an argument by singing "Hail to the Chief"?

	11-03-2005 12:23									#84
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What are the words to "Hail to the Chief" anyway?

	11-03-2005 13:37									#85
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TEF, you're late posting the rollcall by several hours...

	11-03-2005 13:59									#86
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quote: But those with income above the state's median income who can pay at least $6,000 over five years — $100 a month — would be forced into Chapter 13, where a judge would then order a repayment plan.

That seems like a reasonable provision to me. I don't make anywhere close to the median income where I live, and I do think those making more than me who go bankrupt should have to pay some of what they owe.

	11-03-2005 14:53									#87
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I knew Reid would be a joke as minority leader. They should have gone with Dodd.

	11-03-2005 15:07									#88
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quote: Originally posted by Odin The Republicans have absolutely pwned themselves. When this thing starts f*cking over middle-class families in the swing states the Republicans better get ready for President John Edwards.

I used to think this way and then I realized that American voters are so fvcking stupid that they would never remember anything from 6 months before much less two or three years. We are idiots.

	11-03-2005 15:11									#89
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BTW those **** bsg Republicans who harmed the working people of America by selling out to the moneyed credit card interests should be shoot. I really feel they should be shot but I'm just angry right now.