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The Mad Monk is offline The Mad Monk
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Mar 2000
time: 23:20
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Baeball Vows To Fight Steroids Subpoenas Tired of ads?

JUST HOW STUPID ARE THESE PEOPLE!?

quote:
Baseball Vows to Fight Steroids Subpoenas
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Mar 10, 8:19 AM (ET)

By RONALD BLUM

NEW YORK (AP) - Major league baseball responded with outrage to congressional subpoenas for Jose Canseco, Mark McGwire, Jason Giambi and other top stars, vowing to fight them all the way to court.

Curt Schilling, Sammy Sosa, Rafael Palmeiro and Frank Thomas also were summoned Wednesday to testify at the March 17 hearing of the House Government Reform Committee. Also called were players' association head Donald Fehr, baseball executive vice presidents Rob Manfred and Sandy Alderson and San Diego general manager Kevin Towers.

The committee, which has no interest in hearing from Barry Bonds, also demanded a variety of documents and records of baseball's drug tests.

Stanley Brand, a lawyer for the baseball commissioner's office, said the committee had no jurisdiction and was interfering with the federal grand jury by trying to force testimony from Giambi and others. He said the committee wanted to violate baseball's first amendment privacy rights and was attempting to "satisfy their prurient interest into who may and may not have engaged in this activity."

"The audacity, the legal audacity of subpoenaing someone who's been a grand jury witness before there's been a trial in the case in California is just an absolutely excessive and unprecedented misuse of congressional power," Brand said.

"Not even the Iran-contra committee attempted to do that, and when it did, it tainted irreparably the prosecutions that came out of that investigation. Now if that's what Congress wants to do to advance what it says is the public interest in combating a very serious problem that baseball has confronted, then in my judgment they've torn loose from their legislative moorings and they're marauding in an area of the law that has very serious consequences for the judicial system."

Gene Orza, the union's chief operating officer, declined comment.

Canseco, Fehr and Manfred have agreed to testify, with Manfred speaking on behalf of baseball commissioner Bud Selig. Before the subpoenas were issued, Brand told the committee the other players were declining invitations to appear. Thomas said Monday that he would testify.

It remained unclear whether the hearing will take place as scheduled.

"It's impossible to predict the exact course that this is going to take," Manfred said. "Players have individual decisions they're going to have to make, the union has decisions it's going to have to make."

David Marin, a spokesman for committee chairman Rep. Tom Davis, said the committee has no plans to contact Bonds, who also testified before the grand jury.

Bob Cohen, McGwire's agent, questioned "what's the ultimate purpose of the hearings?"

Brand and Manfred said baseball will attempt to fight the subpoenas. If they are not complied with, the committee could vote contempt citations, which would have to be approved by the full House of Representatives and certified by a U.S. Attorney. If that happened, Brand said the fight over the subpoenas would head to U.S. District Court.

"It is important the American people know the facts on baseball's steroid scandal," Davis and Rep. Henry Waxman, the ranking Democrat, said in a statement. "Consistent with our committee's jurisdiction over the nation's drug policy, we need to better understand the steps MLB is taking to get a handle on the steroid issue, and whether news of those steps - and the public health danger posed by steroid use - is reaching America's youth."

Marin maintained the committee had proper jurisdiction over steroids and baseball.

"We can't fathom that they will advocate noncompliance with a congressional subpoena," he said. "What kind of message does that send?"

Bay Area Laboratory Co-Operative founder Victor Conte was indicted last year on charges of distributing illegal steroids that eventually made their way to as many as 30 baseball, football and track and field stars. Also indicted were Greg Anderson, Bonds' weight trainer; James Valente, BALCO's vice president; and Remy Korechemny, a track coach.

A trial date has not been set, and Brand said testimony from players would be "whipping up a torrent of pretrail publicity."

Another congressional hearing on steroids is scheduled for Thursday, when the House Energy and Commerce subcommittee is to hear from witnesses, including labor lawyers from the commissioner's office and the NFL, and representatives of the NCAA and the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency.

Rep. Cliff Stearns, chairman of the House Commerce, Trade and Consumer Protection subcommittee, said Selig was invited to speak at the hearing but declined.

---

AP Sports Writer Howard Fendrich in Washington contributed to this report.


http://apnews.myway.com/article/20050310/D88O4IVO0.html

pchang is offline pchang
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Aug 1999
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  Old Post 10-03-2005 20:14
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Baseball is pretty stupid. But then, so are US voters. Why are we allowing Congress to waste tax payer money on hearings about steroids in baseball? What the hell does that have to do with things like fixing our budget deficits, social security, and medicare?

Saras is offline Saras
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Vilnius, Lithuania
Apr 1999
time: 06:20
  Old Post 10-03-2005 20:15
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Baeball, subpoenas - Korean? Urdu?

Ming is offline Ming
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Jan 1970
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Screw both sides... No need to state how stupid baseball has been about this... But Congress is just looking for sound bite material... some political grand standing... and a total waste of their time. Maybe they should be having some hearings on things that really matter...

rah is offline rah
Apolyton Prince of Moderators, Master of Reason
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Jan 1970
time: 23:20
  Old Post 10-03-2005 20:34
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While I can think of nothing more amusing then watching Players either lying or taking the 5th, I don't like the idea of publicity craving politicians trying to benefit from this when they have more important things to do.

Anyone want to bet that Sammy Sosa's english gets suddenly real poor when he testifies. ?

pchang is offline pchang
King
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Aug 1999
time: 05:20
  Old Post 10-03-2005 20:41
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Tired of ads?

GETS?

rah is offline rah
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Jan 1970
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  Old Post 10-03-2005 20:52
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Really,
I have seen interviews where he was almost articulate.
He turns it on and off as needed. I know what he'll need in front of Congress. No Hablo Ingesh

Sava is offline Sava
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Mar 2001
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  Old Post 10-03-2005 22:49
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quote:
Originally posted by rah

Really,
I have seen interviews where he was almost articulate.
He turns it on and off as needed. I know what he'll need in front of Congress. No Hablo Ingesh
yeah Sosa does turn on and off his good English...

My question is:

What is the purpose of these hearings? What will the end result be?

I think the government has better things to do for pete's sack!

Ming is offline Ming
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quote:
Originally posted by Sava
What is the purpose of these hearings?


To get free press time for some self important lossers

Sava is offline Sava
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Mar 2001
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  Old Post 10-03-2005 22:53
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quote:
Originally posted by Ming


To get free press time for some self important lossers
Well yeah...

but is there any kind of official mandate? Or is this just a pure PR stunt?

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

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The Potterverse
Jan 1970
time: 00:20
  Old Post 11-03-2005 00:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Sava
Well yeah...

but is there any kind of official mandate? Or is this just a pure PR stunt?


Well, Congress has, of course, the power to take away Baseball's anti-trust exemption. So this could be fairly important.

Dis is offline Dis
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Las Vegas, Nevada
Feb 2000
time: 21:20
  Old Post 11-03-2005 00:21 Visit Dis's homepage!
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baseball

wake me up when it becomes a legitimate sport.

Oerdin is offline Oerdin
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Sep 2001
time: 21:20
  Old Post 11-03-2005 00:24
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quote:
Originally posted by The Mad Monk
JUST HOW STUPID ARE THESE PEOPLE!?


The type of stupidity that comes with extreme greed. By all accounts steroid use is rampent in basebal and much of the increase in home runs, faster pitching, faster running, and what not have been due to chemical enhancements.

My personal belief is we ought to lift the anti-trust exemption baseball enjoys and make the bastards compete for their millions. At least then there would be no holding a city hostage and threatening to move unless they get tens of millions of more dollars worth of subsidies.

pchang is offline pchang
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Aug 1999
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  Old Post 11-03-2005 00:29
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If steroids are used by both pitchers and hitters, shouldn't the results cancel each other out?

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

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Jan 1970
time: 00:20
  Old Post 11-03-2005 00:36
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quote:
Originally posted by pchang
If steroids are used by both pitchers and hitters, shouldn't the results cancel each other out?


Yep... but no one focuses on the fact that pitchers are juicing (I believe that most of the top K/IP records were set in the last 10 years)

quote:
My personal belief is we ought to lift the anti-trust exemption baseball enjoys and make the bastards compete for their millions. At least then there would be no holding a city hostage and threatening to move unless they get tens of millions of more dollars worth of subsidies.


Why, so they can be the NFL which has seen teams move at a MUCH rapid clip that baseball? So you can have an Al Davis who can move from Oakland to LA and then back to Oakland? And the NFL can't do anything because the courts have said so? Pah... no thank you! It'd be much worse of taking a 'city hostage' without the exemption.

Oerdin is offline Oerdin
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  Old Post 11-03-2005 00:46
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quote:
Originally posted by pchang
If steroids are used by both pitchers and hitters, shouldn't the results cancel each other out?


No because you can still throw faster balls (thus improving average speed numbers) and still hit the ball further (thus improving home run numbers).

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

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  Old Post 11-03-2005 00:50
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quote:
No because you can still throw faster balls (thus improving average speed numbers) and still hit the ball further (thus improving home run numbers).


Only if you can get to a quicker thrown ball.

example, last year they started to test for steroids. It was also the year when the most HRs in history were hit. Coincidence? Could it be that the pitchers were the ones juicing more, so when they were off the juice to avoid getting caught they got slammed?

Moral Hazard is offline Moral Hazard
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Jul 1999
time: 01:20
  Old Post 11-03-2005 00:51
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Lack of AT exemption would kill the Minors. That would piss me off to no end.

Anyway, will this accomplish anything. I dunno, I don't think so, but it should make for good TV. I'll be recording it. I'm curious about how many ballplayers will take the fifth. As everyone will consider it an admission.

Oerdin is offline Oerdin
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quote:
Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Why, so they can be the NFL which has seen teams move at a MUCH rapid clip that baseball? So you can have an Al Davis who can move from Oakland to LA and then back to Oakland? And the NFL can't do anything because the courts have said so? Pah... no thank you! It'd be much worse of taking a 'city hostage' without the exemption.


They both play the game but at least the NFL doesn't try to hide drug users in their sport. I'd love to see a half dozen different leagues with teams moving up or down the various leagues depending upon if they get last or first place in a season. It would stop dirt bag owners from ignoring their team and just using it like a cash cow (like the LA Clippers owner does in the NBA) and it would make the value of those teams closer reflect reality instead of an artificially high price based upon unfairly restricting supply. If a team wants to move then it can but replacements will be way easier to find plus if a team owner doesn't want to invest in his team he'll see that team sink into the minor leagues thus losing much of his investment.

In other words there would be no more free rides and no more blackmail.

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

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quote:
at least the NFL doesn't try to hide drug users in their sport


Ask vlad about this. The NFL really isn't caring about HGH and other things. As long as it shows it cares about the steroid problem, it's happy. Most NFL players are not natural, and who cares?

quote:
I'd love to see a half dozen different leagues with teams moving up or down the various leagues depending upon if they get last or first place in a season.


Yeah, like that would ever work with the media? Can you imagine if the New York team gets relegated? And take a look at European soccer where in a lot of leagues you have an 'elite' who have a ton of money to buy the best players from the lower leagues (trades of player for player will mostly stop as teams pay lower teams for the right to players). Basically there is NO possibility in the European soccer system, which has the promotion/relegation for a salary cap or meaningful revenue sharing with the entirety of teams. Basically, beware.. you may get what you wish for (and then you'll wish you never wished for it!)

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