18-03-2005 16:37									#1
	Evil capitalists call Castro rich! Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/ameri...reut/index.html

Of course he says he isn't

	18-03-2005 17:29									#3
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so i guess Bush owns America, right? The Family has been in control all these years it's almost the same as Castro...

forbes

	18-03-2005 20:16									#4
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Oh Mark... we can always count on you for idiotic posts .

Yeah, because having a party in a democracy in charge for a long time (12 years at most!) is the same as being a dictator for 50 years?

Castro is just mad that someone found out that he's a rich stinking bastard.

	18-03-2005 20:21									#5
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How well does Castro live compared to other people in the world? other Cubans?

	18-03-2005 20:24									#6
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I wouldn't be surprised if he was quite wealthy, but the methodology for calculating his wealth seems highly suspect as best. Previously - basing it on a certain percentage of Cuban GDP??? Now - assuming he owns some companies, and then comparitively valuing those companies against other companies that are publically traded??? WTF?

	18-03-2005 20:34									#7
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Well, when you are a totalitarian dictator, you ulitimately own all state run corporations. I mean during the old USSR era, it wasn't like the Communist Party bosses in the Soviet Union were living like the ordinary people.

	18-03-2005 20:44									#8
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Well, when you are a totalitarian dictator, you ulitimately own all state run corporations. I mean during the old USSR era, it wasn't like the Communist Party bosses in the Soviet Union were living like the ordinary people.

Using that parameter, I'm sure his net worth would be much higher than $550 million based on their valuation techiniques. Which is why I find the whole thing to be pie-in-the-sky crap.

	18-03-2005 20:47									#9
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Then how would you decide his wealth? I'm sure he won't let you look at his bank accounts.

	18-03-2005 20:56									#10
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It's like saying power = wealth, and that's true in a way, but then it's not true in a way.

	18-03-2005 20:58									#11
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quote: Originally posted by pchang How well does Castro live compared to other people in the world? other Cubans?

I don't think he has any Saddam style palaces, but then I doubt he ever has his needs unmet.

	18-03-2005 21:12									#12
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quote: an American magazine of decaying credibility

Fidel lives pretty frugally. Certainly less lavishly that Bush and probably on the level of the New Zealand Prime Minister.

If you'd watched Ollie Stone's film about him (which you can't in the "free" USA) you'd know.

That is a daft way of measuring his wealth though. I bet that there are plenty of Apolytoners who are wealthier than Fidel.

	18-03-2005 21:12									#13
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Then how would you decide his wealth? I'm sure he won't let you look at his bank accounts.

I wouldn't bother - I'd just say it's indeterminable rather than throwing out a crap number that seems to be for little else than getting the hackles up of both Fidel Castro and the west in general.

	18-03-2005 21:26									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Agathon If you'd watched Ollie Stone's film about him (which you can't in the "free" USA) you'd know.

It's on video. I don't know if you can find it at the major chains though.

edit: Actually that might be a different movie that I'm thinking of.

	18-03-2005 21:27									#15
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The best part about this is he's considering suing Forbes.

	18-03-2005 21:28									#16
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The Forbes methodology is completely bogus. Obviously, if their first method was to assign an abitrary percentage of the Cuban gdp to Castro, they have no evidence that any of that accrues to him personally.

Their second methodology is no better. In order to demonstrate that Castro is rich, they must prove the money produced by these state owned corporations flows PERSONALLY to him, rather than being reinvested in the corporations or being transferred to the state.

And Imran, you know better.

	18-03-2005 21:29									#17
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quote: The best part about this is he's considering suing Forbes.

I hope he does.

	18-03-2005 21:37									#18
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quote: And Imran, you know better.

What, that dictators don't personally profit from their totalitarian regimes? Come on now. Yeah, Castro is really living like a pauper while all the money is just being reinvested. Pleeeeease.

	18-03-2005 21:41									#19
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I believe he doesn't live much better than most Cubans. He isn't materialistic.

	18-03-2005 21:44									#20
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Yeah, and the Pope is Protestant.

	18-03-2005 21:47									#21
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Do you have any basis for your judgements at all?

Last edited by Kidicious on 18-03-2005 at 21:53

	18-03-2005 21:49									#22
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quote: Originally posted by techumseh The Forbes methodology is completely bogus. Obviously, if their first method was to assign an abitrary percentage of the Cuban gdp to Castro, they have no evidence that any of that accrues to him personally. Their second methodology is no better. In order to demonstrate that Castro is rich, they must prove the money produced by these state owned corporations flows PERSONALLY to him, rather than being reinvested in the corporations or being transferred to the state.

So if I reinvest money from dividends it's not part of my wealth? Please tell the IRS!

	18-03-2005 21:52									#23
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He's a brutal dictator. That's enough basis for me. People don't become dictators because they 'want to make a change'. They do it for power and money. People that want to make a change liberalize their holds. Lenin, for example, started to introduce the NEP and allowed others into the process, such as Stalin and Trotsky.

If Castro was so non materialistic and so looking out for the welfare of the people instead of his own pocket, he'd have reliquinished some power and allowed democratic elections to some extent. The fact that he hasn't indicates that he's raping the country barren and doesn't want anyone to stand in his way.

	18-03-2005 21:53									#24
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Castro lives about as well as most leaders of countries that aren't bent. Compare him to the Prime Minister of Canada and you have it about right.

He has a very small office and he obviously doesn't spend much on clothes.

He has a private movie room. But so does Bush.

	18-03-2005 21:57									#25
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Paul Marin is the second richest leader of a G8 country, and far ahead of Bush. His personal net worth is in the C$300 million range.

	18-03-2005 21:59									#26
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Yes, but his offical PM perks and residence are not all that. Same goes for most leaders of democracies. Shrub has a huge and luxurious house compared to most.

	18-03-2005 21:59									#27
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Aggie got PWNED!

	18-03-2005 22:00									#28
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You don't seem to know much about Castro Imran. You're just using your world view to make generalizations about people and not bothering with particulars again.

You might say it was part of some overall plan to rule the world or something, but I imagine that you didn't know that when Castro was a lawyer he mostly took cases of people who couldn't pay him. He could have lived a life of a wealthy man, but he chose to fight for what he believed was right. He's very moral, and not materialistic.

	18-03-2005 22:01									#29
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quote: Shrub has a huge and luxurious house compared to most.

Well he's also the Head of State. I think the British Head of State (who, IIUC is also the Canadian Head of State) lives in a pretty luxurious house .

	18-03-2005 22:03									#30
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quote: You don't seem to know much about Castro Imran.

I do know that he is a brutal dictator that has not loosened the reigns on his people for over 50 years. Why, is he afraid they'll find out that he's been pocketing a lot of cash? The Soviet party bosses lived like Kings. You don't think their little brother Castro took something for himself? Come on!