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arnoldvsgooch
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I usually play now at regent level. In most cases I switch to Republic and stay unless I am religious, in which case I become a Democracy. Usually I stay at 0% during despotism and up it to 10% for republic or 20% for democracy. I know it is probably circumstantial and game specific for luxury rate, but does anyone have a kind of rule of thumb for the different governments. I never go beyond 20% at regent level, but for the harder levels should I consider raising the luxury rate? Any input on this subject would be appreciated.
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arnoldvsgooch
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Ok, so if I can get all or most luxuries I should probably be able to run at 0%-10%? If I am missing luxuries and/or have civil disorder problems it wouldn't be a bad idea to bump it up to 20%-40%. Thanks for the reply's.
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joncnunn
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Maryland Heights, MO
Sep 2002
time: 23:30
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More like 0% is normal, especally on a level so low as Regent.
On Regent level:
3 citizens are naturally content. (By comparsion, on Emperor and above only 1, and on Monarch 2)
The 4th either needs any of 1 luxary, a Temple, 1 MP, or a Tax Men / Scientist
The 5th without either luxaries, Temples nor MP would need that Tax / Scientist converted into an entertainer.
Specalists are stop gap for an indivudal city with problems.
The luxary slider is a stop gap with there are lots of cities with problems.
The real solution is getting sufficent luxaries. 3+ unique types since that's where Market Places start helping.
Extra luxaries via slider do no good whatsoever unless sufficent to bring about a WLTPD, and even then the WLTPD only matters away from the core because the effect of WLTPD is reducing corruption [shields only] in Civ III and not pop boom like Civ II / SMAC.
For the same reason, be careful about decisions to buy luxaries if you already have 4 types. There are curcumstances where a 5th luxary does no good whatsoever unless you also have a 6th.
Having only one unique luxary type (or NONE!  ) are really the cases where a rush (ancient era war) against your neighbor with them is called for, and if it's taking a while building up for the war and aquiring the luxaries, that is when 10% luxary slider may be needed. But also note that if you are not under a representive govt, being at war gives you negative WW. (Happiness goes up by 1 person in each city!)
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Solomwi
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Don King of the Apolyton HLA Movement
Dec 2002
time: 23:30
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My philosophy, in a nutshell, is to, as Modo says, pursue a 0% lux setting, through happiness improvements and luxes. However, I recognize the lux slider as a tool at my disposal, and a pretty efficient one at that, most of the time, and won't hesitate to use it to keep cities out of disorder or to bring about WLTKD. One thing to look for regarding WLTKD: even in your innermost core, it can be the difference in getting to the next production platform, for instance 50 raw shields instead of 49, and saving on turn on future builds. It's not always going to happen that way, but it's something to look for.
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cousLee
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It depends on what your civil disorder problem is. If you only have 1-3,4 cities with problems, it's better to use specialists and build some happiness buildings imo. I tend to use the lux slider more for maintaining WLTKD. If you have a genuine disorder problem, then get some goods asap. Every % on the lux slider is handicapping your science/gold production, esp is you have science and gold buildings in place.
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vmxa1
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Oviedo, Fl
Nov 2001
time: 21:30
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quote:
Originally posted by arnoldvsgooch
I usually play now at regent level. In most cases I switch to Republic and stay unless I am religious, in which case I become a Democracy. Usually I stay at 0% during despotism and up it to 10% for republic or 20% for democracy. I know it is probably circumstantial and game specific for luxury rate, but does anyone have a kind of rule of thumb for the different governments. I never go beyond 20% at regent level, but for the harder levels should I consider raising the luxury rate? Any input on this subject would be appreciated. |
First if you can get by with 0 lux, you either have way to good of a start location or on too low of a level. I cannot do that for long.
Well I guess you could keep the cities pop down, which is often a method at the 1 content levels.
Second, the thing I look at is the ratio of happy to unhappy. If it is not balanced or not more happy than sad, I need action. That action is often to use the slider. It is nearly always better to do that than a specialist in the early game.
IOW I am happy to do it later with larger cities that are mostly corrupt. So what are my needs and what is my cost. Which method yields the best results.
I was actually looking at a game last night that was on Demi (iirc) and had 5 happy and one content or unhappy, I forget which one. Anyway I was testing the value of taxman and changed a citizen to a taxman and actually ended up with only 4 happy citizens. The net gold came up one, but commerce was down and of course the city no longer grows and a shields was lost.
So it is plain to me, that one size does not fit all.
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Dimitrius
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Lux slider...MMmm before end of turn sneak a peak at F1..it will tell you (show you) which cities will go into disordr next turn. Adjust slider accordingly..if its too high convert citizens with little production tiles until these tiles are improved. There is no "set" value for Lux..too many factors so.....proper micromanagement every turn is best way to get the most out of your civ (production wise, gold wise, expansion wise). This game is all about micromanagement and adapting your startegies to fit the present situation.
So in other words stay one stap ahead of your people.
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Hermann the Lombard
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Hoboken, NJ, USA
Jun 1999
time: 00:30
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quote:
Originally posted by joncnunn
This whole thread started out with someone on Regent level. The early game 10% luxaries when a city hits pop 2 is much more of an Emperor level+ stategry that's unneeded (and conterproductive) on Regent level. |
Of course you're right, but the topic is of interest to players at every level, so I think it's fine to expand the discussion for the benefit of improving players and intermediate players. Back in Civ2 I ended up playing nothing but Deity for a long time, and of course at that level there is very little margin for error. [I haven't wanted to play C3C with quite that intensity!]
Oh, and to help with the micromanagement, I use the "popheads fixed" that Stainless Steel posted in the Files thread "GRAPHICS MOD: Trip's Graphics Set." That puts a small color-coded smiley next to each face, easy enough to read on the F1 screen.
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vulture
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Leeds, UK
Jun 2001
time: 05:30
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I find the best way to look at the use of the luxury slider is that when a city reaches the largest size it can before going in to disorder, you generally want to let the city grow and use the luxury slider rather than stop the city from growing.
It's never quite that straight forwards though. If the city in question is going to be working undeveloped tiles when it grows (or even worse, is already working undeveloped tiles) you'd probably do better to control its happiness by popping out a worker or two and building some roads and other improvements.
Plus you have to balance producing too many luxuries in some cities vs not enough in other cities. You don't want to have every city in your empire happy if it means that your size 5 capital is producing 10 luxuries, with the slider at 80%, just so one of your outpost towns can live at size 4 (and contributing virtually nothing due to corruption). But neither do you want to only have your capital happy and growing, while all the other cities aren't generating sufficient luxuries and have therefore ground to a halt through the use of specialists. You will almost always have some cities stuck with specialists and unable to grow while others produce more luxuries than they actually need. Temples offer the same effect - one gold for allowing the city to reach one size bigger. Don't be in a hurry to build them where you have an excess of luxuries. Do try and pop rush them in fast growing border towns.
Despotism offers a small advantage here with Military Police. Non-border cities with excess luxuries can get by with no MPs, which can be redeployed to border cities that are too corrupt to generate luxuries, and thus keep them happy as well. This improves your military budget slightly. It's not much though, but it can be used to effectively redistribute the production of luxuries to where it is needed to some extent.
As joncnunn says, ideally you want to have the luxury slider at 0%. You want happiness to be contained by having luxury resources, nautrally content citizens, military police (if allowed) and some improvements and wonders. Temples and colliseums mimic the effect of the luxury slider - one gold for one happy citizen (at the expense of a certain number of shields - and I can't remember the maintenance cost of cathedrals). As such you're often better off using the luxury slider; same effect, but quicker, can be removed when not needed, and costs no shields.
But when you can't have the luxury slider at 0, definitely use it in preference to stopping your cities from growing. There is no 'right' value. There may be typical values for a given style of play, map type, difficulty level. But you shouldn't aim for a particular value. You just do whatever it takes to keep your cities happy, productive and growing.
Of course, having the slider at 50% for a long period of time is a bad thing. Your priority should be acquiring luxuries - they reduce luxury spending in a way that temples and colliseums don't. But even if it is a bad thing, having the slider at 50% is way better than being in the same situation, but having it at 10% and having cities 4 or 5 sizes smaller.
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arnoldvsgooch
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Vulture,
Thank you for your response, I feel I understand alot better the dynamics of luxuries obtained, luxuries allocated by the slider and "happiness structures". Excellent post!
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khoma
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I tend to have mine at 10% througout most of the game, on regent level. Just saves me some trouble with disorder. When I'm at war otoh, I usually end up at around 50%, since allways use republic government and 50% on the lux slider allows for a whole lot of warring without any complaints. Since most wars are over in a very small number of turns anyway, it doesn't really matter that science slows down during war time.
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kiurkugord
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quote:
Originally posted by cousLee
It depends on what your civil disorder problem is. If you only have 1-3,4 cities with problems, it's better to use specialists and build some happiness buildings imo. I tend to use the lux slider more for maintaining WLTKD. If you have a genuine disorder problem, then get some goods asap. Every % on the lux slider is handicapping your science/gold production, esp is you have science and gold buildings in place. |
What does asap mean?
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29-03-2005 21:30
). Whether you trade or conquer the luxuries, having them all will be great to your empire. While quite doable up to some level (player-dependant), it sure becomes difficult as you move up.
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