03-04-2005 23:39									#1
	MY 2166 Planning thread Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Why don't we drop the R-112 off on the monolith on the shore just east of Huddling? It'll heal to 100%, and as the Hive next plays its turn in 2166, if they sneak- attack it. the R-112 can leap back aboard the Pegasus as it'll have its full movement points next turn.

What to put into production at Minas Tirith (in the event that we get a completion podpop with the Heimdall?)

And same question for whatever base the Disco Volante is closest to* (for when it pops those juicy pods south of Angels' land)

*I'm thinking 2Nuts Strand, although Iaca base might be as close

	04-04-2005 00:44									#2
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Now we can send our elite probe to incite drone riots, and frame Morgan (parallel turn simulation activated to see how the game engine deals with this probe action - ie given the discussions in the general forum, does it work in PBEMs or not - it works!!)

p.s. Note our reputation (Integrity), below!!!

Attachment: probeframe.gif
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	04-04-2005 04:17									#3
	Re: MY 2166 Planning thread Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by Googlie Why don't we drop the R-112 off on the monolith on the shore just east of Huddling? It'll heal to 100%, and as the Hive next plays its turn in 2166, if they sneak- attack it. the R-112 can leap back aboard the Pegasus as it'll have its full movement points next turn.

Sounds great! AFAIK units can't retreat on transports though.

quote: What to put into production at Minas Tirith (in the event that we get a completion podpop with the Heimdall?)

Choice is between an über-military or probe unit, or a fungal gin freight (for our next SP: Plan Datalinks or Ascetic Virtues I guess) I assume?

quote: And same question for whatever base the Disco Volante is closest to* (for when it pops those juicy pods south of Angels' land) *I'm thinking 2Nuts Strand, although Iaca base might be as close

IIRC it was Iaci Base, but it's easy to retest with the simulator.

quote: Now we can send our elite probe to incite drone riots, and frame Morgan (parallel turn simulation activated to see how the game engine deals with this probe action - ie given the discussions in the general forum, does it work in PBEMs or not - it works!!)

Yeah, I discovered it only works when you aren't at war with the faction you probe.
So, do we want to go ahead with it?
IIRC, for an elite probe the chance for success is 50%. And we don't have a second chance, as being discovered would make Yang redeclare war on us.

Fifty % chance Morgan is at war with Yang the rest of the game, 50% chance we are at war with Yang the rest of the game...*

* At least IIRC if you unsuccesfully frame someone, the two factions involved are really pissed off at you, to the point of fighting to the death. Or would it be possible to sign a truce by once again capturing a base, and then repeat the method we used this turn? Can't recall... Too long ago I tried this.

	04-04-2005 06:02									#4
	Re: Re: MY 2166 Planning thread Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Maniac AFAIK units can't retreat on transports though.

I dunno - I known they can't retreat onto Unity seed pods - even on Automatic i dunno if they'd have the sense to retreat onto the trannie (or maybe fight back)

quote: Choice is between an über-military or probe unit, or a fungal gin freight (for our next SP: Plan Datalinks or Ascetic Virtues I guess) I assume?

I'd go for the FGF

quote: Yeah, I discovered it only works when you aren't at war with the faction you probe. So, do we want to go ahead with it? IIRC, for an elite probe the chance for success is 50%. And we don't have a second chance, as being discovered would make Yang redeclare war on us. Fifty % chance Morgan is at war with Yang the rest of the game, 50% chance we are at war with Yang the rest of the game...*

Actually it's 75% chance of succeeding in the frame-up with a 67% chance of surviving it (seee below)

quote: * At least IIRC if you unsuccesfully frame someone, the two factions involved are really pissed off at you, to the point of fighting to the death. Or would it be possible to sign a truce by once again capturing a base, and then repeat the method we used this turn? Can't recall... Too long ago I tried this.

I think that the base-capture/exchange for a truce works many times, but I'm not sanguine about getting moire than a handful of turns of peace with Yang as it is right now (unless we changed to POLICE, and got him to agree on joint battle plans against the Gaians - or Morgan if the frame-up is successful

My CRYPTEIA division is rarin' to go - the upside is that we get yang and Morgan in Vendetta, the downside is that we are no worse off than we were at the beginning of this turn

	04-04-2005 06:03									#5
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LOL - we could even frame the Angels!!

	04-04-2005 06:40									#6
	Re: Re: Re: MY 2166 Planning thread Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by Googlie I'd go for the FGF

quote: Actually it's 75% chance of succeeding in the frame-up with a 67% chance of surviving it (seee below)

***Edit: Disregard the remainer of this post.***

I thought this too until a week ago or so. But when I was testing in the simulator whether framing would work, the chance of success seemed much lower than what I thought they should have been. So I decided to do a bit more extensive and systematic testing: trying to frame Morgan, 20 times with an elite probe, 20 times with a commando probe. The results matched the following "theory" very well:

The first percentage you see is the chance the probe action will succeed in its mission. The second percentage you see is the chance the probe will survive the mission (not get captured) provided it has succeeded in fulfilling its mission.

For a frame operation to be succesful, a probe needs to survive its mission, not get captured.

To make these words a little more clear, let's give a concrete example: the "75%, 67%" we're dealing with here.

The chance for success is 75%, so the chance for complete failure 25% =>

The probe will in one quarter of the cases fail to incite drone riots, and will be captured.

The chance for success is 75%, and the chance to survive the mission is 67% of 75, 50 in other words =>

The probe will in one half of the cases incite drone riots, and manage to escape unnoticed, thus succeeding in framing the Corporation.

However in 33% of the cases when the "incite drone riots" mission succeeds, the probe will still get captured =>

The probe will in one quarter of the cases succeed in inciting drone riots, but will get captured after fulfulling its mission, meaning the Hive will know we're responsible, and the framing operation will have failed.

	04-04-2005 07:07									#7
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I just remembered all these tests were done while I was in vendetta with Yang. Meaning I don't know whether being captured equals failure of the framing. Meaning you could be right Googlie: 75% chance for success of the framing operation, and 50% chance to survive the mission (67% of 75).

Respect for our Crypteia btw... Them being captured and interrogated, yet still maintaining the story that they're Morganic probes, despite all the tortures to get the truth out of them.

	04-04-2005 08:57									#8
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quote: Originally posted by Maniac Respect for our Crypteia btw... Them being captured and interrogated, yet still maintaining the story that they're Morganic probes, despite all the tortures to get the truth out of them.

Anderson slumped in his chair and looked wearily at the Hive interrogator. Numbly he shook his head;

“What I say is true. I am Chester Anderson, an electronic salesman attached to Morgan Eudaimonics, and I am here visiting my local sales staff in Socialism Tunnels. As you know, this is the major entry point for our goods and services into Hiverian lands.”

The Hive agent looked at him sadly, then cracked a smile. “Bring in Angelica. She’ll wrest the truth out of him. Get him ready”

Two acolytes moved in and began unpacking a case that to Anderson looked like nothing more than wires and receptor nodes. He blanched, as the significance of what was happening sank into his consciousness. Nodes were connected to his skull, and wires attached, then hitched to a small generator in the case.

The door swung open, and Anderson looked up at the most beautiful woman he had laid eyes on. She fixed her eyes on his, and there he saw an implacable hatred in their depths.

Anderson looked up at her out of bloodshot eyes and whimpered:

“I’ve told you everything – and nothing but the truth. Why do you persist in this torture?”

Angelica grunted, and with a wave of her hand dismissed the acolytes.

“Lisa has confessed everything,” she said. “You are a Spartan covert operations agent, code-named Ajax. Your mission here was to incite drone riots and compromise the Morgan faction, thereby inducing our chairman to declare vendetta on the CEO. Whether you want to or not, you will reveal the truth and won’t be able to help yourself. Because I am going into your mind.”

Anderson shuddered. He had heard tale of those hive telepaths, and of one whose brutality matched her beauty and intelligence – Angelica.

Her watched, fascinated, as she drew the long metallic-sheened gloves over her hands, flexing the fingers to let the contact nodes settle on her fingertips and gently scratching the sensor-tipped nails across the control pad in front of her.

He flinched as she flipped the contact switch, then felt the filaments snake into his cerebral cortex, seeking out the interstices within his neural network, and attaching themselves to entry points.

“Ready, darling?” breathed Angelica, fitting the sensor helmet to her own head.

Anderson slumped, preparing for the inevitable denouement.

“Name?” she asked.

Chester Anderson

She hesitated. This was probably true.

“Why are you in Socialism Tunnels?”

I’ve told you. I’m a sales manager here to meet my local sales staff

Angelica tapped her gloves together, then drew one lightly across his bared chest, the diamond tips searing across his flesh and opening up scars that seeped blood.

Suddenly Chester felt his ribcage constricting, cutting off his breathing, as he struggled to gasp for air.

“Wrong, darling. You are a Spartan covert operations agent codenamed Ajax, are you not?”

No he wheezed. I am a Morganite sales representative

“Well, then,” she continued, “you’ll tell me who Lisa is and why you are consorting with a self-confessed Spartan probe operative”

We met in a bar – spent the night together he croaked.

Angelica dragged the glove across his flesh again, and Anderson struggled for breath as his chest constricted still more.

“One more time and you die of self-suffocation, you know. It’s all in your mind, and I can tell when you’re lying. I am in your mind now, and but for your training in erecting neural defenses, I could see who you really are. You now have the choice of lowering your neural barriers or perhaps dying when I force them – and is it worth dying for – if you really are the salesman you say you are?”

Anderson sighed, then relaxed:

Go on then – you have access and lowered his neural defences.

Angelica activated a small commlink on her wrist and intoned:

“I am in his mind now, and he is open and defenceless. He is a Second Lieutenant in the Morgan Covert Operations Corps, code-named Lucius. His real name is indeed Chester Anderson. Lisa is his accomplice, code named Diva. Their mission was to incite drone riots in Socialism Tunnels and frame the Peacekeepers to try and draw Hive attention from their pactmates, the Gaians. The data confirm that this is correct.”

She leaned forward and disconnected the probes and sensors, and took off her gloves. Lightly stroking his face, she said:

“Now that wasn’t too hard, was it?”

She rose, and left the room, leaving Anderson slumped numbly in his chair.

*************************************************

As they turned away from the one-way glass, Colonel Maniac looked over at Colonel Googlie:

“Good work. He really does believe that he is a Morgan agent. He’ll survive the real Angelica’s probing. You won’t forget to have the ship’s captain run up the Morgan flag when he comes on deck for the insertion onto Hive lands?”

“Taken care of,” replied Googlie. “Crew will have Morgan uniforms, and thanks to pilfering Mr. Moneypenny’s wallet those years ago, a crewmember will even slip him some Morgan vouchers and ask for a Hive trinket to be brought back.. All to substantiate the myth that he is a Morgan agent”

“Sounds like it can’t fail, then” grinned Maniac. “In a few days Morgan will have one less friend on Chiron, and might find his new defenders facing not only our elite troops and aircraft, but also those of the redoubtable Chairman as well”

	04-04-2005 13:49									#9
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One idea about the builds for supposed completions. Let us do the probing of Yang first (I am in favor, along with framing Morgan.), and only then choose. If we manage to frame Morgan, I have no real preference there, although a super-noodle might be nice (If there is such a thing...). If we go back to war with Yang, I would say we need another super-attacker to go and kick the Hive in the guts.

	05-04-2005 19:55									#10
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Cool story about the framing.

However I fear I have some good and some bad news regarding it...

I'll start with the bad news.

The bad news is this story can't become reality as far as I can tell. I did a few tests, this time while in a truce with Yang, and I appear to be correct after all: being captured does equal failure of the framing attempt. Meaning chance for success would be 50% after all.

Now a piece of good news. If the framing operation succeeds, in the scenario menu Yang gets the "I want revenge" box clicked on for their faction diplomacy with the Corporation. But when the framing operation fails, we're of course at vendetta with Yang, but he doesn't want revenge or anything like that. So I assume we wouldn't necessarily be in a permanent vendetta for the rest of the game.

What's the exact effect of "I want revenge" btw?

	05-04-2005 21:15									#11
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In CMN set-ups, as far as I can deduce, the "I want revenge" simply means that he'll be an active belligerent - seeking out the other faction - rather than just passive.

I think it also has the effect of souring him towards pactmates of the other faction as well. Unless the flag is set to "till the death". then it's not unbreakable, and diplomacy, SE choices and the occasional gift can turn him around.

But I think it's worth the gamble. if it succeeds, then we've scored a huge diplomatic coup (and Yang has troops right beside the new Morgan base - he might strike before they can be mind controlled.)

And if we fail, we're no worse off (well, minus a longstrider - that's replaceable) than we were at the beginning of this 2165 turn

The result of our machinations might be that we let yang fight Morgan and the gaians, while we and the Angels sit tight and grow fat. We might be able to buy 15 or 20 turns'worth of relative peace - well, we'll still, of course, harrass Morgan from the sea and the air - to let us get the makings of a popboom unddrway (creches, etc)

	05-04-2005 21:33									#12
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Yes, I agree that it's definitely worth it to give it a shot and try to frame Morgan. We'll have to be careful to keep all that great real estate in Hiveria from falling into enemy hands, though.

	05-04-2005 22:29									#13
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Well, Morgan can't run much of an offensive campaign until they get clean reactors - or can build a punishment sphere in a mineral-rich base (unless, of course, they move off FM and Wealth - which they might do - turn Green, that is - to align more closely with the Gaians)

And now that their chokepoint has been cleared, the Gaians are going to have difficulty containing the Hive forces heading south

	06-04-2005 00:42									#14
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Can Morgan even turn Green? Or was it Power that was their aversion? Regardless, looks like the risk of losing the real estate would be smaller than I'd feared (and it is technically in enemy hands as it is).

	06-04-2005 03:14									#15
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quote: Originally posted by Kassiopeia Can Morgan even turn Green? Or was it Power that was their aversion?

It's PLANNED that they can't run

	06-04-2005 03:28									#16
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Ahh, I see, somehow I thought it'd be Green since environmentalism seems to be their bogeyman. I guess the Gaians and Morgans can work together after all

	06-04-2005 05:45									#17
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quote: Originally posted by Googlie But I think it's worth the gamble. if it succeeds, then we've scored a huge diplomatic coup (and Yang has troops right beside the new Morgan base - he might strike before they can be mind controlled.)

I agree as well. If we had fifty percent chance of provoking a vengeful eternal Vendetta (in the true meaning of the word) with Yang, I might have second doubts. Since this doesn't seem to be the case, let's risk it.

Oh yeah, some questions arose while testplaying a 2166 turn:

• What to do with the SNC Aarvak?
  
• What to do with Ymir ogre in MT?
  
• What to do with the B-4 in MT if the truce with Yang holds?
  
• If the truce with Yang holds, should we move the new MT missile artillery to the Olympian monolith for a morale boost?
  
• What to do with Tomcats RG and FB, OA2 & SC1?
  
• What will the Gaian taskforce do after whacking that remaining Gaian sea former and healing R-112? That is: SNC Pegasus, SNC Heimdall, R-112, the Jaded Jaguars, SCC Iaci, SCC Invincible?
  
• How about stealing some energy credits instead of inciting a drone while trying to frame the Corporation? Though it won't be much, I assume we have more use of say 10 credits than an extra drone in some faraway Hive base.

	06-04-2005 12:55									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Maniac [*]What to do with Ymir ogre in MT?

Sit tight or prepare to go for Morgania, depending on the Yang gamble.

quote: Originally posted by Maniac [*]What to do with the B-4 in MT if the truce with Yang holds?

Same as the Ogre.

quote: Originally posted by Maniac [*]If the truce with Yang holds, should we move the new MT missile artillery to the Olympian monolith for a morale boost?

Yes.

quote: Originally posted by Maniac [*]What to do with Tomcats RG and FB, OA2 & SC1?

Can they make useful Roads? Can they make useful Forests? Can they make useful Farms? Can they make useful Boreholes? In that order, please.

quote: Originally posted by Maniac [*]What will the Gaian taskforce do after whacking that remaining Gaian sea former and healing R-112? That is: SNC Pegasus, SNC Heimdall, R-112, the Jaded Jaguars, SCC Iaci, SCC Invincible?

Depending on the Yang gamble, it can either threaten a Gaian base or a Hivean base. And capture it, if the (diplomatic) possibility happens.

quote: Originally posted by Maniac [*]How about stealing some energy credits instead of inciting a drone while trying to frame the Corporation? Though it won't be much, I assume we have more use of say 10 credits than an extra drone in some faraway Hive base.[/list]

Good idea.

	09-04-2005 01:38									#19
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quote: Originally posted by Maniac I agree as well. If we had fifty percent chance of provoking a vengeful eternal Vendetta (in the true meaning of the word) with Yang, I might have second doubts. Since this doesn't seem to be the case, let's risk it.

quote: What to do with the SNC Aarvak?

I saw it's role as being just a ferry between Homeland and Arcadia - do we need any formers in the latter? - we could do with clearing some fungus around Fort Soup to free up those crawlers currently crawling nuts - they'd be useful rehomed to other bases for mineral crawling

quote: What to do with Ymir ogre in MT?

I'd march it over to Cratersouth, where we had started a Rec commons (no minerals, though) to anticipate fending off incipient drone riots when the pop grows - the Ogre would help immensely there and would free up a Commando Hoplite

quote: What to do with the B-4 in MT if the truce with Yang holds?

How about ferrying it in stages down to Great Refuge or Temple of Sol - it can do some ocean patrolling and perhaps pick off a gaian probefoil or Iod with a probe aboard as they try to get techs from lal

quote: If the truce with Yang holds, should we move the new MT missile artillery to the Olympian monolith for a morale boost?

yes

quote: ]What to do with Tomcats RG and FB, OA2 & SC1?

How about they comgregate on 65:19 and buyild a borehole for Sparta Command

quote: What will the Gaian taskforce do after whacking that remaining Gaian sea former and healing R-112? That is: SNC Pegasus, SNC Heimdall, R-112, the Jaded Jaguars, SCC Iaci, SCC Invincible?

See pic below - we could empty a gaoan base then infiltrate with the Disco volante (or capture the base if we anted and cede it to Yang!!

quote: How about stealing some energy credits instead of inciting a drone while trying to frame the Corporation? Though it won't be much, I assume we have more use of say 10 credits than an extra drone in some faraway Hive base

I agree - the oddds are the same too, so any little helps

	09-04-2005 01:57									#20
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Googlie, you must be one scary opponent in PBEMs. Good for us.

Great idea about that infiltration. If the peace talks fail (if they even start...), we should do that.

	09-04-2005 03:24									#21
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quote: Originally posted by Modo44 Googlie, you must be one scary opponent in PBEMs.

Actually, I'm pretty average. My CMN background keeps coming out and I want to make sure everyone has a good time, so I end up giving away lopsided tech trades.

Plus, I usually like the challemge of trying to play the Believers and the Cult as builder factions, etc.

My win/lose record is prolly around 10 wins and 75 losses - something like that

	09-04-2005 03:53									#22
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quote: Originally posted by Googlie How about ferrying it [the B-4 in MT] in stages down to Great Refuge or Temple of Sol - it can do some ocean patrolling and perhaps pick off a gaian probefoil or Iod with a probe aboard as they try to get techs from lal

A patrol sounds good.
Though IIRC that B-4 is commando, while I assume a hardened would suffice for patrol duty. So may I suggest sending a hardened B-4 to LaLaLand, and keep the commando one home for combat duty?


For the record, here are the notes I made while testplaying a 2166 turn:

Test Simulation 2166

Economy

• FS: set production to an unprototyped unit design, cash in the adjacent FL crawler, and then set production to a B-6 with the usual method.
  
• MT: if the truce survives the framing attempt, set production to a 1-2t-2 so we can resist a Hive sneak attack at a later date.
  
• Hurry 2NS production with 25 credits.
  
• Hurry IH production with 6 credits.
  
• Hurry SC2 production with 11 credits.

	09-04-2005 06:59									#23
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Went through these 1 x 1 and they all look sound to me.

quote: Move Tomcat-SCW2 in SC4 a tile NW to plant a forest there

that'll transform it from an arid 1/2/0 tile to a productive 1/3/1 tile. At some point, though, we need to remove the fungus northeast (54:18) as that'd be a 2/2/1 tile (and maybe, longer term, think about a condensor in that central crater square, although that'd need a handful of formers to be done efficiently)

quote: Tomcat-SC2 starts building a road

Preparatory to a mine on that tile. I presume?

Orders are also needed for Tomcat-SC-1 (currently finished , northwest of GH) - I suggest moving it 1 tile west, and planting a forest on Cratersouth's southeast crater tile

As an aside, I didn't know that aircraft crews also have a police ability (eg, using the simulator - in Craterwest, disband the hoplite there, leaving the Ogre and the 3 noodles.- with 3 pops, there's still no drones. Then one by one disband the aircraft, - so long as 1 is left, no drones, then when the last one goes, the angry red face appears. I didn't know that. I thought that only ground troops can quell drones - I know from playing the Pirates in a current PBEM that naval units certainly don't)

	10-04-2005 04:57									#24
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

2166 is up

Looks like the Hive have withdrawn from Minas Tirith (but a recce with that B-4 in base should elicit where they are)

Attachment: 2166-hive vamoosed.gif
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	10-04-2005 05:00									#25
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And let's not be shy in asking a decent price from the Angels for Doc Air (the Hive, btw, gets it next turn)

The Angels have over 250 credits in reserve (see below)

And re framing Morgan - we know they'll be panting next turn to steal doc air from Yang, so maybe we should hold off framing them as they'll then have carte blanche to steal it - let them incur Yang's wrath themselves by their techsteal

Attachment: 2166-angels data.gif
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	10-04-2005 05:32									#26
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Having just looked at the turn (who will play it btw?), I'd even suggest to completely call off the framing operation.

Why?
The Gaians are in a truce with Yang... I guess the Morganites (or Angels??) asked the Hive to call off their vendetta with the Gaian Union. The Hive has received three new techs this year, so it's clear what they got in return.

This means the AFAIK two goals of framing Morgan would no longer work:

1> Trying to keep DAP out of Weasel hands. Even if we'd manage to frame Morgan, they could still get it from via the Gaians.
2> Let Yang do some dirty work for us by harrassing both the Gaians and Morganites.

Besides, look at the base build list of the Hive. All hab complexes and other builder stuff, for the first time in a couple decades. Do we really want to risk disturb Yang again and throw him back into war mode, this time with a 50% risk he's solely focused on us??


Oh yeah, if the Axis of Weasels does indeed get DAP, I'd return to my previous opinion: an invasion of Terrapeso would be suicide! I'd suggest to call a peace conference with the goal of really trying to sign a peace with the Weasels (or at least the Corporation; it's not like the Gaians can harm us).

Who knows we could still succeed in conquering the Corporation, but there would be little left of them after we're finished with them: they've got only seven size 3 three bases. You have to count two pops are lost to capture a base, so that means we'd get seven extra workers out of the whole operation.

This might still make sense if we were living in the situation of ten years back: The Corporation and Sparta the only great powers, with the Angels and Gaians only as spectators. Then defeating the Corporation could have meant winning the game.

But these last ten years the Angels have been popbooming. They have the same population as the Corporation, and their power bar has grown almost as high as the Morganites as well.

If the Corporation and we keep fighting, the Angels might very well run away with the game since they can keep focusing on builder production.

Therefore I advocate peace, so we can popboom ourselves.

	10-04-2005 06:22									#27
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That Corporate ship sure has a deathwish, sailing straight through our air raid routes. Will sink it. Three other B-4s will destroy that crawler and two formers you see.

	10-04-2005 06:23									#28
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Forgot the pic.

Attachment: morganboat2166.jpg
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	10-04-2005 06:42									#29
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quote: Originally posted by Maniac ... the turn (who will play it btw?),

Why don't you go ahead since it's a weekend - I can take over when the turn falls midweek, as I gather that's not so convenient for you

quote: I'd even suggest to completely call off the framing operation.

I agree - maybe we send that longstrider down to join the Gaian Expeditionary Force

quote: Besides, look at the base build list of the Hive. All hab complexes and other builder stuff, for the first time in a couple decades. Do we really want to risk disturb Yang again and throw him back into war mode, this time with a 50% risk he's solely focused on us??

Good point - and with the Angels pop-booming, and the Gaians likely not far behind, we need to focus ourselves on consolidation and pop growth.

This game is far from over, Tassadar's opinions notwithstanding

quote: Oh yeah, if the Axis of Weasels does indeed get DAP, I'd return to my previous opinion: an invasion of Terrapeso would be suicide! I'd suggest to call a peace conference with the goal of really trying to sign a peace with the Weasels (or at least the Corporation; it's not like the Gaians can harm us).

I agree. Let's crank up the diplomacy to full volume

quote: If the Corporation and we keep fighting, the Angels might very well run away with the game since they can keep focusing on builder production. Therefore I advocate peace, so we can popboom ourselves.

I agree. We did strike a major blow in getting rid of the PTS - that maybe cost Morgan the win.

One option left to us is in warring with the PK's, and enslaving them. We need to discuss this. (and as a corollary, do we change to POLICE and try to pact with Yang? - that'd prolly provoke the PK's to declare vendetta on us of their own volition!!)

Alternatively - build creches, change to Dem and Planned, then produce colony pods like crazy as we grow (and maybe gift every third one to the Uni to get them growing too - every lab point they generate is like a super labpoint for us)

We can win by transcendence, with Zak's help

	10-04-2005 06:47									#30
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Also copied above reply to the War Council thread