25-04-2005 11:47									#31
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quote: Originally posted by deity anyone around this arvo or tonight?

I can probably play tonight if others are available

	25-04-2005 16:51									#32
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quote: Originally posted by deity Can we just have a round up on the Horse Rules... * no unit bribing? (all other groups allow it BTW)

No unit or city bribing. Regardless of what anyone else says or does, we've never allowed it. We agreed very early on that it (a) gave diplos and spies more power than they deserved; and (b) it was a too quick and easy way of building up units or cities.

quote: * no alliances but all trading including unit ceding is OK?

We've played alliances in the past, there's no reason why we can't again. In the past, it was usually decided by the number of players in the game - an odd number could leave one player isolated amongst alliances, so alliances weren't allowed in that situation.

quote: * city ceding is OK

We never had a rule either way. As you pointed out in a certain game.

quote: * anything else?

House Rule #1. Always wonder what Hydey is up to with his civ.

	25-04-2005 16:56									#33
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yeah i did always wonder about that

	26-04-2005 11:28									#34
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Hey thanks finbar! Does that mean alliances are OK in our even-numbered games?

	26-04-2005 11:36									#35
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quote: Originally posted by finbar No unit or city bribing. Regardless of what anyone else says or does, we've never allowed it. We agreed very early on that it (a) gave diplos and spies more power than they deserved; and (b) it was a too quick and easy way of building up units or cities.

Horse never allowed it, otherwise he'd just quit the game. The only way a game would continue is if we all agreed! And the very first time it hapenned (when I bribed a Horse Tri about 3 years ago) I have a quote from you finbar saying that you thought it was allowed at that point. However, as a result of subsequent debate you have formed you current view and therefoere what you say is consistent for several years now. Fair enough.

But I know Makeo, Trev and me prefer unit bribe. And all the other international games we've played have always allowed unit bribe which is also consistent with Rah Rules. I won't count Hydey yet... he usually does what the wife says..

The only two players who insist on NO unit bribe are finbar and Horse. Can you nominate any other players or groups that also play by this rule?

	26-04-2005 11:44									#36
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Diplo-guiding is also usual BTW. I assume it's OK.

	26-04-2005 12:01									#37
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diplo guiding is fine with me

alliances with the 4 players in this game doesn't make a lot of sense because finbar doesn't like to fight and I already have warfare with one player, so it would be 2 against 1 if trev or I formed an alliance with you. But I'll leave that to your sense of fair play.

Its simply incorrect to say I quit games if there is unit bribing. I don't play in them to start with.

You've played with us many times and there's never been unit bribing.

	26-04-2005 12:43									#38
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quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse You've played with us many times and there's never been unit bribing.

True. I played in many games with you and unit bribing isn't allowed because you won't play it regardless of any player vote *Takes your bat and go home* syndrome
So all of us just go along with it... even Hydey...

	26-04-2005 12:44									#39
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But I don't care too much. But I do care when players quit and waste time..

	26-04-2005 12:45									#40
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We should have just discused it in KC and then gifted the unit back if that's the decision.

	26-04-2005 12:46									#41
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BTW, we must start with the current save or I'll chuck a wobbly about losing rush buys. Trev can just give back the unit and I'll give him the gold if you can't.

	26-04-2005 12:48									#42
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Why do you like rules controversies? You seem to be trying really hard to escalate this one for reasons that escape me.

	26-04-2005 12:57									#43
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quote: Originally posted by deity Hey thanks finbar! Does that mean alliances are OK in our even-numbered games?

We've played alliances in even-numbered games before. It used to be decided in our pre-game natter. I recall the Onion Island game was an alliance game. That might even have been an odd-numbered game. I can't remember. Who else was there apart from Makeo and me -v- Deity and Hydey? Were you in that game, Horse?

	26-04-2005 12:59									#44
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quote: Originally posted by deity BTW, we must start with the current save or I'll chuck a wobbly about losing rush buys. Trev can just give back the unit and I'll give him the gold if you can't.

Trev only had to give back the unit the other night. It's all he has to do when we restart.

I'll poke my head in tonight and see who's around. I only have about another month left in this sh*thole of a country.

	26-04-2005 13:06									#45
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Hey, I might be around tonigt for a bit!

	26-04-2005 13:09									#46
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quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse Why do you like rules controversies? You seem to be trying really hard to escalate this one for reasons that escape me.

errr, clarity?

	26-04-2005 13:12									#47
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quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse diplo guiding is fine with me alliances with the 4 players in this game doesn't make a lot of sense because finbar doesn't like to fight and I already have warfare with one player, so it would be 2 against 1 if trev or I formed an alliance with you. But I'll leave that to your sense of fair play.

LOL, so no alliances because finbar is a peace-monger!

And sense of fair play is a sneak attack on Trev's civ in early games stages that nearly wipes him out! .... go figure...

	26-04-2005 13:13									#48
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And while we are talking about senses, keep ones sense of humour!

	26-04-2005 13:24									#49
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quote: Originally posted by deity And sense of fair play is a sneak attack on Trev's civ in early games stages that nearly wipes him out! .... go figure...

Er no - early in the game I put units next to both his capital and another early city in the same turn and found them both undefended but passed up the opportunity to wipe him out.

Trev repaid my kindness by building a city on land I was claiming even after I asked him nicely not to and even gently reminded him of how I'd let him live earlier in the game. It was thus clear he was going to be expansionist at my expense so I attacked him. The war is a territorial dispute.

The irony of this is you've put pike on my land to protect the very city, Rymney, which started the war.

	26-04-2005 13:25									#50
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quote: Originally posted by deity no alliances because finbar is a peace-monger!

Only by default. I couldn't be f*cked working out a battle strategy. I don't have the concentration span.

	26-04-2005 13:27									#51
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quote: Originally posted by finbar Only by default. I couldn't be f*cked working out a battle strategy. I don't have the concentration span.

So how does that make you different from the average general? Were you in charge of the Dardanelles campaign? You seem to be paraphrasing the relevant British general

	26-04-2005 14:17									#52
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OK, so we have clear rules of no city or unit bribe.

All else is OK and is down to individual judgement. Fair enough. I can live with that.

	26-04-2005 14:19									#53
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quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse The irony of this is you've put pike on my land to protect the very city, Rymney, which started the war.

I don't want Horse Heathens ransacking my best trading city...

	26-04-2005 14:29									#54
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I think given the state of Horse war-mongering it's time the world stood up for itself...

Attachment: horserules.jpg
This has been downloaded 17 time(s).

	26-04-2005 15:10									#55
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warmongering? I built most of my cities. I'm a relatively peaceful builder

I dare say the player sneaking off with the game is finbar.

So lets keep bickering eh?

	26-04-2005 16:08									#56
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quote: Originally posted by deity BTW, we must start with the current save or I'll chuck a wobbly about losing rush buys.

I have a save on my turn, would you lose rush buys if we used that?

	27-04-2005 05:08									#57
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quote: Originally posted by deity I don't want Horse Heathens ransacking my best trading city...

Priceless intelligence, ta

	27-04-2005 07:31									#58
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I knew that when I mentioned it in KC earlier on.... but thought the open rationalisation was important - to be fair

	27-04-2005 07:40									#59
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why would your trade depend so much on one city?

I was toying with the idea of leaving Rymney with trev since he wanted it so badly

	27-04-2005 09:03									#60
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quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse why would your trade depend so much on one city?

Because it's only a paddle across the channel for him and Trev's few other remaining cities are probably ringed by your troops, thus inaccessible.