21-04-2005 16:44									#1
	Should I go to the Big Cheese about this? Increase the size of your Attachments

The head of accounting department in the organisation I am working for is a real arse, but that's just a personal opinion.

The real issue is he has been obstructing my work. There is an ongoing project to switch to a new accounting system, but the bastard has been dragging his feet for months. We had put in two systems for them to test for 6 months, and there's still nothing. Not "We like System A," not "We like System B," not "They both suck." Just nothing.

This is getting to be really irritating. It would be less if he has been swamped with work, but he hasn't. He's a clock-watcher who always leave at least five minutes early. He falls asleep often during the day and he even snored a couple of times. From time to time he takes very long lunches.

To put it simply, he isn't busy at all. He even has time to chat on the phone, and even has the gall to complain about work and ask his friends if they have anything better (Of course not, if I were a friend of his I would not want to let such an incompetent fool into my comany either).

I am very tempted to suggest to the Big Boss that they need a new accountant, somebody who actually does his (or her) job.

What do you think?

	21-04-2005 16:47									#2
	Increase the size of your Attachments

First make sure there isn't another reason that he's goofing off.

	21-04-2005 17:01									#3
	Re: Should I go to the Big Cheese about this? Suffering from ads?

quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger This is getting to be really irritating. It would be less if he has been swamped with work, but he hasn't. He's a clock-watcher who always leave at least five minutes early. He falls asleep often during the day and he even snored a couple of times. From time to time he takes very long lunches.

Hey UR, I didn't know you worked with me

	21-04-2005 17:15									#4
	Re: Should I go to the Big Cheese about this? Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger The head of accounting department in the organisation I am working for is a real arse, but that's just a personal opinion. The real issue is he has been obstructing my work. There is an ongoing project to switch to a new accounting system, but the bastard has been dragging his feet for months. We had put in two systems for them to test for 6 months, and there's still nothing. Not "We like System A," not "We like System B," not "They both suck." Just nothing. This is getting to be really irritating. It would be less if he has been swamped with work, but he hasn't. He's a clock-watcher who always leave at least five minutes early. He falls asleep often during the day and he even snored a couple of times. From time to time he takes very long lunches. To put it simply, he isn't busy at all. He even has time to chat on the phone, and even has the gall to complain about work and ask his friends if they have anything better (Of course not, if I were a friend of his I would not want to let such an incompetent fool into my comany either). I am very tempted to suggest to the Big Boss that they need a new accountant, somebody who actually does his (or her) job. What do you think?

You get them everywhere don't you? It's a real pain when you get someone like this in a position where they become a bottleneck. I know it's not generally deemed as 'fair sport' but I'd see the big cheese...you don't necessarily have to directly implicate him because if the big cheese is doing his job properly too, he's probably been suspecting this to be a problem for a while too...

	21-04-2005 17:17									#5
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Isn't this what accountants are supposed to do?

	21-04-2005 17:50									#6
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Is he your direct supervisor?

	21-04-2005 17:56									#7
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

The problem results from the fact that the switch to a new accounting system was not requested by the accountant; he is therefore not motivated to support the change. As any accountant he cannot be forced to accept a new system when the old is working satisfactorily. The only thing to do is to find some improvements resulting from the switch which would make things better for him. If there are no such improvements, or worse, if the new system make things more difficult for him, there is no chance to solve the problem.

	21-04-2005 18:10									#8
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i assume from your description that you dont report directly to this guy, but need him for cooperation on your project, and that he is seriously endangering it. If so, I think you really need to consider going to the big boss ASAP. The alternative is having the project get into deep trouble, and big boss coming down on you and asking why, and when you blame the accountant, big boss will ask why you didnt come to him sooner. Something like this happened to me once - someone who was my peer in title and compensation, but was subordinate to me on a project, was sabotaging the project. I was new and didnt want to make a big stink - but when problems arose, I was told by big boss, "you should have come to me sooner, I would have backed you up".

Note - you do NOT need to go into all the things that accountant does wrong, but focus on the fact that his non-responsiveness has impeded YOUR project. Its up to big boss to decide if he wants to probe the accountants work habits or not.

	21-04-2005 18:24									#9
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A better idea... Set up a meeting with the the accountant, the big boss, yourself and anybody else involved in the process.

List as the objective of the meeting... "Accounting departments evaluation between the two new Software systems" Set the meeting for about a week in the future so he can't whine that he doesn't have enough time...

This puts him on the spot... no longer will he just be blowing you off... He will be in the "range finder" of the Big Boss as well. He will have no choice but to have a real opinion... and if in the meeting, he tries to ride the fence... blast away with tough questions in front of the big boss...

Problem solved...
However, you will have made a political enemy for life... but by the sounds of the things, no great loss.

	21-04-2005 18:33									#10
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

When you work with Ming you just feel the



Btw, that's the best idea yet. Just call a meeting and force the issue. No fuss, no muss.

	21-04-2005 19:08									#11
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Ming - wow what a terrific advice!

	21-04-2005 19:08									#12
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UR,

How important is this change to you personally? Do you just not like the fact that this guy isn't making the change or is it affecting your job. Because, as Ming said, you could end up making an enemy, and you generally don't want to make enemies in the work place.

	21-04-2005 19:31									#13
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quote: Originally posted by Ming However, you will have made a political enemy for life... but by the sounds of the things, no great loss.

Unless he's UR's direct supervisor.

	21-04-2005 20:11									#14
	Got spare money?

He's an accountant. UR's a programmer.

	21-04-2005 20:16									#15
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I think it's a bad idea to piss people off even if you don't work for them. Who knows this guy could eventually be URs boss or UR might have to work more closely with him in the future. I say don't make waves.

	21-04-2005 20:19									#16
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Why does UR care about this? Does it make more work for him or does it just annoy him?

I say let sleeping dogs lie.

	21-04-2005 20:21									#17
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Who knows what relationships the org chart implies. I have seen enineering departments report to the CFO.

	21-04-2005 20:22									#18
	Inflate your Upload Space

He's probably just lazy, in which case UR will not make an enemy for life, if UR sets the meeting sufficiently far ahead that he can scramble to get his opinions in order. UR can even send him a note asking whether UR can help in any way by answering questions or whatnot to bring the choice to a conclusion and look good in front of the Big Cheese.

All good politics.

Last edited by DanS on 21-04-2005 at 20:29

	21-04-2005 20:24									#19
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

I'm with Ming, modified by DanS. Put the meeting two or more weeks into the future, so the guy has sufficient time to learn the two systems and make a recommendation. He'll be annoyed, but not hating.

	21-04-2005 20:25									#20
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If Big Cheese is really concerned about this change why isn't he pushing for it and making sure that it happens. I say let it go.

	21-04-2005 21:16									#21
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Before inviting for the meeting, UR should check that the Big Boss is not already aware of the problem. Or that the accountant has not made some creative accounting that had made the Boss really happy!

	21-04-2005 21:23									#22
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Ming's experience, and general w00tliness in terms of work advice, have got me on side.
To be honest, all other possible resolutions seem quite poor against that.

[/suck]

	22-04-2005 01:04									#23
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by DanS He's probably just lazy, in which case UR will not make an enemy for life, if UR sets the meeting sufficiently far ahead that he can scramble to get his opinions in order. UR can even send him a note asking whether UR can help in any way by answering questions or whatnot to bring the choice to a conclusion and look good in front of the Big Cheese. All good politics.

Nice additions... and far more politically correct...
However, if the guy is a complete jerk, and not part of my direct report chain... I'd put him on the spot

	22-04-2005 01:05									#24
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And the real lesson here is:




DO NOT CROSS MING

	22-04-2005 03:14									#25
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Failing that, bludgeon him and feed him to hungry pigs...

	22-04-2005 06:12									#26
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He sounds like a typical Chinese white collar to me.

Highly averse to intiative or making decisions, and for good reason: if something goes wrong later, the Big Boss will hang him out to dry in order to preserve his own face.

Ming's advice is great, however in Chinese culture that "making an enemy for life" part is much more serious than in western office politics. If you cause a Chinese co-worker to loose face in front of a superior, you may well be facing someone who will toil tirelessly and relentlessly behind the scenes for YEARS to undermine your work or reputation, all the while waiting for just the right moment when he has a chance to sink a knife deep into your back.

Occasionally this metaphor crosses into reality, although I believe in Hong Kong meat cleavers are favored over knives ...

Good luck with this slacker, UR!

	22-04-2005 07:55									#27
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Thanks all

SpencerH,

No, he's not my superior. Although he sometimes acts like he is.


Davout,

The problem is the old computerised accounting system is old. It runs on a vanilla Wintel computer with no backup. It is probably around for a few years and can go at any time. If it goes it goes and at least 6 month of data will be lost. I don't think I should be responsible for it, but I am certain that I will be caught in the blast nevertheless.


Japher,

It's part of a bigger project under me, and it can't finish until we move to a new accounting system.

	22-04-2005 08:27									#28
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stand on a ledge and say you won't come down until a choice is made on the software - either that or you'll jump.

	22-04-2005 08:30									#29
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quote: It's part of a bigger project under me, and it can't finish until we move to a new accounting system.

In that case, go to the account and demand a decission. Give a timeline, if he don't meet it, go the head cheese.

The last thing you need is your rep to be based off that lazy bastard.

	22-04-2005 08:54									#30
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Be careful, he may know all about the big cheese's dirty laundery......like the second set of books they drag out for the IRS every year. He may even know about the little accounts in the Cayman Islands, or was it Panama? In short, maybe he goofs off because the big chees has good reason to let him stay.