Apolyton Archive  |  Preserved copy of the Apolyton Civilization Site and its forums as they stood in September 2005. Read-only; nothing here can be posted to or replied to.  |  Forum index |  About this archive |  The 1998–2001 UBB forums
Today on Apolyton WARDELL INTERVIEW PROMO A.C.S. HISTORY CHAPTER 4 GET CIV4 /w FREE PLUS! A.C.S. PHOTO GALLERY GET A.O.M. V1.1
Apolyton Civilization Forums
main| civ2| civ3| civ4| smac| ctp2| ron| moo3| galciv| galciv2| alt| about|
ApolytonPLUS | register | search | faq | new posts | pm (-/-) | upload | members
hall of fame new! | civgroups | civgroups news | interviews | the column | radio | chat | directory | news | store | PLUS
Apolyton Civilization Forums : Powered by vBulletin version 2.0.3 Apolyton Civilization Forums > Miscellaneous > Off-Topic > Americans uninspired by UK poll (BBC)
Show a Printable Version | Email This Page to Someone! | Receive updates to this thread | Report this to Apolyton news!
20.Sep: FOURTH CHAPTER IN `HISTORY OF...` PUBLISHED
13.Sep: NEWS ON THE FLY
06.Sep: APOLYTON DONATES TO HURRICANE RELIEF

bottom of page
   - CIVILIZATION 3 $9.99 - CIVILIZATION 2 from $6.95 - CIVILIZATION 2 from $4.25 - ALPHA CENTAURI + ALIEN CROSSFIRE (laptop collection) from $19.99 - ALPHA CENTAURI PC $9.99 -->
Author
Thread   
Pages (2): [ 1   2   ]
< Last Thread     Next Thread > Post New Thread     Post A Reply
Riesstiu IV is offline Riesstiu IV
Settler

Nov 2003
time: 05:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 04:04
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#1 Report this post to a moderator
Americans uninspired by UK poll (BBC) Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_polit...age/4487253.stm

quote:

American coverage of the British campaign has been less than wall to wall.

The UK election has been mentioned on most US news outlets but even though Tony Blair is well known in America, there is little in the way of day to day election news from Britain.

Mr Blair has crashed down to earth, according to a reporter for the NBC television network, but the correspondent added that the opposition conservatives were in a ditch.

That is the conclusion being drawn by almost all American coverage of the British election - that Mr Blair will win, but that Britain is no longer enthusiastic about its leader.

'Unimpressed'

The well-connected and left-leaning columnist Joe Klein said Mr Blair was staggering to the finish line, unloved and untrusted, after a volatile campaign.
The Washington Post talks of Iraq as an issue which has dogged Mr Blair from the start of the campaign.

"The divisive war has taken chunks from Blair's popularity." the paper says.

"Accused of deliberately hyping the threat posed by Saddam Hussein to justify the invasion, Blair's credibility and trust ratings plummeted."

But most American commentators have been unimpressed by the alternatives to Mr Blair.

Contrast in coverage

The Los Angeles Times has written of a ramshackle Conservative Party opposition that seldom goes through a week without shooting itself in the political foot.

Most news outlets here have covered the election in some form or other but generally with one piece of reporting intended to suffice for the whole campaign.

Most Americans have heard of Tony Blair and are mildly interested in his fate - but only mildly.

The contrast between British coverage of the American electoral process and American coverage of the British is marked and reflects the fact that Britons care about America more than Americans care about Britain.

One aspect of the British process which is commented on regularly and positively though is the short length of the campaign.

The Leader of the Free World is chosen after a battle that lasts the best part of two years. His British sidekick is picked after just a month.

That fact, if no other, impresses American observers.

Spiffor is offline Spiffor
Emperor
CPA - Evil Clone brigade
Nov 2001
time: 06:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 04:35
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#2 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

I wonder if there'll be more interest from the US for the next French presidential election?

Actually, if Chirac runs as well as his right-wing rival, I expect the American coverage to be much higher than usual

Whoha is offline Whoha
King
The TOC is supposed to be classified guys...
Dec 2001
time: 23:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 04:35
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#3 Report this post to a moderator
Enter the AD-FREE zone

I'm paying attention to this, It will be interesting to see what the Tories can win. Also I watch the House of commons whenever its on C-SPAN, people yelling at each other

Qilue is offline Qilue
King
Australia
Dec 1999
time: 15:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 04:47
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#4 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote:

One aspect of the British process which is commented on regularly and positively though is the short length of the campaign.

The Leader of the Free World is chosen after a battle that lasts the best part of two years. His British sidekick is picked after just a month.

That fact, if no other, impresses American observers.


Can someone explain this? Specifically the short election campaign part.

DRoseDARs is offline DRoseDARs

Prince
"My god, it's full of peas..."
Jul 2002
time: 21:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 04:50
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#5 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Britain has elections?!



Starchild is offline Starchild
Emperor
a raving alcoholic drama queen with a penchant for the biosciences
Jan 1970
time: 00:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 04:51
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#6 Report this post to a moderator
Put an end to popups!

The Prime Minister goes to the Queen, asks her to dissolve Parliament. She consents and all the MP's go back to their constinuencies to campaign. Six weeks later, everyone votes, the re-elected or newly elected MP's meet and form a new Parliament and the majority party forms a Government.

It's short cause A) the potential Prime Minsters are already known (ie, party leaders) and B) the entire executive-legislative branch of government ceases to exist. We really can't drag that situation out over two years.

Riesstiu IV is offline Riesstiu IV
Settler

Nov 2003
time: 05:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 04:52
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#7 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote:
Originally posted by DRoseDARs
Britain has elections?!





No, the Queen appoints the Prime Minister. Only white males who own property are eligible to vote for members of the House of Commons.

el freako is offline el freako
Prince
Bristol, European Union
Oct 1999
time: 05:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 04:57
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#8 Report this post to a moderator
Inflate your Upload Space

quote:
Originally posted by Qilue
Can someone explain this? Specifically the short election campaign part.


A British Parliament lasts for a maximum of 5 years, but elections can be called at any time before that.

It is very unusual for a government to go the full 5-year term and usually an election is called after around 4 years - governments who go a full term are usually seen as being unwilling to put themselves to the test of the electorate and usually lose.
When the election is called there is a period of 6 weeks of campaigning until the election itself.

Obviously this leads to a more 'compressed' campaign - however electioneering can leak outside of the 6 week period if it is widely suspected that an election will be called soon (as is usually the case).

DRoseDARs is offline DRoseDARs

Prince
"My god, it's full of peas..."
Jul 2002
time: 21:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 04:58
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#9 Report this post to a moderator
Suffering from ads?

Do ya'll happen to have oil? Are you longing for democracy? Has the Royal Family finally gotten on your last nerve?

Is it time for a regime change?

Qilue is offline Qilue
King
Australia
Dec 1999
time: 15:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 05:03
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#10 Report this post to a moderator
Full PM-box? Change here!

Not quite what I was asking. For the record, here in Australia, our system of government is almost identical to Britian, so there wasn't really a need to explain that part.

I meant, why does a short election campaign impress american voters as opposed to their ~2 year version?

Riesstiu IV is offline Riesstiu IV
Settler

Nov 2003
time: 05:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 05:05
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#11 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote:
Originally posted by DRoseDARs
Do ya'll happen to have oil? Are you longing for democracy? Has the Royal Family finally gotten on your last nerve?

Is it time for a regime change?


This sounds like an advert for a drug to help cure depression.

Winston is offline Winston
King
Danmark
Mar 1999
time: 06:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 05:19
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#12 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Ha! We only needed 3 weeks. And we even had 11 parties to choose from, or was it 10.

An election campaign should be like a toddlers shirt, short and dirty.

Traianvs is offline Traianvs
Prince
Belgium, land of plenty (corruption)
Jan 2000
time: 06:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 05:22
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#13 Report this post to a moderator
Increase the size of your Attachments

Hah, no wonder they're not happy with Blair. The British political system suckz ballz. Either you choose conservative mothballs, or that slimeball Blair. So much for democracy

Ming is offline Ming
Chief Minion

Donate to the Red Cross
Mingapulco - CST
Jan 1970
time: 23:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 05:38 Visit Ming<br><img src=/forums/images/staff-icon.gif>'s homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#14 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote:
Originally posted by Trajanus
Hah, no wonder they're not happy with Blair. The British political system suckz ballz. Either you choose conservative mothballs, or that slimeball Blair. So much for democracy


The American people had a similar uninspiring choice in our last election

Immortal Wombat is offline Immortal Wombat
Prince
in perpetuity
Dec 2000
time: 05:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 05:39 Visit Immortal Wombat's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#15 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Democracy sucks anyway. It assumes that the majority of the population aren't stupid.

Asher is offline Asher
King
Calgary, Alberta
Nov 1999
time: 22:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 05:43 Visit Asher's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#16 Report this post to a moderator
Put an end to popups!

Who cares who the UK elects. I don't even care who Canada elects anymore.

notyoueither is offline notyoueither
Deity
of naught
Aug 2001
time: 22:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 06:36
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#17 Report this post to a moderator
Got spare money?

quote:
Originally posted by Qilue
I meant, why does a short election campaign impress american voters as opposed to their ~2 year version?


Wouldn't you get tired of the two year long mud-fests where good people are chewed up and spit out?

Two years of crap about various people, two years off, two years of crap about various people, two years off...

The American presidential selection system is more akin to a slaughterhouse than a process of rational decision making about who should lead.

Oncle Boris is offline Oncle Boris
Prince
Once in a brown moon
Aug 2001
time: 00:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 07:42
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#18 Report this post to a moderator
Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote:
Originally posted by Immortal Wombat
Democracy sucks anyway. It assumes that the majority of the population aren't stupid.


Authoritarianism sucks. It assumes that any single person has a higher chance of being smart rather than being stupid.

chegitz guevara is offline chegitz guevara
King
Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 19:50 Visit chegitz guevara's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#19 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

What can the Tories do? Hasn't Labor replaced the Tories as Britain's conservative party?

MikeH is offline MikeH
Emperor
Ming on rakastajani
May 1999
time: 05:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 20:06 Visit MikeH's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#20 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

The UK is also uninspired by the UK election.

The tories are still a bit further to the right economically but there's not much to pick between them really.

Shi Huangdi is offline Shi Huangdi
Emperor
Pittsburgh, PA
Apr 1999
time: 00:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 20:08
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#21 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Well, Labour isn't as far left as it used to be, but the Tories aren't as conservative as they used to be either it seems. This campaign they seem to have focused on running the government more efficently, but have offered little in the way of stark ideological differences or any indication they would challenge the size of government in any significant way. The result has seem to be that the Tories haven't inspired anybody.

St Leo is offline St Leo
King of Scenario League
Member of the Apolyton Social Democratic Party
Jul 2005
time: 00:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 20:17 Visit St Leo<br><img src=/forums/images/staff-icon.gif>'s homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#22 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote:
Originally posted by Immortal Wombat
Democracy sucks anyway. It assumes that the majority of the population aren't stupid.


And, as long as the majority isn't stupid in the same way, it works, because the intelligent option will have the plurality over the many stupid options.

Odin is offline Odin
Prince
Biology Nerd at Minnesota State University Moorhead
Sep 2000
time: 23:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 20:21
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#23 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

I find it funny that the Labour Party started out as a socialist bunch, but have become no better than the US Democrats.

MikeH is offline MikeH
Emperor
Ming on rakastajani
May 1999
time: 05:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 20:22 Visit MikeH's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#24 Report this post to a moderator
Increase Your PM Length

None of the parties have really.

The Tories could have two possible issues that people care about that could really show them as an alternative to labour.

1. Europe. Problem is the Conservatives are quite heavily split internally on Europe. They can't start using a more anti-European stance because historically it's nearly torn the party apart and no-one wants to elect a party torn by infighting.

2. Iraq. Unfortunately Howard always has, and still does (he said the other day) support the Iraq war, so all they have to play with is the "were we told the truth?" angle but then they say they'd have gone in anyway so...

People still don't trust Howard from when he was home secretary, etc. Check out his profile:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_polit...ics/4357809.stm

Oerdin is offline Oerdin
King
of Internet Music.
Sep 2001
time: 21:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 20:26
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#25 Report this post to a moderator
Got spare money?

The UK elections are on the BBC news each night on PBS.

Shi Huangdi is offline Shi Huangdi
Emperor
Pittsburgh, PA
Apr 1999
time: 00:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 20:32
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#26 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Hmm this is interesting, according to the most recent poll, the Tories have closed the gap with Labour to two points. This could get interesting after all.

Last edited by Shi Huangdi on 27-04-2005 at 21:14

MikeH is offline MikeH
Emperor
Ming on rakastajani
May 1999
time: 05:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 20:39 Visit MikeH's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#27 Report this post to a moderator
Remove this text

Not really... the way the election boundaries are even if the Tories equal the labour vote they won't win. Labour has more of the smaller population constituencies.

The constituency boundary reviews (which have to be done from time to time as populations move around) are under way and will address that in time but not for this election. Plus it depends which constituencies are Labour vs Conservatives, which are Labour vs Lib Dem, which are Conservative vs Lib dem and vice versa.

Play with the figures here:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/vote...tml/default.stm

The conservatives need to be a few percentage points ahead in the national vote to win.

Shi Huangdi is offline Shi Huangdi
Emperor
Pittsburgh, PA
Apr 1999
time: 00:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 21:25
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#28 Report this post to a moderator
Got spare money?

Well, right now the polls are at:

LAB 36
CON 34
LD 23
OTH 7

I had read previously, though I am not sure if this is correct, that the Tories usually do 2-3 points better then the polls suggest. So if that effect were to hold true again, and the in the last of week campaigning the Tories managed to swing 3% of voters over to there side(or blair was hit with some last minute scandal), we get

CON 40
LAB 30
LD 23
OTH 7

Which would lead to a Conservative overall majority of 2. Unlikely, but there should be some outside chance of it.

Of course, even if the polls remain as they are, but the Tories still did 3 points better then the polls predicted, getting us

CON 37
LAB 34
LD 23
OTH 7

We would get a hung parliament, albeit with Labour as the largest party.

And of course, even if Labour managed to hold on to it's overall majority, I imagine it would still look bad for Blair if his party did not receive the most votes.

Dauphin is offline Dauphin
Emperor
Caught in a tuna net
Jan 1970
time: 05:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 21:36
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#29 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

A hung parliament would be great! It won't happen though.

Provost Harrison is offline Provost Harrison
Emperor
The farce is strong with this one.
Feb 2000
time: 05:35
  Old Post 27-04-2005 22:01
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#30 Report this post to a moderator
Enter the AD-FREE zone

I still think it could potentially happen though...perhaps I should try and get Bexleyheath and Crayford Conservative after all

 
Pages (2): [ 1   2   ]
< Last Thread     Next Thread > Post New Thread     Post A Reply
All times are GMT. The time now is 05:35.
Apolyton Time is 00:35.
    top of page
Rate This Thread:
Forum Jump:
Forum Rules:
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is ON
vB code is ON
Smilies are ON
[IMG] code is ON
 




Contact Us - Apolyton Civilization Site - Support Us!

Building a better Apolyton through better information. Click here and take our poll!
Non-US visitors, click here!

Powered by: vBulletin Version 2.0.3
Copyright ©2000, 2001, Jelsoft Enterprises Limited.

Page generated in 0.0628 seconds (92.25% PHP - 7.75% MySQL) with 30 queries
Page Loading Time:

Support Apolyton: Amazon USA | Amazon UK | Amazon DE | Amazon FR |
Support Apolyton and get FREE PLUS, Buy from Chips&Bits: Galactic Civilizations | Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition | Call to Power 2 | Civilization: The Boardgame | GURPS/ Alpha Centauri | Alpha Centauri | Civilization IV | Civilization III: Complete |


Front Page | Civilization IV | Civilization III | Civilization II | Call to Power II | Alpha Centauri | Master of Orion III
Rise of Nations | Galactic Civilizations | Galactic Civilizations II | Misc
Alt.Civs | Civ I | C:CtP I | About | News | Directory | Apolyton Store | Forums | Chat | Columns | Interviews | Newsletter
Scenario League | CSC | Clash of Civs | Spanish Site | CtP Maps | Cradle of Civ | WesW's Ctp1/2 Site | Civ3 Haven

apolyton.net | apolyton.com | civilization2.net | civilization3.net | civilization4.net | civilizationiv.info | calltopower.net | galciv.net | galciv2.net | moo3.net