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DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
Emperor
AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
time: 23:20
  Old Post 15-05-2005 02:27
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It's well past time for Americans to destroy this degenerate game.

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

Deity
The Potterverse
Jan 1970
time: 00:20
  Old Post 15-05-2005 02:46
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I think the 'degenerate' game will destroy us first

DanS is offline DanS
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Kickball Capital of the World
Jan 1970
time: 00:20
  Old Post 16-05-2005 07:46 Visit DanS's homepage!
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How much does admission cost for a Man U match?

JohnT is offline JohnT

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Capitalist
Mar 1999
time: 00:20
  Old Post 16-05-2005 17:50
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So... did this guy succeed?

C0ckney is offline C0ckney
Prince
Big Up The Macedonian Massive
Apr 2000
time: 05:20
  Old Post 16-05-2005 19:16
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yeah he's got the 75%, he can take it into private ownership and put his debts on the club.

i wonder if he's prepared for the backlash from the fans though, americans don't get the idea of community sport and i reckon he'll be surprised at how hostile people are.

DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
Emperor
AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
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  Old Post 16-05-2005 19:18
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Because they don't like the idea of a yank taking over?

C0ckney is offline C0ckney
Prince
Big Up The Macedonian Massive
Apr 2000
time: 05:20
  Old Post 16-05-2005 19:21
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Got spare money?

it's more to do with the fact that he is interested in making money first, with football a very distant second (if at all).

Spiffor is offline Spiffor
Emperor
CPA - Evil Clone brigade
Nov 2001
time: 06:20
  Old Post 16-05-2005 19:23
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quote:
Originally posted by C0ckney
it's more to do with the fact that he is interested in making money first, with football a very distant second (if at all).

That's a corporate investor for you

DanS is offline DanS
Emperor
Kickball Capital of the World
Jan 1970
time: 00:20
  Old Post 16-05-2005 19:27 Visit DanS's homepage!
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If they don't win, his business case doesn't make sense. I think the interests of the fans and Glazer are largely in sync.

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

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The Potterverse
Jan 1970
time: 00:20
  Old Post 16-05-2005 23:27
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But Glazier doesn't get it. Hardly anyone makes money in soccer except the players. Owners get involved because they love the game and are prepared to take losses for their favorite club.

Especially with Chelsea's team, ManU would have been forced to spend profits in order to upgrade the team. With the interest payments and loan payments, ManU cannot do that.

DanS is offline DanS
Emperor
Kickball Capital of the World
Jan 1970
time: 00:20
  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:13 Visit DanS's homepage!
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You're assuming that ManU can't drive its top line (i.e., sales). That's a horrible assumption.

Krill is offline Krill
Emperor
On a cold wet rock, in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean.
Dec 2003
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  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:17
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you can't sell merchandise if the fans a boycotting the club.

Of course, the majority of sales are going to be to overseas fans, but ManU has (or rather, had) the advatage that it takes about a million pounds more than any competitor for every home game, because it has a larger stadium, and there were always 67,000+ fans in the stadium. If too many fans stay away, the club would lose profits from that alone.

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

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The Potterverse
Jan 1970
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  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:18
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No, it isn't. I wonder why people think Peter Kenyon and his ilk didn't try to push sales. They tried just about everything they could to milk money out of the team without totally pissing off the fans (such as selling naming rights to the stadium).

The whole notion strikes me as odd.

Though it will be nice to see ManU stagnate while Chelsea goes on a run.

Dauphin is offline Dauphin
Emperor
Caught in a tuna net
Jan 1970
time: 05:20
  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:21
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quote:
Originally posted by Krill
you can't sell merchandise if the fans a boycotting the club.

Of course, the majority of sales are going to be to overseas fans,


The overwhelming majority of MU's turnover is currently UK based. May be interesting to see if that changes.

Krill is offline Krill
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Dec 2003
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  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:23
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quote:
The overwhelming majority of MU turnover is currently UK based. May be interesting to see if that changes.


Depends on if Glazier manages to exploit the USA.

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

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  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:25
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The US isn't that big on for soccer. Not yet and not within the next 20 years. If that's his plan, it'll fail, badly.

Krill is offline Krill
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Dec 2003
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  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:27
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That is why I said it "depends on if", and not "When"...

Agathon is offline Agathon
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Dec 2002
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  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:28
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Great. I love it when Manure "fans" get pissed off. Hee Hee.

Dauphin is offline Dauphin
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Caught in a tuna net
Jan 1970
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  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:28
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He's got better chances renegotiating the currently pooled broadcast rights, which is where the Premiership gets some 40-50% of its revenues.

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

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  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:29
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I don't know how well that'll work either. If he gets his own channel for ManU games, it'll really do a number on the Premier League.

Krill is offline Krill
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On a cold wet rock, in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean.
Dec 2003
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  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:30
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Suffering from ads?

I thought they were tied down under contract until the 2007-2008 season?

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

Deity
The Potterverse
Jan 1970
time: 00:20
  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:30
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He may take the current broadcast rights to the European Court of Justice as a restraint on trade.

alva is offline alva
Emperor
Republic of Flanders
Sep 2001
time: 06:20
  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:31
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Tired of ads?

And expect him to start pushing for no relegations.

(No, I don't think Manure is in that deep ****. )

Krill is offline Krill
Emperor
On a cold wet rock, in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean.
Dec 2003
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  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:35
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quote:
He may take the current broadcast rights to the European Court of Justice as a restraint on trade.


How does that work?

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

Deity
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  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:36
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Well, I've only heard rumors, but the argument is that it is a restriction on competition to have all the teams under one TV deal. And he'd take that complaint to the ECJ.

DanS is offline DanS
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Kickball Capital of the World
Jan 1970
time: 00:20
  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:39 Visit DanS's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
No, it isn't. I wonder why people think Peter Kenyon and his ilk didn't try to push sales. They tried just about everything they could to milk money out of the team without totally pissing off the fans (such as selling naming rights to the stadium).

The whole notion strikes me as odd.


The economics of the NFL have changed dramatically over the last decade and Glazer was a part of that. I don't know why you think there is no potential innovation at ManU just because others haven't imagined a change yet.

In many respects, the economics of MLB has changed dramatically as well, considering Japanese broadcast rights, etc. The point being that new and better mouse traps are built all the time.

Last edited by DanS on 17-05-2005 at 00:48

Krill is offline Krill
Emperor
On a cold wet rock, in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean.
Dec 2003
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  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:40
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quote:
Well, I've only heard rumors, but the argument is that it is a restriction on competition to have all the teams under one TV deal. And he'd take that complaint to the ECJ.



I can see the point. I don't agree with it, but I can see it...

One problem that i do see, however, is that it should take a while, no? About one year, at the very minimum? Could the court case take so long that the current contract runs out before the case is solved?

JohnT is offline JohnT

Emperor
Capitalist
Mar 1999
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  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:43
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quote:
Well, I've only heard rumors, but the argument is that it is a restriction on competition to have all the teams under one TV deal. And he'd take that complaint to the ECJ.


And if he expects to get a fair, non pre-judged hearing...

DanS is offline DanS
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Kickball Capital of the World
Jan 1970
time: 00:20
  Old Post 17-05-2005 00:52 Visit DanS's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by Dauphin


The overwhelming majority of MU's turnover is currently UK based. May be interesting to see if that changes.


That seems to be the key.

Locutus is offline Locutus
ACS CTP1/2 Manager & Civ4 Co-Manager
Hengelo, The Netherlands
Nov 1999
time: 06:20
  Old Post 17-05-2005 01:10 Visit Locutus<br><img src=/forums/images/staff-icon.gif>'s homepage!
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Relying on sales for profit, especially abroad sales, is a very short-term strategy. If a team like ManU doesn't invest millions of pounds every season in player purchases, they'll soon fall behind on other teams such as Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool. And nothing hurts abroad sales more than not any major winning prizes for a few seasons in a row.

The only way to keep a club like ManU successful in the long run is if the investors (i.e. now Glazer) are willing to reinvest the profits they make and keep only a small margin for themselves. Somehow I doubt that's a strategy Glazer is going to follow...

Look at Barcelona. They were immensely popular across the world in the 1990s, but after a few very mediocre seasons in the last few years many people outside Spain have started to regard it as a 2nd class team and other clubs such as Real, Valencia and Deportivo have gotten much more popular at its expense.

Fortunately for them, Barca can always count on an exceptionally devoted home crowd and an owner and board of directors that care at least as much about the well-being of the club as about making money, so they're now making a strong recovery -- after having almost completely replaced the ENTIRE selection of players in about 2 years time. That was not a very profitable operation, I assure you... I very much doubt Glazer would be willing/able to make the same investment for ManU if it ever becomes necessary.

Last edited by Locutus on 17-05-2005 at 01:15

 
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