19-05-2005 08:48									#1
	SMAC(X) style government for CivIV! Tired of ads?

I know there's a seperate forum for CivIV but I just had to point out, in case anyone missed it that Firaxis have finally brought what IMHO was the most important innovation in SMAC(X), the SE choices, into the main Civ franchise! See http://pc.ign.com/articles/614/614551p2.html for details.

Now if only they were bringing in designed units and truly unique factions we might not need a SMAC II.....

	19-05-2005 12:04									#2
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If only they're moddable.

If they are I'd propose to keep the existing ones plus add some from Aldebaran mod (as we need to fill those 25 spaces and we only have 16 SE in SMACX). Things like Propaganda: Intolerance | Paranoia | Unity really made sense.

	19-05-2005 14:38									#3
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Hey!

I just remembered something.
I don't remind Civ3 having crawler concept.

If Civ4 hasn't got It I won't participate in modding if it ever happens.
Takes away just too much from game..

	19-05-2005 16:31									#4
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You saying modders can't make a crawler? :P

	19-05-2005 16:33									#5
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quote: You saying modders can't make a crawler?

You saying you can?

I can't.
If in SMACX there was no "supply crawler" weapon noone could.

Crawler concept is something more than just another weapon. It has a slightly different behaviour. If in the code of game there's no such entity you're unable to make it by modding.

	19-05-2005 18:10									#6
	Re: SMAC(X) style government for CivIV! Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by Bogdanovist I know there's a seperate forum for CivIV but I just had to point out, in case anyone missed it that Firaxis have finally brought what IMHO was the most important innovation in SMAC(X), the SE choices, into the main Civ franchise! See http://pc.ign.com/articles/614/614551p2.html for details. Now if only they were bringing in designed units and truly unique factions we might not need a SMAC II.....

Why is it that all these Settlers like slappy and Bogdanovist are the ones who keep digging up these little nuggets related to SMAC(X)? Is it that our community just doesn't bother to venture beyond our own forums?

Anyways, thanx for the heads-up Bogdanovist. From my perspective why I am taking a wait-and-see attitude towards Civ4. A lot of what I heard sounds great, however as far as I can tell no one (including the Firaxian Trip's comments in another thread in this forum) has gotten into the meat of the matter and actually detailed the "what can" and "what can't" be done in Civ4. As time progresses I'm sure more details will be penciled in (especially after beta-testers start providing feedback), and we will see how important the SE settings are in Civ4, and whether this makes it more appealing to SMAC(X) players or not.


D

	19-05-2005 18:13									#7
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quote: Is it that our community just doesn't bother to venture beyond our own forums?

The case with me.

But Im already considering joining Civ4 pre-release discussions.

It could actually be the first game I pay for..errr.. I hope FBI is not listening..

	19-05-2005 18:26									#8
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I used to go to the Civ4 forum.
No one liked my ideas, so I left.
I have a big problem with Naval combat in every civ style game.
Naval combat and movement needs to be abstracted so that the sea isn't made up of hexes, but is rather made up of zones. A ship might have a movement of 3, which would allow it to move three zones, or move 2 zones, patrol in the last (1 movement for standard patrolling, 2 for active). Ships might move through a zone using a movement point to evade patrolling ships.
Further, these zones could increase in size as improvements in navigation technology are realized.

	19-05-2005 20:15									#9
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quote: Originally posted by binTravkin But Im already considering joining Civ4 pre-release discussions.

If you do join these discussions, let me know what you think/ find out.

I really like some of the ideas that are being percolated around right now about Civ4, however currently I don't have the time to continually dig around the various forums to keep myself updated on everything thats going on/ being found out....


D

	19-05-2005 22:58									#10
	Re: Re: SMAC(X) style government for CivIV! Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Darsnan Why is it that all these Settlers like slappy and Bogdanovist are the ones who keep digging up these little nuggets related to SMAC(X)? Is it that our community just doesn't bother to venture beyond our own forums?

Oh, I'm under the impression that veterans browse a bit in all sections.

	20-05-2005 07:05									#11
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Yeah, I read this article earlier about the new SE and sliders for Civ 4...for me anyway, once idealogies are added into civ, I think I might leave SMAC behind, unfortunately...

	20-05-2005 14:34									#12
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You actually only need two sliders in an x-y fashion, i.e. covering an entire plane.

	20-05-2005 16:12									#13
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Aw, but I want SMAC(X) style government for the next SMAC(X).

	20-05-2005 16:28									#14
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quote: You actually only need two sliders in an x-y fashion, i.e. covering an entire plane.

It is true. But there are exceptions.

For economics SE at SMACX the ends of slider would respectively FM and Planned, but Green is an exception, a version of Planned with different priority.

So there are 2 "Planned" econs:
Planned: priority: industry (growth)
Green: priority: planet

So if we wanted make it into a slider scheme we'd need another slider: "production priority" or seomthing like that.

quote: Aw, but I want SMAC(X) style government for the next SMAC(X).

Yeah, but a bit more complex could be more realistic and more interesting.

	21-05-2005 09:39									#15
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quote: Originally posted by binTravkin It is true. But there are exceptions. For economics SE at SMACX the ends of slider would respectively FM and Planned, but Green is an exception, a version of Planned with different priority. So there are 2 "Planned" econs: Planned: priority: industry (growth) Green: priority: planet So if we wanted make it into a slider scheme we'd need another slider: "production priority" or seomthing like that.

Hm, perhaps assign numerical values to a set of objectives, so they don't add up to, say, +1 or +2? Initially you can't assign more than +/- 1 to any one of them, with new discoveries relaxing such a restriction. The exception if you have an immunity to something, such as efficiency, you can't assign a negative value to it.

This will be a more flexible SE model. This is another way of leveling the playing field by giving new players a higher total.

	23-05-2005 14:45									#16
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quote: Hm, perhaps assign numerical values to a set of objectives, so they don't add up to, say, +1 or +2? Initially you can't assign more than +/- 1 to any one of them, with new discoveries relaxing such a restriction. The exception if you have an immunity to something, such as efficiency, you can't assign a negative value to it. This will be a more flexible SE model. This is another way of leveling the playing field by giving new players a higher total.

Ever played Europa Universalis 2?
Try it - exact model of what you describe here.

	23-05-2005 15:06									#17
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Nope, can't say I have

	24-05-2005 08:29									#18
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Well this has got to be good news for modders of any TBS game!
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...threadid=133923

I guess if the SDK is good enough to allow crawlers to be modded in from scratch, then a fan made SMAC(X) 2 has got to be possible!