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Modo44
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in western Poland
Jul 2004
time: 06:35
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quote:
Originally posted by Grandpa Troll
#1-Your fixing to be over run in a game, absolutely no chance to survive let alone win.
Do you think its ethical to disband cities? |
Yes, no problem, except if agreed otherwise before starting the game.
quote:
Originally posted by Grandpa Troll
#2-You are in a game and agree to be nice and not attack but first chance you get you:
Attack the person whom had given you a break by not wiping yer sorry arse out some turns earlier.
Is this ethical? |
In a diplogame (i.e. roleplaying): You play as your civ would. If you are good people, you will not do it. If your leader is a crazy maniac, you can do this.
In a normal PBEM: Of course. You play to win, by whatever means.
quote:
Originally posted by Grandpa Troll
#3-You tell in so many words your gonna be an ally with someone but decide that your better suited to survive by taking your knife and sticking it deeply between you buddies shoulder blades.
Is this ethical? |
In a diplogame (i.e. roleplaying): You play as your civ would. If you are good people, you will not do it. If your leader is a crazy maniac, you can do this.
In a normal PBEM: Any time it suits you. You play to win, by whatever means.
quote:
Originally posted by Grandpa Troll
#4-Your an ally with a person in a game and are helping them and then you find that your so called ally has been bogoerting (holding back) technology advance from you.
Is this ethical since your supposed to be watching each others back? |
This has been done extensively throughout human history. This is diplomacy at work. Get used to... well... getting used.
As far as I know, all those acts have happened in human history in one fashion or another. Desperate and/or power-hungry leaders have been known to order worse things done...
Of course players will remember how you behave, so it is not like you can really get away with things they regard as unethical...
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Aqualung71
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Lord Desolator of the Desolation Row, C3CDG
Oct 2002
time: 12:35
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Gramps, I assume from the nature of this thread that you must have been on the receiving end of some of these deeds recently. Either that, or you're looking for moral validation before putting them into practice yourself 
To your questions:
quote:
Originally posted by Grandpa Troll
#1-Your fixing to be over run in a game, absolutely no chance to survive let alone win.
Do you think its ethical to disband cities? |
No. Though this is a tough one, since once a player starts to fall behind it is often no longer fun for them. The choice for the remaining players is either keep the reluctant player in the game (and thus reduce the turn rate to once a week since he or she is no longer interested), or allow the player to disband remaining cities (assuming their is a choice!). A better alternative is to find a replacement player - granted, quite difficult under such circumstances. Overall though, one player abandoning all their cities can unbalance the game.
quote:
#2-You are in a game and agree to be nice and not attack but first chance you get you:
Attack the person whom had given you a break by not wiping yer sorry arse out some turns earlier.
Is this ethical? |
No. But it happens regularly and the possibility of your magnanimity and benevolence coming back to bite you should be factored into the original decision to not wipe out his sorry arse some turns earlier 
quote:
#3-You tell in so many words your gonna be an ally with someone but decide that your better suited to survive by taking your knife and sticking it deeply between you buddies shoulder blades.
Is this ethical? |
No. Players should be careful not to agree to alliances if they feel there may be a need to attack their ally while the alliance is still in force. Generally alliances should be negotiated for a set number of turns, then renegotiated. I generally favour a stepping down in relations rather than a sneak attack on turn 21 of a 20-turn alliance. For example, if you don't wish to extend the alliance, an agreed period of non-aggression would be the ethical thing to do, after which it's gloves off!
quote:
#4-Your an ally with a person in a game and are helping them and then you find that your so called ally has been bogoerting (holding back) technology advance from you.
Is this ethical since your supposed to be watching each others back? |
Yes. Or rather, the premise is unrealistic. Specifically, tech-trading alliances are usually predicated on the value of the techs being exchanged. More valuable techs usually require cash top up, or multiple tech in exchange. Since different players research at different speeds due to a vast number of factors (empire size, population, extent of tiles improved, proximity of rivers and resources, happiness, economic and happiness based improvements, etc), it is unrealistic to expect the faster researchers to share their techs at the same pace as slower researchers. Therefore it is only natural for one player to move ahead of the other in technology. It is therefore perfectly acceptable to "hold back" techs from the ally, on the basis that the ally just can't afford to pay for the tech.
In other situations, I believe it is reasonable to hold back certain techs for strategic reasons (such as a resource or UU enabling tech, a government tech, a specifically useful optional tech such as Literature, etc).
In conclusion, while I believe the game should be played in a broadly ethical way, we are all out to win. And in the end, as the saying goes, there can be only one!
Last edited by Aqualung71 on 06-06-2005 at 14:16
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Krill
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On a cold wet rock, in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean.
Dec 2003
time: 05:35
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Yeah, Modo, me and Ormuzd are the only members on our team, and we discuss things via chat, play the save via chat etc. Your time zone would fit in perfectly if you want to join.
---
quote:
#1-Your fixing to be over run in a game, absolutely no chance to survive let alone win.
Do you think its ethical to disband cities? |
Depends. I would not disband cities just to leave the game, but if I was being attacked, I don't have any qualms about disbanding the city and retreating to a more defensible position.
quote:
#2-You are in a game and agree to be nice and not attack but first chance you get you attack the person whom had given you a break by not wiping yer sorry arse out some turns earlier.
Is this ethical? |
Again depends. I probably would not do it unless I was in a tight spot, for example if our capitals could be only a few tiles apart I would not hesitate to pull the trigger.
quote:
#3-You tell in so many words your gonna be an ally with someone but decide that your better suited to survive by taking your knife and sticking it deeply between you buddies shoulder blades.
Is this ethical? |
No, it is not ethical, but it is understandable. Play to win, and all that...
quote:
#4-Your an ally with a person in a game and are helping them and then you find that your so called ally has been bogoerting (holding back) technology advance from you.
Is this ethical since your supposed to be watching each others back? |
Depends. It is not ethical to not be told your partner is holding tech back, however, but your partner may be hlding tech out to keep the tech cost high for your opponents etc.
Last edited by Krill on 06-06-2005 at 21:44
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ormuzd
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I would never break a promise I have made
I know it is stupid to stay "never" but at least I try and I have never done it so far. That's why I hate these thigs so much. Winning is good, trust, respect and enjoyment are everything
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Soltz
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#1 - yes, as a strategy to avoid the attacker from getting a benefit. Otherwise, I'll stay til the bitter end.
For the others, I would say no but, we are dealing with the human race here!
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06-06-2005 06:10
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