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sammy1339
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United Nations
Oct 2003
time: 00:36
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I have noticed that everybody has a lot of complaints about the AI (its misuse of air units, its misuse of terraformers, its non-use of supply crawlers) but nobody has any ideas about how to fix it. Does anybody know where the AI is programmed in the game, and possibly how to edit it?
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Commy
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St. Louis, MO, USA
Mar 2004
time: 05:36
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One thing that I have tried with some success is eliminating SE...
No faction gets any benifits that apply to SE, with
two exceptions....all factions get +2 economy and +2 support...otherwise only free facilities or extra talents, or possibly free prototypes...also, no faction recieves disadvantages either...
You can go into the game rules file and change all the benifits of each SE setting to zero...also, it is important to go into each AI text file and make sure that they don't favor any particular SE setting, because they might waste energy on an SE setting that gives no benefits...
The benefits I gave the original factions when I did this are...
Gaians--+1 nutrient in fungus square, mindworm police (you can do this in SMAX), free rec tanks
Hive--Free perimeter defenses, free non-lethal police special ability to all units after discovery of intellectual integrity (SMAX), one less drone all bases
University--Free Network Nodes, choose one additional tech, get tech that is discovered by three other factions that are infiltrated (SMAX)
Morgans--Bonus from trade from treaties and pacts, start with 100 energy, free energy banks...
Spartans--Free prototypes, free command centers, start game with speeder instead of scout infantry
Believers--+25% to all combat, both defensive and offensive, free polymorphic encryption all units (represents mind control) from beginning of game (I think thats how I did it)
Peacekeepers--free talent every 4 citizens, free rec commons all bases
Balancing may still be necessary for this, but you get the idea...
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sammy1339
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United Nations
Oct 2003
time: 00:36
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I'm not clear on why SE hurts the AI, but if so, it would be better to make the AI smarter about SE instead of disabling it, which is what I was saying. I know it would be a difficult job to edit the AI, but I wanted to know if anybody knew where the AI actually was located so that it might be possible.
Incidentally, if you change the faction text files so that factions don't feel the negative effects of their preferred SE choice, or do so less (e.g. Morgan gets Robust: Police), will that make the AI more likely to use those choices? And why don't you think the AI can handle having innate SE bonuses and penalties?
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Cataphract887
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cmn is someone you have whip up a map to make it a chalange to play on,for PBEMs.the fact the ai needs huge bonuses just further proves its stupidity however.
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Kirov
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Warsaw, Poland
Sep 2002
time: 06:36
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Isn't it: Creator + Moderator + Narrator?
binTravkin, sure you can give AI various bonuses that boost their power, but they still will be... well, somewhat dumb. And you never need to come up with smart ideas to beat them.
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cal_01
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I have to agree with this. I once allied with the Pirates to fight against the drones, but I never saw the Pirates attack -once-. There also seems to be a big bug in the AI concerning wars against other factions on another continent or just on another landmass with a body of water between them.
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Kirov
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Warsaw, Poland
Sep 2002
time: 06:36
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I've never thought about changing priorities instead of bonuses, will have to try it out soon.
I also wonder if it is possible to make Ai's build forests or boreholes... Any ideas?
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PJayTycy
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quote:
I also wonder if it is possible to make Ai's build forests or boreholes... Any ideas? |
If you make that the only 2 possible terraforming options (IE: put farms/solars/mines at trancendent thought or something).
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Cataphract887
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quote:
Originally posted by binTravkin
But it does not need huge bonuses.
If you want I can create an AI intelligent enough to popboom and build more bases not mil units and facilities.
Im sure it will not be easy to beat it.
The most obvious thing in AIs stupidity is it's preset stupid ideology. It is of course characteristic for Mim to take Fundy, but no human player would do it.
If you instead modify her BELIEVE.txt like:
code:
Politics, Democratic, INDUSTRY
Values, Knowledge, nil
changes bolded
You have a nice Demo/Planned/Wealth running Mim which will have a mineral row of 0.7 * 0.8 = round(5.6) = 6 and will popboom as soon as get to Eth Calc -> Creches.
You can also set her priorities to Build and Explore and he will have Eth Calc as about the 3rd - 5th tech.
It also means she will be more willing to build Creches as the "build" and "explore" values for Creche are high.
Voila!
What you got is Believers which will be really hard to beat if they land near Monsoon and quite competitive in a usual/normal start position.
They will also rarely trade tech with you as they're Believers.
Last time I tried such setup and put Mim on Monsoon she was popbooming before me (as Lal).
True, it was not like me - popboom in about 80% of bases, but the popboom went on through entire game.
Sometimes a newly founded base had to build Hab complex after some 10-12 turns.
And her 6-3-1s streaming like some hellish swarm were very hard to beat indeed. Only when I got to choppers I got an upper hand in combat.
And talking about choppers - If I had given her either AAA ability for free or ACs for free or both I had never had such sucess with choppers as well.
And if I gave her the ECM ability my rovers before MMI would be overhelmed.
And if you say those are huge bonuses, you've mistaken.
A normal human player uses 5-1-2 and 1-3+-2 in his attacks. And the "+" comes at no cost, so if I gave it Mim at no cost it would be practically the same. |
so with:
the SE changes you mentioned
build and explore
then miriam would be a challange? 
and also, with a 100% combat + vs air units,and a 50%+ combat vs rovers,in addition to whatever ups+ miriram put on extra,thats not a very big advantage?
quote:
And if you say those are huge bonuses, you've mistaken. |
i didnt say the bonus you listed were huge.i was reffering to the ones in such as the ''solstice ai'' challance mart topped a week ago. those bonuses and starts,given to humans,would be garranteed loss for the PK.
Last edited by Cataphract887 on 11-06-2005 at 04:43
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sammy1339
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United Nations
Oct 2003
time: 00:36
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Yes, I do find that changing the AI's social priorities can be helpful. However, I think that if the game encourages a player to make a choice other than his faction's natural preference that's more a fault in the SE choices, not the AI. In particular I disagree with your statement that no human player would play fundy with Miriam. I do, and I have squashed people that way. However I think it's true that Deirdre usually best chooses planned and Morgan best chooses Green, so I modified my rules such that this was not so. I also find that giving Deirdre Green, EFFIC instead of Green, PLANET makes her play Democratic politics. In addition to that I make the ai choices 1,1,1,1 for Santiago and Yang, 1,1,0,1 for Miriam, and 0,1,1,1 for everybody else. I find this produces the best play.
Yet none of this prevents the AI from stockpiling colony pods or from making egregiously stupid terraforming choices or from failing to attack with air units or from building piles of useless military units that choke up all its production or from not rushing projects or from not pursuing important technologies or from building loads of military units while not developing infrastructure because somebody on another continent took a potshot at their former 30 turns ago.
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zsozso
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of Chiron
Oct 1999
time: 00:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Kirov
Fundie is great, but you have to know how to use it, which is one thing AI sucks at. AI-Miriam setting Fundie usually means just she will hopelessly lag behind in research forever...  |
That's exactly a mind-set question. If anybody (be it AI or human) plays Miriam, he/she/it should not try to gain techs by research - that's a builder strategy, not suitable for Miriam. When you are Miriam, you are supposed to gain technologies by stealing them rather than researching them! I.e. use Fundy to make strong probe teams and catch up with tech without spending resources on research. Just think about the saving in ECs and minerals if you don't allocate ECs to research (all to economy, or maybe some to psych) and don't waste minerals on research boosting base facilities.
In terms of bad SE choices, I see the AI often trying to balance out things so that no measures are too deeply negative. While this maybe a nice ideal, it lacks purpose. Humans will more focus in certain short term goals at a time, e.g. when you need to get a certain tech quick, you will max out research even at the cost of other things (police, ecology, morale etc.) going deep negative. On the other hand if you are planning an invasion, you will max-out morale at the cost of industry, research etc. The problem with the AI is that it is lacking such a campaign-style focused settings. It does everything in a react-ve manner, i.e. if it has problems with something than it may try to fix it, but it will never "think ahead" and purposely set SE choices or unit/facility production in order to reach a specific short term goal more efficiently.
This is because the AI is lost in the details , each city and unit makes decisions in isolation rather than being directed by global strategic decisions. That's the same reason why it does not make well planned, coordinated attacks.
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Kirov
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Warsaw, Poland
Sep 2002
time: 06:36
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zsozso, I meant exactly what you said: that problems with research are the _only_ effect of AI believers running Fundie. She will not use Probes to catch up with research, use Morale bonus to her advantage, and so on.
If I set Fundie, I definitely don't use it to pursue Builder tactics.
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08-06-2005 01:24
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