21-06-2005 00:57									#1
	Moo Remake in a different Way Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

I am a software engineer, although I write business software, I have been playing Masters of Orion, since the first version, along with all of the Civ games. Anyway to my point:

One of my recent projects required a new e-mail driven database front-end to be written, basically the ability for the database to receive e-mails and act on them, and then e-mail reports based on results or other triggers.

This made me think of a game idea, and Masters of Orion popped into my head. Please let me know what you all would think of a game like this.

I would use this new e-mail front-end I wrote and write a Game back-end to it based on the Moo series (Moo2 specifically sine IMHO it was the best). Except instead of a turn based game change the game into a semi-real time game. All game elements would be pushed through e-mail or a web-based control panel. Let’s say a normal turn of Moo2 would take 24 hours, when your race finished a tech, an e-mail would be generated to let you know the new tech, its benefits, and what new techs you can research next. A default selection would be made, and you could reply to the message with the new research topic, or let the system continue on with the default selection. Or you could go out to the website, and login, and be presented with a snap shot of where your empire is at, and you would have the option of changing techs there.

Other examples of how play would work:

When you build a ship, an e-mail is sent with a graphic of all of the options for where it can go. You can then reply to the e-mail and give it a destination. The ship will then head off to that system. When it arrives a new message is sent letting you know what was discovered at the new location. Ship locations, and commands would be available from the web interface as well.

Colony management would happen similarly, when an improvement was completed an email would inform you of it, and ask for new orders, or if the colony grew, you would be informed of where the system placed the worker (scientist, or farmer) and you could move it if you wished. All colony based e-mails would come with a current report of what the system was producing, food status, production status, etc.

After playing a few of the democracy games over in the Civilizations forums it has occurred to me that people are interested in games that may take weeks or months to play, and those types of games allow for unique game play styles as well. With the e-mail based front-end people could play with a minimum time requirement of replying to an e-mail, or be more involved by utilizing the web-based reports. Game play would continue even if 1 of the players dropped out and stopped playing.

The overall vision would be to make a larger version of the game to allow for more than 8 players, and much larger universes. Maybe even new Tech trees and other.

But before I put all the work into the game side of it, I thought I would do some research and find out if you at Apolyton would think that this is something I should pursue, or scrap it as a dumb Idea.

Please let me know your thoughts. All suggestions or criticisms are welcome.

	21-06-2005 14:40									#2
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I know that many moo2-freaks like the tactical combat.
99.99% of the kali games are with tactical combat on.

IMO it is surely the best part of moo2.

I think a strategy game should have such tactical elements. Like moo2 or......chess.

But your email-idea sounds like a pure strategy game.

So I wouldnt be interested in your game. But of course thats just a matter of taste.

There are games similar to moo2 without any tactical combat. (forthcoming galciv2 fe)

	22-06-2005 00:43									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Let’s say a normal turn of Moo2 would take 24 hours

Sounds like a Browsergame.

I´m also not interrestet is such "long" games !


If u wanna design a better game than moo2.

Just Copie it and Improve it with new Graphics and further Options.

I think Increasing number of selectable techs and race attributes will also be a good idea.

	22-06-2005 12:48									#4
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Battles are the best . No battles = no fun!
An email based game is a bad idea :\
PK

	22-06-2005 23:14									#5
	Tired of ads?

Well, if game would automatically read the mail and delivery time would be like few seconds, its not that bad idea... Email can have large attachments and so only a few mails needed to start game, so making game played faster than in Kali.

I like this how many people are remaking moo2 I have some tough competition and possibly much fun playing them in the future...

	22-06-2005 23:49									#6
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

I like it.

Bring it on

	23-06-2005 00:41									#7
	Suffering from ads?

The idea of being able to play the game exclusively by e-mail sounds interesting. But, how would you go about the interface? Because sending and receiving numerous e-mails each day (this is what your description tells me so far, at least if one tried to play the game onyl by e-mail) seems much worse that opening a game to play, and then send, one turn...

I think you are going to need a web-based (or other client-side) interface (yes, I know you said that ), and it will probably be the dominant one. In the end, I suppose the e-mails might become what they are in web-based MMORPGs — notifications, nothing more.

What looks promising, though, is the ability for the interface to handle e-mail communication between players (instead of Alt-Tabbing, which is tiresome). Can this be achieved without the need for a server?

Hey, did the Civ4 information not mention something alike, but with a server?

	23-06-2005 00:53									#8
	Put an end to popups!

could two factions be notified about having to meet on line and play out a fight...

gotta sooth the blood lust

	23-06-2005 01:11									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Thank you for the responses so far.

I am thinking from the responses that this might be viable, but enhance the version I had in my mind.

I like the Tactical combat of Moo2 as well, and would hate to loose that completely. (A message saying "Your Fleet was attacked and lost the battle" seems like kind of a downer.) I have an idea for that, what about simplifying the battle to the Civilization style, so instead of controling each weapon and system of each unit, you would give each unit a command to attack, retreat or stay put. After both sides' choices were made, the battle would take place Civ style? This would still allow some of the dynamics of Tactical combat, without going to the extreme of having both people having to enter into an on-line game at the same time. (I am concerned about time zones and trying to work out how battles could take place between players on oposite sides of the globe, without using the "You lost the battle" type of reports.)

Also I am thinking that e-mails would be "notification" style, but each would allow a choice via a reply, so that if you were at work, you could still set the destination of a ship, or change tech research, without having to open up a game on your work system.

So far in my testing I can send up to a 5 page report with full galaxy graphic and planetary layouts all in under a 100k attachment.

My e-mail front-end for the company I wrote it for, so far has been tested with up to 100 e-mails per hour, fully processing those e-mails, and sending reply's within 30 seconds of receiving the message. At this point the back end system is a SQL server, but an MSDE engine would also suffice for those wanting to run their own servers. Although I can see the potential of running a significant number of games on a single server, and possibly being controled al-la MMOG style.

	23-06-2005 01:13									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Platypus Rex could two factions be notified about having to meet on line and play out a fight... gotta sooth the blood lust

and sinking grog

	23-06-2005 02:32									#11
	Increase Your PM Length

Sounds interesting but...I have never played MOO
(I like the sound though MOOOOO )


What's it like then?

	23-06-2005 04:08									#12
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I think you should all check out the game in my sig


This sounds very cool though, i'd play..

	23-06-2005 10:21									#13
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

This is a incredible idea! As a programmer (still trying to graduate myself), I can start to imagine the difficulties involved. Maybe you can make a scratch on a paper, to divide this - project - in things like creative team, who do tech three interface, planets design, Ships stats, combat rules, those kinds of things, and Design team, who think in how to put the crazy creative team ideas to work in a mail game.

24 real-life hours for a turn is great too! You can make governors if no mail is received with turn strats, just not to everything collapses if somethings cut down a player computer. Maybe with some beta-testing, this can be extended to 48 hours or 72 hours.

	23-06-2005 21:42									#14
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Moo2 is turn driven not event driven.
Think of the the Start Craft Zerg wave attack, this is how I see the out come of event driven moo2. I could be wrong but I think a Fuedal Tol WarLord would over whelm a tech advantage with a huge fleet line. This becomes a game similair to an old C64 game "Imperium Galactium" but event driven not turn based. I think there are probably some good event driven games you could create with your email response mechinism but I do not think moo2 is one of them.

	23-06-2005 22:57									#15
	Full PM-box? Change here!

I have decided to persue the creation of this game.

For all of those wishing to stay updated with this game please bookmark the following location for news, and forum discussions.

http://moo2remake.blogspot.com/

	17-07-2005 13:22									#16
	Re: Moo Remake in a different Way Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Earthworm One of my recent projects required a new e-mail driven database front-end to be written, basically the ability for the database to receive e-mails and act on them, and then e-mail reports based on results or other triggers.

Wouldn't that be an open invitation to trojans?

	17-07-2005 15:59									#17
	Increase Your PM Length

Applications, unlike users can be trained to *not* open email attachements named "anna kournikova naked.jpg.exe"

That said, security still has to be addressed somehow.

	18-07-2005 22:15									#18
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Bongo is correct, the application only acts on programmed key words within the e-mail. It does not execute attached .bat files, or other attachments, and only executes those commands that I have programmed it to understand. So the system remains secure, especially since the only access users see is the e-mail, there is no direct access to the base database by the users.

It is even more secure than a client software package.

	20-07-2005 05:53									#19
	Put an end to popups!

Some trojans and viruses don't even need to use attachments anymore. Some need only an active preview window. The code could also attack smtp or even use its own email engine.
(I'm a network engineer, not a hacker/cracker. )