05-07-2005 04:14									#1
	Some thoughts on maintenance costs Put an end to popups!

I was just thinking about the maintenance systems in the various CIV games. I remember being really frustrated with the way that in Civ I and II that a city could only support a certain number of units, and then thinking this was great when it was made a civilization level support function. The downside to this was that a civilization could support a huge standing army while not adversely impacting those cities that did the bulk of the manufacturing.

So, my thought is that maybe it would be best to integrate these 2 ideas, not just for units but for city improvements as well. Let's face it, in ancient and medieval history there were very few civilizations with truly functional central governments. Most civilizations were conglomerations of city states ruled by a titular head, but functionally run by district goverors.

What if early in the game you could only build units or improvements that could be supported by the city's ability to generate the tax revenue to pay the upkeep (similar to Civ I and II) and then later on, after some technological advancement that you then move to the civilization level support like Civ 3, where even a garbage city can produce a manufacturing plant as long as the rest of the Civ picks up the slack. This would also be a possible incentive to choose the feudal form of government. Perhaps feudalism could reduce maintenance costs for city improvements and unit support (perhaps at a detriment to research) thereby making it a desirable government in the mid game, but ultimately useless by the end game.

Any thoughts? Maybe someone with some XML skill can mod this in.

	05-07-2005 04:23									#2
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quote: The downside to this was that a civilization could support a huge standing army while not adversely impacting those cities that did the bulk of the manufacturing.

Downside?

	06-07-2005 15:20									#3
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they have done away with building maintenance costs in C4

alot of good info here

http://civilization4.net/

	06-07-2005 18:09									#4
	Re: Some thoughts on maintenance costs Put an end to popups!

quote: Originally posted by Stile4aly Let's face it, in ancient and medieval history there were very few civilizations with truly functional central governments. Most civilizations were conglomerations of city states ruled by a titular head, but functionally run by district goverors.

Not sure that's quite accurate, but the idea is valid nonetheless. You could justify it in another way by saying the economies were mostly local, even if the control was central.

quote: Originally posted by Stile4aly Any thoughts? Maybe someone with some XML skill can mod this in.

I would be pretty surprised (and impressed) if this could be implemented just by changing some of the XML files.

In a similar vein, perhaps you start out initially in the home city-supported-by-production mode of civ1 with units. At some point, with a change in government or discovery of technology, you get the ability to support units with gold. At some later point, with a change in government or discovery of technology, you get the ability to decouple units from their home city. After all, most military units were regional until quite recently. As I recall, in the American Civil War, many units were composed of soldiers from the same state, and even the same town. I've read the same about other countries and other armies.

	06-07-2005 19:43									#5
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Make it dependent on the govt choices.

	06-07-2005 20:06									#6
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modding the game is not the answer. ah, this is going to make multiplayer all but worthless

	06-07-2005 20:14									#7
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Interesting that modding as a solution has come up even before the game release.