08-07-2005 03:45									#1
	What gameplay features would you have liked to have seen that did not make it in? Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

From the information available so far, Civ 4 looks close to perfect (of course, that may change, but this is the impression I am under from the released information) in terms of gameplay features. Nevertheless, I am wondering if there are features that did not make it into the game that people would have liked to have seen.

For me personally only two major new features that did not make it would have been really nice to have:

1) Supply system for units - just about any implementation of this would do so long as there was the possibility of cutting off the supply.

2) Demographics - population growth based on birth rates, death rates and migration - not directly dependent on food supply but merely limited by it

Two modifications of existing systems would also have been nice:

1) Resources of the same type to provide benefits to your economy beyond 1 resource

2) Possibility of blocading trade of other civilizations - this is technically possible in Civ 3, but it would be nice to make it easier


It is technically possible that some of these have made it into Civ 4 but it is highly unlikely. Given the considerable amount of info about the game that has been released we would most likely have heard about these features already if they were in the game. Honestly, I am happy with the way Civ 4 is shaping out to be and this is more of a fantasy wishlist than anythign else. Moreover, it is possible that some of these may either make it into the game in an expansion or it may be possible to mod them into the game.

	08-07-2005 03:53									#2
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From what we know about the modding capabilities, it will be possible to add things such as supply and demographics! I'm not sure I really like the idea of supply, though, especially since it would be hard for the AI to cope with, but I'm sure Civ4 will be great as it is.

	08-07-2005 04:01									#3
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quote: Originally posted by Solver From what we know about the modding capabilities, it will be possible to add things such as supply and demographics! I'm not sure I really like the idea of supply, though, especially since it would be hard for the AI to cope with, but I'm sure Civ4 will be great as it is.

Yeah, I purposefully did not mention how to implement supply, since I would be open to almost any system, however simplified, so long as the supply is 'cutable'. The biggest item on my wishlist would indeed be demographics, though, more so than supply.

	08-07-2005 04:15									#4
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Well, even without an actual supply system, you can cut your enemy's supply in a way by sending a raiding party to his cities, pillaging his tiles and disrupting his plans .

	08-07-2005 06:50									#5
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i want a spherical map, dammit.

	08-07-2005 07:30									#6
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- Minigames, lots of minigames. Blackjack, dance, dance revolution, you name it...

- It would have been cool if spearmen had the ability to carjack tanks.

	08-07-2005 07:40									#7
	Re: What gameplay features would you have liked to have seen that did not make it in? Suffering from ads?

quote: Originally posted by Roman 2) Demographics - population growth based on birth rates, death rates and migration - not directly dependent on food supply but merely limited by it

Agreed, though they've apparently taken a small step forward with the introduction of 'health'. Food positively affects health, while pollution negatively affects health.

quote: 1) Resources of the same type to provide benefits to your economy beyond 1 resource

I would've liked to see quantities attached to all tradeable resources. Each source would provide a certain quantity of a resource. The larger your empire and size of cities, the more of a resource you would need. That's what I would have liked, rather than the 'one resource supplies the entire civ' system.

	08-07-2005 10:09									#8
	Re: Re: What gameplay features would you have liked to have seen that did not make it in? Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by Xorbon Agreed, though they've apparently taken a small step forward with the introduction of 'health'. Food positively affects health, while pollution negatively affects health.

Indeed a small but welcome step.

quote: I would've liked to see quantities attached to all tradeable resources. Each source would provide a certain quantity of a resource. The larger your empire and size of cities, the more of a resource you would need. That's what I would have liked, rather than the 'one resource supplies the entire civ' system.

Yes, this would certainly be one way to do it. I was deliberately vague, since I would be satisfied with just about anything that makes extra resources give you benefits so that there is a tradeoff between trading and not trading the resource away. Perhaps something as simple as a +1 bonus to shields for buildings & units that require the resource for each extra resource beyond the first would suffice.

	08-07-2005 12:01									#9
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does anyone know if you can mine grasslands in civ4? This is a feature I hope does NOT make it in. I really hated that about civ3. It looks ugly. And worse, you almost have to do it to win.

I drive down North Carolina, and I don't see mines every few miles...

Yeah I know, it probably could have been modded out in civ3. But modding the game in such a way takes away all your high scores.

	08-07-2005 12:02									#10
	Re: Re: What gameplay features would you have liked to have seen that did not make it Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

quote: Originally posted by Xorbon Agreed, though they've apparently taken a small step forward with the introduction of 'health'. Food positively affects health, while pollution negatively affects health. I would've liked to see quantities attached to all tradeable resources. Each source would provide a certain quantity of a resource. The larger your empire and size of cities, the more of a resource you would need. That's what I would have liked, rather than the 'one resource supplies the entire civ' system.

does pollution really negatively affect health?

We are living longer today than we ever have.

medical care affects health, not pollution.

	08-07-2005 15:11									#11
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quote: Originally posted by Dissident does anyone know if you can mine grasslands in civ4? This is a feature I hope does NOT make it in. I really hated that about civ3. It looks ugly. And worse, you almost have to do it to win. I drive down North Carolina, and I don't see mines every few miles... Yeah I know, it probably could have been modded out in civ3. But modding the game in such a way takes away all your high scores.

I hope it's out...

I modded Civ3 to avoid this, but it does change a lot (cities gets more food and less shields)

	08-07-2005 15:40									#12
	Re: Re: Re: What gameplay features would you have liked to have seen that did not mak Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Dissident does pollution really negatively affect health?

Don't get me started.

	08-07-2005 16:11									#13
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* DeathByTheSword tries to get geo started by poking him with a pollotion-health debate stick

	08-07-2005 16:17									#14
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* GeoModder pollutes DBTS with some recently forbidden phalates.

	08-07-2005 16:36									#15
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:tongue :

anyways the one thing that i am still not sure of if it is in or out...are armies...a la ctp...not exactly like that...but some thing like combining different weapons a lot cooler then one unit against one..

	08-07-2005 18:27									#16
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Civil wars.

Thats all I think I want.

	08-07-2005 18:59									#17
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Errrrm, one thing I'd definitely love to have back in is the demographics screen - you know, that screen where you could get some statistical info about your civ...

I have attached a screenshot of that window from the original civ. Believe it or not, I was so taken by the game that I event took notes of the values on that screen every x turns, and made charts out of them to see the progression.

Along with additional notes like when which wonder was built, I could actually see in my charts how wonders or technologies affected my demographics

...I really do miss that feature. There is something like that in CIV3, but only when you win or retire.

Attachment: demographics.gif
This has been downloaded 105 time(s).

	08-07-2005 19:22									#18
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quote: Originally posted by AeonOfTime ...I really do miss that feature. There is something like that in CIV3, but only when you win or retire.

It's on the 'top 5 cities screen' (hit F11 ingame)

	08-07-2005 20:36									#19
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Demographics if it is not in, but why shouldnçt it be included? It was in Civ1, 2 and 3.

	08-07-2005 20:41									#20
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But it's time for a more advanced demographics screen, I want it to show charts

	08-07-2005 20:52									#21
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Perhaps Firaxis has some features to surprise us. If they release all the data of the game, we would lose some of the surprise factor.

	08-07-2005 20:58									#22
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quote: @el freako: It's on the 'top 5 cities screen' (hit F11 ingame)

You gotta be kidding!

I'll have to check that out tonight... I can't believe I have been playing Civ3 since it came out and always wondered why they did not include that.

	08-07-2005 21:13									#23
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Always check out if there's some unexplained shortcuts in the F# keys

	08-07-2005 23:26									#24
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quote: Originally posted by GeoModder Don't get me started.

*poke*

	08-07-2005 23:43									#25
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But we're getting off topic, which is the main reason of not getting started.

	11-07-2005 13:34									#26
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quote: @Adagio: Always check out if there's some unexplained shortcuts in the F# keys

Now that's something I'll definitely do everywhere from now on... Found the demographics screen, thanks for the tip - now I'm off again, I have to get my data sheets back out again to make some charts

quote: @Adagio: But it's time for a more advanced demographics screen, I want it to show charts

That would be even better, though

	12-07-2005 01:43									#27
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I want spies to be able to plant, nukes, chem, and posigon the water supply.

But the game figures spys are to controversial to have in the game I guess.

	12-07-2005 01:58									#28
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Trade routes running over the map.
With everything that follows from that: pirates, blockades, useful navies...

	12-07-2005 12:47									#29
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quote: Originally posted by pmaura I want spies to be able to plant, nukes, chem, and posigon the water supply. But the game figures spys are to controversial to have in the game I guess.

I never thought of them as being controversial. Although after 9/11 maybe so.

But gameplay wise I don't like them. Because I don't like having my own cities nuked . being nuked sucks

	12-07-2005 13:56									#30
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quote: @Dissident: being nuked sucks

I agree, but the nuker better be well defended lest he be run over by my hordes of really angry 'glow in the dark' (tm) troops :->

I never really used spies, as I deemed them rather useless - I don't use nukes because I'm basically a nice guy and would feel bad about it, I don't poison water supplies either for the same reason, and those other things like sabotaging production are too much of a hassle (and really only useful when you want to stop production of a wonder)...